Primiera

Ozzy, after a bit of practice, the key in getting 5AB (D) > 2B > 5C > 5B etc. lies solely on the delay from the initial 2B > 5C. You can delay the 5C an insanely long time, compared to her standard 5B > 5C delay in her corner combos. I found the combo afterwards extremely consistent so long as you let them drop enough after the 2B.

I'm inconsistent with it too, mainly the final JD. I THINK the key is to delay the 5C chain, and the 5B pick-up. That should allow the opponent to stay low enough for JD to get every hit in.

Thanks for testing! I admit some of those were just what I thought were optimal and I was going to double check them and try to find something better in some situations regardless when I tested for meter gain and damage. That list is still a WIP - not sure how I should organize it. I tried to hit all the applicable starters Chie has like mix-up JBB and 2A, 5A pressure, AoA, CH JB and 5C, and punishers.

I've got a somewhat more complete list I compiled, but I know I'm missing a bunch of stuff, like those jump loops and the good Burst combos. Also, meter and damage values would ideally be in there, which would require doing each combo (not that any of Chie's combos are hard): MIDSCREEN Gives Hard Knockdown; leads into Oki • 5A (AA) > 5A > 5B > 2B > JC > JBB > J8D > 5AB • 5AA > 5B > 2B > 2AB • 5AAA > 236B > 5AA > 5B > 2B > 2AB (croucher only) • 2A > 5AA > 5B > 2B > 2AB (0%@1043) • 5AB-C (FC) > JD > dash 5B > 5C > 5AB • AA 2B > JC > JBB > J8D > 5AB (0%@?) • JAA (air-to-air) > JC > JBB > 5AB • JB (air-to-air + CH) > 5B > 5C > JC > JBB > 8D > 5AB () • JBB > 5AA > 5B > 2B > 2AB (0%@) • JBB > 5AAA > 236B > 5AA > 5B > 2B > 2AB (croucher only) • 5B (CH) > 2D > 2B > 5C > 236B > 5B > JBB > J8D > 5AB (punish combo) • 5B (CH) > 5C > 236B > 5B > 5C > JC > DJ.BB > J.8D > 5AB (anti-air punish combo against Mitsuru's and Yu's BD) • (cross-up Tomoe) JBB > 5AA > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 5B > 2AB • (cross-up Tomoe) JBB > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 236B > 5AA > 5B > 2B > 2AB • Power Charged 236A (FC) > 5B > 2AB > JC > JB > 5C > 44 5C > 5B > 5C > 2DD > 236B > 236B > dash 5C > 5B > 5C > 5AB (0%@4740) • 5AB (AA) > 5C > 5AB • 5C (CH) > dash > 5AA > 5B > 2B > 2AB • 5C (AA) > dash > 5A > 5C > JBB > J8D (must be low to the ground) • 5C (AA + CH) > 5B > 5C > JC > JBB > J8D • 5CD (CH) > 2A > 5C > 5AB • 5DD > 5B > 236B > 5AA > 5B > 2B > 2AB • 2AB > 236236A > 2B > 5C > 236B > 5B > JBB > J8D > 5AB • 214D (FC) > 2B > 5C > 236B > 5B > JBB > J8D (%@) • 214CD (CH) > 5B > 5C > 5AB Damage Focus; not necessarily good positioning • 2A > 5AA > 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 236C • 2A > 5AA > 5B > 5C > 236A > 236B > 236D (croucher only) • 2A > 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 236236A > dash 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D • 2A > 5B > 5C > 236A > 236B > 236236A > dash 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D (croucher only) • 5AB-C (FC) > JD > dash 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 214C (D in Corner) > 236236D (50%@4422) • AA 2B > JC > JBB > J8D > 236B > 236B > 214C > 236236D • JB (CH) > 5B > 5C > JC > JBB > J8D > 236B > 236B > 214C > 236236D • Throw OMC > 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D (50%@3051) • Throw OMC > 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D > 214214D • Throw (CH) > dash 2A > 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D (0%@3147) (works without dashing in the corner, or against Akihiko, Mitsuru, and Yosuke) • Throw (CH) > dash 2A > 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D > 214214D (works without dashing in the corner, or against Akihiko, Mitsuru, and Yosuke) • Throw (CH) > dash 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D (0%@) (works without dashing in the corner, only works against Teddie) • Throw OMC > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D (0%@) (only works against Teddie) • Throw OMC > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D > 214214D (only works against Teddie) • Throw OMB > 5C > 236B > 236B > dash 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%/Burst@4416) • 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A OMB > 5C > 236B > 236B > dash 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%/Burst@5023) • 5B > 2B > 236A > 236B > 236D OMB > 5C > 236B > 236B > dash 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%/Burst@6152, crouching only) • 5B (CH) > 2D > dash 5B > 5C > JC > JBB > J8D > 236B > 236B > 214C > 236236D (50%@5333) • 5B (CH) > 5C > 236B > 5B > 5C > JC > DJ.BB > J.8D > 236B > 236B > 214C > 236236D (anti-air punish combo against Mitsuru's and Yu's BD) • 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 236236A > Dash 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D (50%@4216) • 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 236236A > Dash 5C > 236B > 236B > microdash 5C > Dash 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (100%@5399) • 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 236236A > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D (100%@5718, must be near corner when starting) • 214D (FC) > JC > JB > 5C > 44 5C > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > dash 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@4980) • 214CD (CH) > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 214C > 236236D • 236236C OMC > 2A > 2B > JB > JC > JBB > JC > 236C (100%@4898) • Charged 236A (FC) > 5B > 2AB > JC > JB > 5C > 44 5C > 66 5B > 5C > 44 5C > 66 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > dash 5C > 5B > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@6797) CORNER Gives Hard Knockdown; Leads into Oki • 2A > 5AA > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 5B > 2AB (0%@1722) • 2A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 5AA > 5B > 2B > 2AB (croucher only) • 5B > 5C > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5C > 5AB (0%@) • 5C (CH) > 5B > 5C > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 5AB (0%@) • 5AB-D (FC) > 2B > 5C > Dash 5B > 5C > 2D > JD > 5AB (0%@) • 5BD (CH) > 5B > JC > 8D > 5AB (0%@2671) • JBB > 5B > 5C > 2B > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 5AB (0%@2545) • JBB > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 236B > 5AA > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 5B > 2AB (0%@3374, Crouchers only) Damage Focus; not necessarily good positioning • 2A > 5B > 5C > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5B > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@4000) • 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D (50%@5095) • 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 236236A > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D (100%@5718, Also works near corner) • 5C (CH) > 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5B > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@4756) • 5AB-D (FC) > 5B > 5C > 2D > JD > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D (50%@4720) • 5BD (CH) > 5B > JC > 8D > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D (50%@4722) • 214C (FC) > 236236A > Dash 5C > 5B > 5C > 2D > Backdash 5Cx4 > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5C > 5B > 5C > 214C > 236236D (100%@7432) • 214C > 236236A > 5B > 5C > JC > 8D > 236B > 236B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 236236D (100%@5733) • 214D (FC) > JC > JB > 5C > 44 5C > 66 5B > 5C > 2D > J7D > 236B > 236B > 214C > 236326D (50%@5174) • Charged 236A (FC) > 5B > 2AB > JC > JB > 5C > 2D >[walk back] 5C > 44 5C > 44 5C > 44 5C > 66 5B > 236B > 236B > 5C > 5B > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@7210) • JBB > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D • JBB > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 5B > 236A > 236B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D (crouching only) COMBO NOTES Use an oki combo if you can't kill your opponent. The majority of your combos will end in 2AB or 5AB. Only go into damage if you kill the opponent or put them just shy of death, preferably hitting them outside of Awakening. JC (CH) > JB is more or the less the same starter as a JBB starter, just more damage. You can almost always substitute Skull Cracker 236B with 236AB, 214D with 214CD, and 236D with 236CD > 236D for a bit more damage in a combo. Replacing 236A/B with 236AB gives more extra damage than replacing 214D with 214CD. 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 236B in the corner requires you to wait for the opponent to drop low before you use 5B, then delay both 5C and the cancel into 236B in order to maintain the juggle. 5AB-C > JD > dash can be tricky. It helps to input a JB immediately before landing so you can buffer in the dash without accidentally air-dashing. If you want to go for damage without going for 236236D or 214214D as an ender, typically you'll just end your combo into 236C. 236B > 236B, 236A > 236B on crouchers, and 236A > 236AB for 25 meter are when you can go into a 236D ender, if your hit-stun is still decent on the combo.

