Hecatom

Pandora?

How so, they are just glorified finishers that can only be done one the last round when the opponent is low on health.

I am glad you liked it Astrals are lame, IK as they are on GGX ownwards are ok, if they even decide to change it, they need to make it like the Fatal K.O.'s There are many reasons why IK's are fine as they are right now, with what you suggest it's easy that the game would devolve into dumb shit easily.

As much as i love GG the IK system from that game is one of those things that shouldn't came back, it was stupidly broken. If you parried it or just defend it you were able to prompt the ik screen. It also lead to stupid option selects, for example with Chipp, if i were at 50% of health or less i had the option to do the IK attack and input 236236K to get the Overdrive if the oponent evaded or the IK if he didn't, not to mention that an attack that ends all the rounds is just silly.

That is true, and i also feel that they are not showing everything that they have, but i also have this feeling that they will take some time before releasing the game to arcades, plus giving their track record with other games, once they make the 1st announcement it seems that it takes a year or a little more before releasing it. I have to say, that i am surprised that this is still UE3, it makes it look really beutiful and almost makes me forget how much i hate that engine, lol

You are surely optimistic, i actually think that we wouldn't see the game until winter 2014 to summer 2015, something its telling me that they will take more time.

Oh lord :facepalm: Balancing trough execution is not related to be able to do something consistently, is about how and when are you able to use something. How many times do i need to explain this or why the FRC's are done as they are? How many times do i need to post the alternatives as well to show that i am not against of giving alternatives to make them more accesible while not compromising their functionallity or how the work and behave? And stop bringing High Level play for god sake, it is high level play for a damn reason, those are people who train to do everything consistently. Everytime that someone brings it i only hear whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa whaaaaaaaaaaa i can't pull what they do, but i don't want to invest time like they do.

Right now that could be there mostly to show stuff for nostalgia reasons or to show that they can replicate old stuff on the new engine.

I liked more the old Ky's IK, it looked cooler

It seems that way (i am actually sure that they are), which means that we could see a more indepth story mode and cinematic IKs on the future Again read my posts and see how i am not against simplifying stuff, i am only against simplifitying too much, that and how i explain that FRC's are hard for more reasons than just for the sake of it. I only brought the high level play because Digital Watches kept bringing it up and seemed that way with his insistance that at high level play x or y became irrelevant. I never said otherwise, just pointed how funny was that they tried to justify those inputs by making them really powerful. What do you have in mind?

Lol, my bad, some of your posts were not showing on the crappy android browser, so i didn't see them until now that i am on my pc. And if you had read my posts you will see that in no way i am advocating for making stuff difficult for the sake of it, just the contrary, so i don't know why in the hell are you posting what i already said. Just for the record while i see the pretzel moves as unnecesary, notice how every move with them are way more powerful compared to their counterparts with easier moves because is like no one reads As you see i point 2 ways of making FRC's easier, i also explain why they are hard to do, not because they want to put an arbitrary execution barrier like many think, but because the mechanic as it is in inception and intended use is limited to small windows on the confines of the moves where they assigned, remeber that those moves also need to be balanced with the frcs and without their use in mind. I don't mind going on tangents as long as the discussion is entertaining.

I want to know, do you have read what i posted or i am wasting time writing mini walls of texts?

Zato's top tierness doesn't have anything to do with balancing him through making it difficult to use. Actually for the type of character he could be say to be simplier to use, sine lil eddie specials are mere button releases.

Lol, your combo example is not related at all to what i am trying to point out. As for keeping it or not, it all depends, if the game devolves on everyone trying to make it, then no, but if you have watched the outstanding combos, there are a lot of "infinites" on GGAC that are prohibitively possible for a human, they were "allowed" to stay on the game and it never became an issue. As for the rest, let me ask you, how much do you think that everything needs to be simplified for the sake of the new players without starting to fuck the risk reward ratio. First of all, i am not saying that i am against making things simplier, but that doesn't mean that i think that everything needs to be simplified. New players will be always have problems not matter what, there are people who struggle on making 236, while others don't have problem with it but can't do 623 or 360 consistently. Despite of that we have not made stuff like the SRK of Ryu on SF or VV of Sol on GG a one button thing, and yes, i know that P4A has 2 buttons SRK's but the game was designed that way, where those moves have very different properties, if they simplify them, they will need their properties changed, and that would make them other moves altogether. My problem with bringing high level play, is that you are complaining about people who puts work on being able to use their tools consistently. New players will be always struggle at anything, it doesn't even matter how simple or hard the activity is, look at shooters, there is a huge evidence on who is a noob and who is a top player, and this is despite that playing a fps is technically very simple as walk and aim. The fact that Pot Buster is 632146 input is not done because they wan't you to have a chance to screw it up, is because it limits the situations where do you can use it, you don't have the advantage to input it from any direction like witha 360. You also need to stop defending in order to do the motion, and there is a minimum time that it takes you to do the move, give the PB a 236P motion or heck 6P without changing anything of its properties and you will see how a move that is strong but not OP becomes totally unbalanced. Actually they did, of course they made the game with simple motions in mind, but they also give certain properties of their moves in a way to keep with the balance reward ratio, that is why you don't see 214C of Kanji being free of hitbox, or 214D being instant, look how Elizabeth one button Persona throw takes some time to land.

