chzchan

I posted this a while ago based on Japanese footage at the time, but it is now slightly updated with all the things that have been tested so far. I'll add more stuff to it eventually. + Better overall proration on nearly all normals which means higher general combo damage. Stabilization of DP whiff routes thanks to adjusted launching of 623C. New, efficient high damage combo routes using 214D's jump cancellability and Crush Trigger or OD as well as 236D's new launching attribute. Reliable chargeless side switch combos which even work on airborne enemies by using 236C's new cross through attribute. Combo routes will encounter SMP less because regular usage and followup usage for special moves have been divided. Knockdown off of successful DP instead of knockback thanks to new j.214X attributes. 1 charge midscreen air combo extender with j.214D's new bounce attribute that allows it to be picked up with 2A or 623C. 236236C while in OD enables a followup for more damage when used in combos or as a reversal without having to spend charges. More damage off of command grab with damage bumped up to 1200. Conventional IAD route replaced with stable 6CC IAD route. Faster startup and speed on 236X. Lower recovery on j.214X. 5D and 2D charge rates accelerate over time. 2A now OTGs and has a much much better hitbox which allows more consistent roll catching. 236D and 22D are +2 on block. - 22 followup slide attribute was mitigated which actually leads to the loss of a variety of things. Reliable corner oki using j.236A is gone due to 22 followup no longer allowing a link because of the lack of slide. (There is a secret to getting it to link to normals that OTG like 2B and 6C but I have been told that it is very unreliable and hard to pull off and it doesn't make the oki any less impossible to do than it is right now because of positioning problems) Ease of staying on the opponent while close to the corner is gone due to mitigated 22 followup slide, or at least that's how it looks. (Not like it already wasn't really hard for Tsubaki to stay on top of the opponent after a knockdown, but seems like air knockdown is much much more popular now because of followup 22's change) 6C jump cancellability on block was taken away, so it can no longer be used in pressure as a way to deal with opponents who like to use barrier. 214X followup tracking autocorrection is gone. 22[D] followup no longer wallbounces midscreen. 236C > 5A/2A/5C corner link route still exists but always causes side swap. j.214D > 6C route is gone. Global damage reduction to all special moves, especially followup versions of the moves and D versions relative to their current damage, so adding charges to combos does not add on as much damage as it would currently. Stagger resets are gone because of 236D's new launching attribute and the fact that 236C causes knockdown/emergency tech when crossing through the opponent rather than stagger. 22B now knocks back and away on both normal and counter hit regardless of if the opponent is in the air or on the ground which means it can no longer be followed up by 6C with a rapid on normal hit or by linking with a counter hit like it can be right now due to stagger state. 22B counterhit can only be followed up in the corner. 5A2C no longer connects so 2C may have been made slower and this kills a lot of adlib combo routes. 5A: Attack level increased by 1. Recovery increased by 2 (Now 11) 5B: Same 5BB: Same 5C: Same 5CC: Same 2A: Lower hitbox greatly enlarged and can pick opponents up off the ground. Attack level increased by 1. Recovery increased by 2 (Now 10) 2B: Same 2BB: Same 2C: Same 2CC: Much less untech time and launches higher 6A: Same 6B: Same 6BB: Same 6C: No longer jump cancellable on block 6CC: Increased untech time so IAD j.C is easier to land. 3C: Same 3CC: Same j.A: Same j.B: Same j.BB: Same j.C: Same j.CC: Same 5D: Charge rate acceleration over time. 2D: Charge rate acceleration over time. j.D: Same (?) Throw: Same (all grabs had a universal increase in recovery on whiff though) Back Throw: Same Air Throw: Same Counter Assault: Same Crush Trigger: Same

That easier route is super not optimal and does much less damage than the route that lets you get in a 6CC. If I can get the timing down on the 623C > j.236A(dw) > 5C2C > 236D > 6CC I should be getting max damage even on the characters that make the 5C followup regularly difficult.

Ah I go for 5B > sj.BCC > j.D > j.B > dj.BCC > j.214A. I feel that this is worth doing now that doing this route actually tacks on a good amount of damage.

5B2C is unstable as hell. I guess it is better to at least try.

Yes it is. I think they did that because of the beefed up invuln that happens earlier in the startup as Errol said. Still doesn't have head invuln so meh.

I feel as if things have gotten significantly harder, but this is mostly because I am getting beat up by my buddy who plays Bullet. Her j.D startup was nerfed so it is easier to air grab her if she is low on heat, but it is still very very difficult to approach her if your opponent is playing reactively especially because you have zero normals that beat hers and it is incredibly easy for her to punish whiffing or mistiming anything when you when you are near her. With her drive changes, I feel that if she gets even 1 heat level you pretty much already lose because of how much reward she gets plus her ability to keep her flame lit without spending meter using special cancellability. Also, the fact that she bounces back when you block her drive even when low on heat makes it pretty much impossible for Tsubaki to punish her even on IB because of the distance she is placed at after bouncing away. It is just very very difficult to deal with her drive and I'd say she is much much scarier in this iteration.

It used to OTG? I don't remember that. You can pick people up after the Crush Trigger bounce still. 236D is prety difficult to follow up on larger characters. Azrael, Hakumen, and Tager just end up really damn far from the position 236D's recovery leaves you and following up with a dashing 5C is hard as hell. There is the 5B > sj.B route but that does significantly less damage and these three characters in particular have the highest health in the game.