Does anyone know the true frame data for Power Charge? The wiki says it's got no start-up or active frames, merely recovery, supposedly completely invincible through-out, but I KNOW I've been hit out of a wake-up 236236A. Anyone know how punishable it is?

To go into 214A~C~A in a combo, you have to either launch with 6C first (IE 5B > 6C > 214A~C~A), your opponent has to be crouching (though 214A~C~B is far better in this situation), or you have to land a CH 214A~C as your starter.

I'd prefer one document, but possibly a new topic for it. As you said, those match-up threads don't get the traffic or attention they need.

Oh crap, I didn't know about that combo. Thanks for the info.

@Colpevole - You can do 214C (FC) > 5B > 5C > backdash 5C > backdash 5C > dash 5B > 5C > 2D > JD into 5AB or 236B > 236B > 236236D for considerably more than just 214C (FC) > 5B > 5C > 2D etc. You end up with 4095 damage and 33 meter gain with a 5AB ender, 6178 damage with a damage ender. You might be able to go a different combo route like a JC starter to get a bit more out of either ender. @Mo - I'm apprehensive about using 214C > 236236A as a punisher because the opponent can Burst after it, negating the 50 meter spent. How much damage does it do?

214C > 236236A > etc, or something different?

To add another question of my own: after 214A~CC, if your opponent doesn't tech immediately so as to try and screw with your timing, what should be done? I know I can pick them up with 2B, but usually when I use a 214A~CC in a combo I've hit-confirmed mid-screen with quite a bit of proration, so if I blue beat it I don't think I get much to work with. I dislike this guessing game so much I'm considering just ending my mid-screens in 5B > 6C > 214A~C~A permanently unless I'm looking to RC 214A~CC. (Also because online 214A~CC is damn inconsistent on 3 bars unless it's a CH)

I'll be honest, I'm not sure, it looked like just j.3D into a small bounce away into further j.D. This is a laughable situation to lose to but I couldn't figure out an answer to it in time.

Hey, sorry about posting this here but there's no proper thread to post this: What the heck can Makoto do against Taokaka? This seems absolutely ridiculous to me. Outside of putting an orb out, it seems damn near impossible to stop her drive attacks to get in, and I won't lie, I lost to a friend who's properly terrible but just spammed Ds and I couldn't figure out an answer. 6A, 5B, 5C, jump up attack after blocking into j.A or airthrow, none of it worked. Without any real long range options, what can Makoto do to a Taokaka going HAM?

It seems like most of her corner combos are going to be the best one with a 5D ender into oki, unless she can kill her opponent. I imagine the other combos just aren't going to be used much at all in most match-ups.

After jumping and when Chie is close to the ground, either after attacking or just from nothing, input 236AB. Chie will glow blue but nothing will come out. At that point you can input another 236B upon landing, or if you were close enough to the ground with your 236AB, plink B into the input after 236AB. If you get Power Charge from 236AB > 236B, you're inputting the whole string too fast OR too slow and you're missing the cancel window completely.

If you go air-to-air with Makoto's j.A, do you do something like j.A > j.A > j.B > dj.B > 623C~D mid-screen? I'm unsure if I should go for j.Cs here. Oh, and in corner combos, 2C > 236A etc, are you supposed to do a late cancel of 2C? I find the opponent drops out of the orb sometimes, and I feel like I have to either cancel 2C later or catch the opponent farther down with 2C.

Yun was easily one of the top 3 characters in SSF4 AE, it was clear the designers went above and beyond to ensure all his tools were more effective than needed. In the 2012 patch, he was toned down in so many ways he's not even considered in the top 10.

@Airk: I see what you mean about GJ combos, but in truth it's a horribly basic combo (in SSF4, not 3S) consisting primarily of f+MK and his Lunge Punch, with a few variations here or there depending on corner and what ender you use to go into oki. @Renvalt: I fear I might have given the wrong impression here. His favorite character in SSF4 is 2012 Yun, who's far from an insta-win character, especially since the nerfs to his dive kick meant it's negative without very good spacing. My friend is not looking to tier whore, nor to stubbornly play one character based solely on character love. He's looking for a character that fits his style and someone he enjoys playing. While his reluctance to go after combo-heavy characters even though he's got the execution for it is perplexing, I respect that and just want to help him find a character that won't disappoint him 1,000 matches down the road.

I'm definitely recommending Hakumen to him, based on recommendations on here and videos seeing his style. However, I'd like to add that his favorite FG character of all time is SSF4 AE Yun; he loves the dive kick, mix-up options, Genei Jin combos, solid pressure/strings. Is there a good backup to Hakumen strictly based on his Yun love? Is Ragna like that? I think Azrael will be up his alley, but until then someone else has gotta suffice if Hakumen turns out poorly. Sorry for asking these questions, but this is important. He couldn't connect with anyone in P4A, and I lament that.

Holy cow, that's quite informative and helpful! I'll see what I can do now that it's showed so clearly.

What's the absolute best oki to get for Makoto? 623C~D oki is decent, (2B, 6B, or 214A~B into attacks, right?) but I'd much rather get some 236A orb oki going on, even if it sacrifices 500-1,000 damage off my combo. I'm unsure how to get it in CSE though; is the only real way to end a corner combo with 2D (level 1) and do 66 236A?

Pretty strong Makoto here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vW4brLpwx24

Should I always use 5B before 5CC in a block string to pull Makoto over? Also, if I go for 5CC > 214AC, what do I do if it gets a CH? Is it confirmable on reaction? If I'm iffy of it getting a CH (but unsure enough that they won't press buttons so 214AA would be risky as well), would you recommend staying at 214AC on block? I'm XBL only, my man.

I'll definitely try that, thanks.

Right now with my newbie Makoto I generally use 2AA 2B 5B jump canceled, and stuff into 5CC like 2B > 5CC or 6A > 5B > 5CC as my strings. No matter what if I go into 5CC on block against a certain player he mashes 2A and I don't know what to do (except a risky 5D, which DOES work but I don't like risky frame traps), and also I find it nigh impossible to stagger pressure with 2A at all if they mash 2A. To top it all off 5CC > 6B is trading with mash 2A. I don't blame the guy I'm fighting, it's working for him and until I step up my strings it's my bad. I don't know where to put this in. 2A > delayed 5CC? 2A > 66 > 5CC? Also, what can I get off of a CH 5CC mid-screen?