Manta

I held 8 after getting hit by gadget finger and didn't die.

Inferno divider still goes active in 5 frames and that has quite a bit of reach compared to 5 frame 5As that you might otherwise be thinking of.

If it is special cancellable there might be a few good uses for it. 6B FC (max range) 3C, 236A, 5C, 6A, 623C ... Go Go gadget theoryfighter!

Well, now that guardbreaks lead to much bigger damage and Tager can more effectively destroy primers with (6A>2C>3C RC)xn it seems that that is our new gameplan to get damage in. And I've said it before, but I will fall off my chair laughing when I see Sparkbolt guardcrushing someone and then Tager dragging them across the entire screen for an unbreakable 720. Overall it seems like they're pushing the emphasis even more on landing a good command throw to do damage and to use other moves to perform a relentless magnetism offence that eventually guardcrushes.

5B: p1/p2 100/86->80/86 2B: p1/p2 100/89->85/89 Tager now hates his B button. B Driver is still cool though. Seems like most of his openers are getting hit with P1s, isn't the 40% Tager rate enough?

FIFY

16 Seconds is essentially uncapped magnetism. If you take into account how much magnetism counts down inbetween each drive move, you're looking at about 5 drive moves to hit that cap. And considering you often only put them at the end of combos, they're usually dead or at least 16 seconds from the end of the round. Unless you're fighting Litchi of course.

Doesn't CT-moding Tager mean "Die to shit you have no counter for"?

Depends on who you're against. Some characters and combos are just a matter of tech whenever you can and try to block or reverse. Against other characters, you need to learn their specific tech traps (Tager has oh so many) but there's a few rules you can apply. Against Tager for example, you can always safely tech on the ground if you're far away from Tager, even magnetised. In the air then teching suddenly becomes very unsafe due to collider dragging you in, so neutral tech to hit the ground asap. But then there's traps for that so argh. When in doubt, tech neutrally, but really just get some experience in what your opponent can do.

J.2C, 2B is indeed a fickle one, I seem to have the greatest issue with it on Tao for some reason (She seems to be able to air tech at heights others could not). But isn't that a tech trap in itself if you hit the ground first and they neutral tech? Similarly j.D enders seem to be ideal for punishing neutral techs. Sounds like Gimmicky shit but when you have this many gimmicks to work with, they actually start being reliable. Also, lol at Tager being ble to aircombo. We might even have some Ragna-esque relaunch combos with things like j.C > j.D | 2C, 623C... Tager's Jump moves all seem to have good P2 values for what it's worth, and getting magnetism mid combo is kinda cool.

Sorry, was quoting from memory from when I was there. Also, 6B FC forcing crouch? Isn't that essentially +4 frames of recovery on top of what we're used to? There's probably something really stupid you can do with that. Don't you have to superjump to even get both moves to come out in one jump. If so, why would you do it? Tech trapping neutral techs? On the subject, couldn't J.C's buff be used to make use of J.C > J2.C to force a down state and do a 2B > 2C pickup?

j.2C should act like Rachel's equivalent for that. j.D getting FC would be cool though. And yeah, what's the point of an FC move that prorates so much that you actually end up with a shorter combo anyway due to untech time degradation?

And 6A's jump cancel went too, so boo. Nice to see 5C getting 100% P1 though. 3C > 2B > 2C > 623C... might actually give reasonable damage too.

6A may be two frames faster but that's a frame advantage so bad that it warrants taunting.

D divider is no longer a reversal? Well goddamn, that's pretty good to know.

Probably the next trick along the way with blockstrings is the frametrap. The idea is that you're deliberately leaving gaps in your blockstring where your opponent is able to attack, they attempt to mash out (using 5A or whatever) and you've timed a move in advance that will stuff their move and get you a nice counterhit combo. This sounds complicated, but you've probably been using it all along without realising it. For example, if you do (As Ragna) a blockstring which goes 5B > 6C, you've left a gap that's 2 frames wide at its smallest. No move without invulnerability will be able to beat you out of the 6C but unlike perfect blockstrings, your opponent may still try and then regret it. Obviously if they do a reversal move or something else with 1st frame invulnerability (like most backdashes) they'll get out of it, also in this case 6C gives a bad frame advantage which will get you punished unless you've pushed them far enough away. This is just an example of course. In more advanced cases you might try deliberately delaying moves that normally give perfect blockstrings (i.e. No frame gaps) in order to be unpredictable. It can also extend to other facets, like using it to get a throw-counter for example. Also not a Ragna player by nature.

Isn't it also true that you cannot barrier for the first x frames of a jump, so if you try and jump out of a suspected 360 trap, 2C is essentially unblockable.

Not exactly news, but today when Mori was asked how arakune was allowed to have 85% damage from one hit, he responded (without the need for the interpreter). "Ah so you play Tager then?"

Gadget's hitbox seems wider too. After all, it's catching arakune after Bsledge. Also shennanigans like 5B > 22D connecting also says bigger hitbox. Seems like the move is now more used as a way of getting heat and magnetism rather than getting good oki. But hey, that's the way the metagame shifts.

CSII Forward throw questions: What's the base damage of this move? (I read that it's 1900, Or that it's 1100 and the back throw does 1900.... or something) Is it possible to follow it up without magnetism? If so, does this need the wall or is there some other way? (Like bsledge or a j.C chase) If they're magnetised, what can you pull them back in with? I've seen AC work, but what about things like 6[A], J.D or even astral.

Also, to answer your earlier question, every character has a move that is invulnerable from the first frame right up to the first active frame (That is, a reversal move) although sometimes that's limited to supermoves (Jayakou Houtenjin! spirngs to mind) And noel's only true reversal is apparently her astral (Although she has plenty of moves with high or low invulnerability). I'm pretty sure everyone's backdash is invulnerable from the first frame, but then they also have a short vulnerable time where you can't block so don't do it against moves with long active times, Tager's 2D is a great example of a move you don't want to backdash unless it would hit late.

Your invulnerability wears off on your first frame where you can do something iirc. 720 and backdashes have first frame invulnerability. If you time it perfectly (Use advance input) then you can always activate them in time. Similarly Voltic charge and Magnatechwheel have first frame guard points and Sledge has a first frame projectile guard point. You must block everything else.

You mean redbeats where you'd normally get a techable AC? If so, Hrmmmm. Interesting.

But it still requires magnetism to still be going at that point. Also, less heat gain and factionally less damage.

Bgadget is pretty easy to me and it can also can put people in the corner (Or use Bsledge, 4D or just 2D). It'd be interesting to see if Egadget can universally be changed to: ...j.C whiff, Lowest j.2C | 5B > 22D