AC: General Strategies and Tactics

[Digital Watches]

I think I have magic bipolar talent with FRCs, because with some of them, I can do it after seeing it done a few times, and with most, I can get it down in a couple tries. Except sometimes I lose the ability to do any at all ever. Things like Benten can be hard though, since you have to hitconfirm and all.

[HolyOrderChipp]

It's just so hard to be that precise... And I don't seem to get more precise as I practice. Sometimes, I can do an FRC a bunch of times in a row, but then I magically lose the ability a few moments later. When I was trying Benten FRC a week or two ago, I could do it really well for a while, then barely at all. And I seem to NEVER get Rensen FRC. I think the sound is screwing me up. I'll latch onto the auditory cue, and I can either do it far from the sound, or on the sound, but not just close to the sound. At least my other main, HOS, doesn't depend on FRCs much... And AC FRC is six frames... Probably, I'm just too impatient. I'll keep at Benten FRC, though. Once I've learned one, I hope it gets easier... I thought maybe I was just bad at this, but if it took others months to get their first FRC down consistently, then off I go to training mode! Oh, how it will be worth it for a safe dragon punch that leads to 200 damage in the corner!

[Kobayashi]

Oh, how it will be worth it for a safe dragon punch that leads to 200 damage in the corner!

You'll have to learn two separate FRCs

The timing is different on S Benten FRC when it hits as opposed to when it whiffs. I think you already know this, though. I didn't read much before your post.

[HolyOrderChipp]

Oh, learning the FRC on hit is more than enough work... I'll pay the price for a whiffed Benten.

[Adelheid]

Er, what? Whiffed benten is the easiest FRC in the game. I didn't even have to learn it, I was immediately capable of doing it the instant I first tried. Just press slash and then immediately mash your three preferred buttons...

[HolyOrderChipp]

Wait, what? Don't you only get one FRC attempt per move?

[Silmerion]

Wait, what? Don't you only get one FRC attempt per move?

He means that it's so soon after the move that you're practically assured of your success.

[HolyOrderChipp]

But it's still a 2F window... And it's not so near the beginning... It's when his arms are already at their most extended behind him point... Oh, and there are at least four easier FRCs: Robo 5H (Four frames, really quick) Tesu 6H (Five frames, as the scythe is on the ground. Can be done visually.) HOS AC FRC (Six frames!) Slayer 6P (First three active frames. Dunno why it's so easy for me.) Also, three favorite buttons? I'm on pad, man. L1 FTW.

[Adelheid]

Also, three favorite buttons? I'm on pad, man. L1 FTW.

Well there's your problem <_<

If you played on stick you could just mash and it would work. If they're not using the same, button, though, you could do it faster, and then you won't have that awesome timing aid.

[Digital Watches]

Yeah, the fact of the matter is that there IS a timing lag on FRC macros. I think you have to do the FRC something like 2-3 frames faster on a macro button. Learn to thumb it or switch to stick. Also, for the record, you can get WAY more than 200 damage off benten FRC in the corner.

[Sking]

Hey I'm a pad player and to be honest is more easy to me to do frcs there than in stick(and I play both). About the whiff benten frc is like robo 5H just a bit later, like 2 or 3 frames.

[Digital Watches]

Hey I'm a pad player and to be honest is more easy to me to do frcs there than in stick(and I play both).

About the whiff benten frc is like robo 5H just a bit later, like 2 or 3 frames.

Actually, it ends on the same frame as robo 5H, it's just a 2F window, instead of a 4F one.

Also, it's perfectly normal for pad players to find using the macro easier than FRCing on stick: The timing is different, and your muscle-memory cues are probably tied to the delay that using a macro causes.

[DubiousCurvLoop]

Apologies for going off topic, but damn... I had no idea that RC macro caused delay. How much delay incurs, if you know right off?

[Kobayashi]

Someone call on Clayton.

[HolyOrderChipp]

Yeah, the fact of the matter is that there IS a timing lag on FRC macros. I think you have to do the FRC something like 2-3 frames faster on a macro button. Learn to thumb it or switch to stick. Also, for the record, you can get WAY more than 200 damage off benten FRC in the corner.