High level play is called that way for a reason, those are people who practiced to do everything consistently. This still doesn't mean that using execution as a mean to balance is wrong in any way. That is why moves like the 360 have that move, otherwise you need to change its properties if you simplify it. Look at Dizzy's Necro's Anger (or whatever is called), when the motion got simplified, they changed its properties to be less good than when it was more complicated. As for the case of FRC's there is much going on beside balance from risk reward ratio, i already give an example of why is not just a matter of changing the window. I also pointed 2 possible ways to simplify it or change the mechanic but retaining its core aspect. Your argument is the same as asking why not making every shot 3 points instead of 2 because everyone on the nba always land the 3 points shot no matter the circunstances. You think? You will be surprised the amount of shit that people think should be simplified, always bringing high level play, like if what they want is to even the field of what the top playes do after practicing to do what they do and what they (the people arguing about simplifying something/everything) can't

Complexity =/= hard. Which is my complaint. What makes Guilty Gear complex is the array of options that it gives to the player, but outside stuff like FRC's and Slashbacks everything is actually easy to learn. Also, read my example of why FRC are "hard", if anything only a very few of them are actually hard, the rest of them are very doable. One more thing, like it or not, execution is a valid way to balance risk reward ratio. I sincerely hate this shit mentallity where everyone thinks that they should to be able to pull out the high level play stuff without requiring practice. It is called high level play for a reason, this are people that are able to use the tools of their characters to its peak, people who practice to make everything they do consistently. There is a limit of how much you can simplify everything.

Tell me about it, you will think that after being on the end of people hating on their games the players would stop that kind of attitude. I remember that one of the reasons why i stopped playing AH3 was that their community keep shitting on BB just because.

This 100000 times, i have to say that i am fucking sick seeing how many "GG players" keep spreading this missinformation over and over, no wonder why many people gets scared to even try the game, if everyone keep saying that is hard to get into or that is very complex. True, the game has a lot of stuff to learn about, and it actually has some stuff that will require time to learn, but is not as hard and not as difficult as many people claim, this kind of shit only serves to decrease the interest of people on the game.

The funny thing is that more "accesible" games with less step learning curve still have not a lot of numbers of top players, even among their larger number of players, only a really little amount of them are playing at what we call high level play.

FRC are not a bad execution barrier, they are deliberately done that way because the powerful options that they bring to the table, think of them as the tool that the developers give you to break the rules that were already strablished (startup and recovery frames). Also, it was already explained why some of those windows are quite narrow, in order to increase them you have 3 options Change the frames of the move to wide the window, which can fuck the move. Chage the window which will make the outcome be less predictable. Add an input buffer ala Blazblue (which i think is reasonable). Make them Forcebreaks (but they wouldn't be roman cancels now) For example, in an hypothetical move that has 6 frames of startup, lets say that the the first 2 the character is on the ground, the next 2 become airbone and the last 2 he gains forward momentum. Depending on what you want to let the player do with the frc, you have little space to assing the frc window. If you want the character to be able to stay on the ground and do a throw mixup you can only make the window within the first 2 frames. If you make the window the first 3 frames you end with a frc that has the possibility of not working as intended if the player hits it in the last frame, sure it gains a high low mixup, but it screws the relayability if he wasn't prepared or wasnt what he was looking for. The same happens if you want to make the frc on the middle 2 frames to give an air mixup to the player, make it the first 3 and if he lands it on the 1st 2 he will be on the ground, make it from frame 2 to frame 4 and there is still 1 frame of chance of landing it on 1 frame where he is still on the ground. Lets say for the sake of the example that the momentum gained puts the character on a position where his air normals whiff if the opponent is crouching, so if you make it the frc from frame 3 to 5 or the last 3 and you have a frc window where the player will end fucking up if he doesn't land it between frames 3 and 4 anyway, so now you have a frc window that is lenient but puts the player in a bad situation if he is still not precise anyway. People need to understand better how the FRC works and why it works like that before criticizing them imo. Just because you don't like them, it doesn't mean that they are bad.

Because A) There are people who like to play this kind of characters, a good game has different options for different players B) Execution is a valid way to balance how powerful is a character. (Ino and Slayer are powerful characters that are balanced through their execution requeriments) C) Variety of strategy and gameplay D) High Execution Requeriments also can be the result of how the players use the characters, look at Sentinel on MVC2. THIS ARE THE ONLY THING THAT I DON'T LIKE

Hitomi with a pony tail

Reversals are 1 frame in pretty much every game out there, on SF2 were harder because the frame skip. Truth be told, every GG game has been replaced by the newer iteration, yes there is small community that still plays GGXX#R, but they are the minority. The only thing that could prevent GGAC not being totally replaced by GGXrd is that they end being as different as SF2 and SF3. That said, with the current mentallity of the FGC, i don't know, if is not UMVC3 and SSF4, every game is "dead"

Who knows, since japanese love their popularity polls.

You have to keep in mind that many of the stuff on the video is to show the new GG, with every combo there they catered the nostalgia factor of the players, by showing iconic stuff to say in a way, if you notice, they didn't show anything beyond some pretty cinematics and some combos/specials that are recognizable for every GG player. Plus from what we know, the game is very earlier in the development stage so more than probable there is not much to show. This is just an announcement that there is a new GG in development, not an announcement of the new GG in totallity. BTW, i don't feel that announcing this new GG that wouldn't come until 2014 or 2015 (leaning more on the later) while releasing GGAC+R is a disservice, if anything i feel that is a kind way to lessen the wait by giving us a new GG to play while getting the Next Gen entry. Also, i hope that they only put the 3d cinematic stuff on the 5D to show the 3d aspect of the game, and that it will be gone for the real game. While very possible, i hope that they aim to release the game with the major number of characters of the previous entry, like it or not, not doing it will be seen as something very negative by the fan base (serious players and casuals), not to mention that to this day, there is still a lot of idiots who cringe at the idea of DLC characters and see them as a thing of the devil born from the greedy intestinus of an evil and heartless company.