Synthesis

I thought that too but I don't know how viable that is. I usually use 2B, 623C, backdash or 5B after 6B. 623C to bait pokes but instant blocking the second hit of 6B can be used against them. Staggering it with other attacks after the first hit of 6B (specials, of course) can make pressure a little messier. I plan on messing with this to see if it's worthwhile. I have a question though in response to JH on wakeup not being a threat. Mu pressures from a decent distance away on oki (5D 6D 5C/SoD). Does the 5D stop 214DB on wakeup? Since 214DB takes 7 frames to start up, I was wondering if this works. If it did, the only threat is JH, but could SoD be used to bait for it? I know Haz can jump out but SoD lvl1 recovers fast enough to do SoD (6D laser) short dash 5C into pressure. I was just wondering if SoD can be used to bait his JH by staggering the release. This is of course if he does a wakeup JH. Too much of a guessing game, eh?

Thank you very much Zidane. That was actually helpful. ^_^ I agree with all of that but I have a question: Isn't 5D j.2C or any variation thereof safe on block? I know I've caught a ton of players trying to poke out after the j.2C just to get them hit by the laser. Is it possible that her rushdown can be strengthened by mixing up the timing and followups to and from the 5D to bait things/keep the pressure up? Your opinions on this. Also, if anyone wants to check, the other Mu player here in Tucson said that 6B is safe on block/IB (tested with Ragna 5B). I'm too lazy to check myself, but if anyone is willing... I know it loses to Tager buster but if it is indeed safe perhaps that could be another form of stagger pressure Hazama would have to deal with. With your solid points I agree that the matchup is 6-4. That seems about right, but the way they were playing it out in the Mu threads made it seem like it was 7-3 to 8-2 horrible, and I just wasn't seeing that. Thanks for everything, Zidane.

Stay gdlk Tempest

Instead of diluting this thread with pointless posts, why not post what's wrong with it? This is a tier list discussion thread and I was posting about the tier list. *shrug*

I think everyone needs to shut up about Hazama. He's really good, we get it. Stop arguing and trying to say he isn't. This is a matchup thread. =/ As for matchups I wanted to ask the Hazama players here, as well as the Mu players what they think of the Hazama/Mu matchup. The Mu matchup thread isn't exactly a good place because we only get Mu perspectives and Tempest had said that it was a horrible matchup for Mu with no clear cut explanation as to why. The other Mu players are also probably too gung-ho about Mu to look at the matchup objectively as well. Here are my thoughts: I have played the matchup multiple times and I don't see how it is in Hazama's favor, but that is potentially because the Hazama's I have played have been horrible. I believe the matchup is solidly even for these reasons: - Momentum plays the largest role in this match. - They can both zone each other. Hazama does a better job of it but Mu can prevent him from approaching outside of him doing 2DD to get into the air. - They both have ridiculous damage off optimal setups. - Mu has fantastic oki. The threat of a wake-up Jayoku is minimal. She really only needs to look out for IB Jayoku. I heard Omohikane can beat it on reaction (haven't tried it). etc... There are more reasons, I'm just too tired to think of them at this moment. I just want opinions from good Haz players and solid explanations as to why you think that. Thanks.

I agree that Mu is indeed a gimmick factory, but they're still very safe gimmicks. Here's my version of the tier list: S: Litchi, Bang A: Hazama, Haku-men, Ragna A-: Arakune, Carl, Mu, Makoto, Taokaka B: Lambda, Jin, Noel C: Tager, Tsubaki D: Rachel I say A- is kind of fuzzy because they're all very solid in that grouping, but I wouldn't give them a separate tier because they're more of an inbetween for A and B, but not to the point to recieve the B ranking themselves. Hazama is fantastic. Ragna is mediocre, but his damage and meter gain keep him up there. I apologize if this looks bad, but this is just my opinion.

Mu's 6A is the same as Lambda's. I'm saying the matchup is either 5-5 or 5.5 - 4.5. It's not horrible at all. xD And even if I were to play Vince, he's much better than me and using our record wouldn't exactly be accurate. xD

I mainly picked up Litchi cause I've always liked her, and apparently the Mu/Hazama matchup is horrible. Might as well be prepared with a backup in case it happens to be true (I don't see it.)

Wanna hear something sad? I put 2 hours into learning Litchi combos this morning, and I'm already better with her than I am with Mu. That's how retarded Litchi is.

Lol. Carlos: The class started last week on Monday, it lasts until the beginning of December, The workload was assigned Tuesday night, and I have a grand total of 308 topics to learn by the end of the semester. She's making me finish 154 of them by Sunday.

You know, that would be fine, except they also expect me to put in at least 6hours worth of work this week into the Math outside of those problems. What the hell? And sure, it's easy, but it's a lot and it takes time. I'm working 30 hours per week overnight and I like sleeping every now and then.