All of them feel like they have much much lower recovery compared to 1.1. Also j.214C makes you slide across the ground when you land and lets you fly away for free. Thanks for double checking. I am trying to figure out what in the hell they expect you to do after a 236D counterhit since it makes it actually more difficult to land 5C. The new 22B counterhit also sucks.

So far j.214B has worked in nearly all the places j.214A would have worked. Is there a reason why j.214A is used over it? I don't notice that much of a difference in its recovery versus j.214A's and I am able to catch rolls and whatnot just fine out of it. Both of them leave you directly in front of the opponent now, but j.214B gets you more corner carry and a tiny bit more damage. I can still set up air spacing in combos to get j.214C to end with me behind the opponent on knockdown if the combo timer isn't about to expire which is fun. Trying to also figure out what the applications of j.236A > j.214X is just in general as well aside from a point to RC out of to go into 6C.

I stopped getting hit by my Kagura buddy's Wyvern randomly in neutral and then I realized that I didn't need to barrier to block it.

Hmm, well I don't know who else's is faster (besides maybe Tsubaki's).

Ragna. Kagura's DP got nerfed. Try doing 2C > late jump cancel j.C after 214B on a juggled opponent. It should work. You sacrifice a bit of damage, though.

I am having fun trying to hit a 236C at the max possible height so that when they fall you have enough time to super jump over the opponent and land a crossup j.C. It isn't a meaty, so far at least, but it is confusing as hell since you sideswitch twice. Only works on neutral tech, but that is like everything else so welp. I am experimenting with charge required oki right now. Somewhat successful using a couple techniques I was trying out last week in 1.1 since they still work.

I'm already in the process of coming up with gimmicks. 236C is really really fun. Overall, Tsubaki feels much more restricted, but things are still looking up.

Yeah. I'll figure out the height dependent stuff later. Here are some more notes. 22B is not positive on block, but 22 is 0 on block. 22 actually doesn't push back that far. You will be close enough to land 5A without dashing after 6C > 22 on certain characters, but 5C is what should be used for consistency. 236D confirmed for +2 on block. 22D is also +2 on block and does not push back nearly as far as 236D. Followup 22D is negative on block, probably the same value as uncharged 22B. 22[D] is +6 on block instead of +8, but it pushes back a ton. Followup 22[D] is 0 on block just like fully charged 22. 421D > 236D is +6 on block like before, but it pushes back on block like mad. I can see myself using charges in pressure and neutral a lot more now, especially now that charge acceleration is confirmed.

The adjusted buffer if it is even real doesn't really mess with Tsubaki that much aside from the 236B > 214B > 22 (delay) > 5D > 6C combos. All of my friends having much more trouble with their inputs is telling me there is a buffer adjustment and also the fact that I can't do the blade super 100% of the time anymore tells me something was changed. It might be in all of our heads, though. DP > 5C is super easy once you get down the j.236A timing. I am actually having a very difficult time getting the 2C > j.B > j.CC(delay) > 2C juggle down out of all the new things that aren't the combo I mentioned above. Here's some great news on the charge rate. 5D and 2D now have accelerating charge rates. Here is my data so far. 0-1 44f 1-2 39f 2-3 33f 3-4 29f 4-5 26f About to test if it is time dependent or charge bar fill dependent. It is time dependent. Charge versus Time(frames) Charge Rate versus Time(frames)

Oh it is plus at point blank. That was what it got in return for no longer crossing through the opponent. It has quite a lot of pushback so it being plus only works as a pressure reset on opponents that don't use barrier.

6B is exactly the same. Same startup and +1 on block. We have a + special, though, 236D. Just eyeballed it but I think it is +2/+3. Daedron and Shruikon told me that things seemed off and they were all off by 1. Shruikon told me about startup on the wiki being the frames up until the first active frame plus the first active frame which I did not know was the convention. Now that I know this I can try to not screw up. I'll try a few different methods. Like I know for a fact that 2C was probably made slower because of the drops from 5A despite 5A getting its attack level buffed.

Hoping that the Xbox version allows for the guts to truly be ripped like with pre-CP.

Working on it.

Doing the frame by frame on recorded video. I did short tests of frame advantage by doing the jumping test after blockstun. Startup is just until the move goes active (though I guess this is against the convention that the wiki uses because the first frame of active is counted as startup). I know for a fact that 5A got attack level upped because 5A>5B is no longer a frame trap unless delayed on top of the sound thing. I may be doing things wrong, so tell me if I am. I'm not even going to attempt doing active frames as C0R instructed until I have the time. 236D and 421D > 236D not going full screen bothers me.

Being able to do 6CC > 22[D] midscreen is amazing. I'm not sure if being able to jcc into other specials besides CT out of 214D will be of any use in the future. 5A is probably still -2 and 2A is definitely still 0. They got their attack level upped but their recovery got increased by 2 frames each. 623X is now a VS starter and 214X is an S starter. 236X series does what it used to do before CP where it would push the opponent a certain distance during the late startup and active frames while the opponent is blocking. 2B is still 13 frame startup. 6A is still 26 frame startup. 5C is still 8 frame startup. 5B is still 10 frame startup.

Try 5A5CC > 623C > j.236A(w) > 5C2CC > sj.C > dj.CC > j.214A Anyone know how to get 214D > jccCT down properly? I am having trouble.

Yes it is or at least it should be. As for the usage there are a bunch of gimmicks that no longer work because of how they are now. I think they got sped up though so combos won't drop anymore.

They made so many things stiffer though. The 236X series in particular. They are like super negative on block too.