Well, YOU can get way more than 200...

I've been thinking of investing in a stick... I might just do so soon. Any idea why the macro has a delay? (Damn, I'll have to relearn Robo 5H FRC and Slayer 6P FRC on stick!)

[Digital Watches]

Apologies for going off topic, but damn... I had no idea that RC macro caused delay. How much delay incurs, if you know right off?

I'm sure it's no more than 5, but I think it's as little as 2 or 3 frames.

[低姿勢]

Someone call on Clayton.

What am I being asked? If there is bug with one button moves to say? Lag or whatever?

I couldnt tell you any specifics on 1 button stuff personally. Its cheating anyway, so why anyone would bother with it, is beyond me. Unless they are some coward cheat man. And please dont give me any BS its the same thing. Cuz if it was, then you wouldnt bother trying to get one button. Its the same right? Yawn anyway... Only thing I can say off hand, and its really off hand, as I couldnt even recall the last time I put in GG period, (maybe last summer sometime?)but the one button RC uses like a specific set of buttons I think. So some moves its gonna fuck it up. If your special is with one of the buttons it is using for the one button.

*fizzles away*

[Adelheid]

So one thing I've been developing is leading in to bomber loops by getting the opponent airborne with point0blank cS-TK FB Bomber, Bomber. It's a bit character-specific, though. It flat-out doesn't work against May and Baiken as far as I can tell, and a few other really short/weird-hitbox-having characters you either can't do the easier to hitconfirm and generally more practical point-blank 5K-cS-TK FB Bomber or the aforementioned drops the FB Bomber link down to 1 or 2 frames. It's also generally not practical because you have to be right next to them for it to link. But, when you get it off, the damage is huge. Plus, on mid-weight characters with large air hitboxes you can start it from actually fairly far away, and on floaty characters you can (actually, have to) air dash before the bomber, getting more distance still.

[Digital Watches]

Of course, at that point, why not just use TK FB by itself, or something equally difficult to hitconfirm.

[Adelheid]

I'm almost positive I misunderstood you, but in case you actually asked why you shouldn't just run up and TK FB Bomber if you want to try something like that Two reasons, really. The first and more important reason is that I don't want to waste tension on something that could be blocked which is kind of the entire point of hitconfirming in to something that costs meter. The second is that because most people's hitboxes grow a bit vertically when they get hit standing, even if it doesn't appear that way, and it's vastly easier/less impossible to hit cS-TK FB Bomber.

[Digital Watches]

This is really nerdy frame data stuff, but:

Housoubako (623P): 15F startup, happens during hitstop.

Shiranami no Homura: 7F startup, can be done as early as F2 of housou.

If you'll refer to the hit pause chart on this page, you'll see that minimum hitpause (with the exception of a few anomalies, these being (That I know of) Jam's 5K and Axl's 63214H, the first of which doesn't apply anyway, due to being low) is 11F. Even given conservative estimates (Meaning that the 7F startup starts at frame 3 of housou, which I think is actually untrue), this means that you can technically land a guaranteed shiranami from countering any non-projectile, including jabs. Looking at it realistically, this is probably an ideal option when attempting to counter anything lower than a level 3 move (or, obviously, anything lower than lv. 5 if the opponent is able/likely to RC or cancel into something invulnerable.)

[Adelheid]

I thought that was common knowledge <_< I mean, I certainly make use of that. Shiranami is a lovely move.

[Digital Watches]

I thought that was common knowledge <_< I mean, I certainly make use of that. Shiranami is a lovely move.

You mean to say that you pull off guaranteed counters versus jab consistently?

[Adelheid]

I'm not sure if I'd say consistent, but I try to pull it off whenever I can. I was under the impression you knew this, given I did it a few times we last played, against your Jam.

[Digital Watches]

I'm not sure if I'd say consistent, but I try to pull it off whenever I can. I was under the impression you knew this, given I did it a few times we last played, against your Jam.

With success? I remember once, but that was most definitely a 5S, good sir.