So, I'm in MATH100 right now because I didn't want work and I wanted an easy A. Apparently, that isn't possible. I need to do 150 problems (finish half of my semester's work) by Sunday in order to get 1/14th of my PARTICIPATION grade. WTF!?

Fun list of things: Crawlable: 5A, 2A, 6A, 5B, 5C, 2C, 6C, j.A, j.B, j.C Non-crawlable: 2B, 3C, j.2C. This kind of sucks, now that I'm thinking about it. You just simply can't rush down. Spam 2B. It's all you've got.

You guys are so contradictory sometimes. How does Hazama hit you? He reacts. Why can't you guys react as well? Just because you blocked a chain doesn't mean the placement of the stein was useless. React to him coming in from his chains and DP him or 6C him. The stein is a bait to lure him to try and get in. DPing everything he does isn't a good idea, and you all know it. I'm saying you can reaction DP his stance commands, but the safer option is to just backdash or IABD or something to get AWAY from him in order to put on the pressure.

I understand what you're saying, but there are easy ways around most of that. When you expect the stance, buffer in a backdash and get the hell out of there and punish his attempt to do anything. He can feint the stance but if he does, you're both at neutral and you can always run away. Yes, his chains are annoying, but do you know what is worse? Mu's steins. Put them out relentlessly. They are SPECIAL and JUMP CANCELLABLE. If he uses a whiffed chain to attempt to get in, push him back out with a SoD. If he tries doing a chain and you JC block it, watch. You can REACT to him flying in on you. If he cancels it, set more steins or put out a 236A. Or, if he tries to get in, after you see him trying to pull himself in, do a 2C. That will most likely CH him into whatever you want. Steins destroy his chain. The hitbox of the stein itself will stop his chain (when it is first placed) the laser will stop his chain, 214D stops his chain, 236D stops his chain, everything will stop his chain. You can zone, but do it well, and if you rush him down, just keep an eye on his meter to watch out for Jayoku. 214D~B is a poverty DP. He must enter stance first so the invincibility on that doesn't start up until a little while after he inputs the command. Just space 5C and 6C attacks into SoD or a stein placement, and airdash in. If you think he will chain or try to 214D~B you out of the air, bait it like you would anything else.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npP73QIApFE You're the architect of my dreams, Spencer. You plan them and build them on blue paper and hand them to me. That's what you do for me. Thank you for that, Spencer. You prick.

Hey, one of you should make me an avatar. Also, I love this thread. <3 you guys.

He doesn't, honestly. This matchup is VERY even. Just instead of trying to ZONE and SPACE everything, run in. Play as if you were using Rachel against Nu in CT. DON'T TRY AND ZONE and if you do, you better be damn sure you're doing it well.

Guys. If that's what they are doing, bait the IB jump out, jump, airthrow whiff, land, continue pressure. If they jump, you get an airthrow. Or you can dash up 2C to knock them out. Mix it up, and respond according to their actions. =/ Also, I was working quite a bit this weekend and didn't get to organize the setups. It will have to wait a little while longer. Sorry guys.

Spacing, man. Learn to space your attacks and Lambda won't be able to do anything. Also, you need to RTSD. Hard.

The reason we've been talking about oki after knockdown is because oki only occurs when they're knocked down. Zoning setups are different, but I think we should talk about those as well. My zoning technique depends on the type of character I'm playing against. If they like to take to the air a lot, I use 5D 2D j.D j.6D land. This gives you a large web of air steins that will prevent them from approaching if you use 236D or 214D. If they stick to the ground, I use 5D 6D j.5D j.2D land for zoning. Same thing as above. If they like to zone, I use 6D 4D j.6D j.2D. That creates a box about mid screen which will force them to attempt to approach unless they want to get rushed down. For people who generally stay on you, if you plan on going on the offensive soon, do 5D 4D 9j.2D j.6D land 214D and block. If you block and they rush down, they'll push you into the stein behind you and the explosion will go through you and hit them for a point-blank 214D counter hit combo.

I'll do it, then. I'll update it by the end of this weekend with most of the stuff. Gotta organize the oki setups based on the ender and the risk/reward ratios. I'll also put some stuff on how to condition.

Should I update the front page with all of these new discoveries?

As for a defensive character, I think Tager and Hakumen are very good, but Mu is a great defensive character as well. She has her DP, a reversal super that does decent damage, she can IB backdash to get out of some block strings and as for zoning, people can't really zone her. She also sets "traps" which also aid her defensive game by essentially having a mine field your opponent has to get past to get in. Also, her 236D lasers are fantastic because even if she gets hit, the laser will continue to keep going. This allows her to do risky things that you wouldn't normally be able to do because you have the defense of the laser backing you up. It all depends on how you want to play, though.