Cornix Posted August 16, 2009 Posted August 16, 2009 Yep.. but leaving off the combo at 236C will leave you next to tager on wakeup without your staff.. Adding in RiichiA or RiichiB at the end will put you on the other side of the screen and the D will start returning your staff so you get it back to get your range back. I wasn't trying to say you were playing wrong, was just adding on the extra bit of information for everyone else. And B+C will not break his command throws/special throw... unless you're in hit stun/guard stun (when you'd normally get the double purple exclamations), otherwise you can't tech out of his throws.
Dator Posted August 16, 2009 Posted August 16, 2009 After i just took a look at it i like the idea of just leaving off with 236b and then D, only if i'm near a corner this way i got enough spacing and could possible go into a corner combo.
Spud Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 Question: if Tager does that trick thingy where he does the 720 while you're teching/ rolling, how do you escape it? Ninja Edit: or can you?
Nakkiel Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 Just neutral tech and DP if you have your staff. If not, you're screwed.
Cornix Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 Neutral tech and smash the a button or hatsu or something, you are pretty much screwed, but it can't hurt to try.
individuals Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 From the Iron Tager Questions and Answer Thread. Actually, the answer to this and the other question about why the 2nd 720 was too early are the same: Basically: a too-early held 720 isn't guaranteed. In the vid, the 720 was too early because the opponent could have just held Up and escaped; and Noel can reversal super for the same reason. To do it properly you want to have the 720 flash happen on the frame the neutral tech finishes. Analyzed: If they are vulnerable to throws on the frame of the 720's super flash, they get grabbed and there's nothing they can do. However, if they are not vulnerable to throws, for example in the middle of a neutral tech, then after that animation finishes it's possible to go straight from that to jumping (also not throwable), or a reversal throw-invin move (Noel's super has full-body autoguard until 9f after the flash, which will guard throws) and avoid having any frames where the 720 could grab you. It is worth noting that if the opponent neutral techs and holds Up during the tech so they will jump as soon as it is over, there is NO WAY for you to 720 them before they jump, perfectly timed or not. They are going from throw-invin to throw-invin. The same goes for reversal throw-invin moves. The reason it was too early in the video is because the opponent hadn't finished his tech, so he could still have reacted during the super flash, held Up, and escaped. All a perfectly-timed 720 buys you is if they weren't already holding Up, they can't get out. never really tried this before, because when a good tager DOES gimmick me, i panic and try to do something and end up getting owned. but hey, mikez said so. so it must be this ez to escape a neutral tech trap 720.
Shining Aquas Posted August 18, 2009 Author Posted August 18, 2009 Really, it just doesn't hurt to try. Method A eats the 720 every time, Method B at least gives you the 50% chance of NOT eating 720 calories of PAIN!
Phrekwenci Posted August 27, 2009 Posted August 27, 2009 Opinion / Question: Is there any reason why Litchi should not 2C right in the beginning of the match? I catch Tagers with this constantly, and there's nothing they can do but block or eat it for Tsubame combo into the loop.
Zenmetsu Posted August 27, 2009 Posted August 27, 2009 Because he can 360A you, that is why. 2C opener is a high-risk, high reward opener for this match. Alternatively Tager's 5A will also beat 2C, and it will give Tager a crouching CH which leads into 5C>combo.
Shining Aquas Posted August 27, 2009 Author Posted August 27, 2009 In my opinion the best way to start a match is 5B. There's so very little that Tager can actually do against it (outside of possibly 3C). Usually, with 5B, either you got a free interrupt>combo, they blocked it and you suffer no penalty if you choose not to follow up (and leave yourself possibly open to punishment for attempting 6A or 2B>6A mixups, which can still be rewarding), or Tager backdashed into.....well nothing really. Nothing he can do now that he ended up creating negative amounts of distance for himself, which is when you start playing with 6B and j.C. Rebel, Action, 5B. Kinda decent here.
individuals Posted August 27, 2009 Posted August 27, 2009 i think 2C is a pretty good opener, i probably use it more than 5B. i think itsuu is decent depending on your opponents behavior i guess, if they go for an atk they can eat guard and CH. or if they just jump or backdash you can time your attack from there. although IAD will crap on this. only go for it if i think u got a good read on his start. ^o^ other things i would probably do often would be backdash, or IAD / jump w/karafastfall (for crossup or psychic air throw!) everything else i probably only used once or twice.
STenSatsu Posted August 27, 2009 Posted August 27, 2009 I like to 2c if they always backdash at the start. Otherwise just stick 5b out.
Diveman Posted September 22, 2009 Posted September 22, 2009 I was messing around a bit, and I "found" something interesting. Im sure most of you have noticed that if you´re next to your opp and jump towards them and input B right after litchi leaves the ground they´ll get hit by the j.B but they wont if they´re crouching. Well if tager is standing or crouching j.b wont whiff, so you can go for this instant overhead one in a while to catch him off guard, on hit you can j.2D RC land and combo (you´ll be staffed when you land) on block you can do j.D and air backdash, seems safe to me.
geist Posted September 23, 2009 Posted September 23, 2009 I like to 2c if they always backdash at the start. Otherwise just stick 5b out. note that 2C also catches jumping forward or back, and itsuu A tends to hit after
Lord Knight Posted September 30, 2009 Posted September 30, 2009 Don't roll > haku on Tager, 360 tracks (and I'm pretty sure 720 will too).
Mooshi-Q Posted October 2, 2009 Posted October 2, 2009 Because he can 360A you, that is why. I discovered tonight that a 360A will also eat 6B at round start. I like to throw that out at the beginning of online matches since most crappy Tager players immediately use sledge.
Soothesayer Posted October 2, 2009 Posted October 2, 2009 Can someone list which staff attacks sledgehammer will ram through without taking any damage? I know tsubame doesn't work(which can very annoying) and itsuu B doesn't work(dunno about C).
STenSatsu Posted October 2, 2009 Posted October 2, 2009 I think most of her staff normals will hit him out of it. You can also just hold itsuu till you autoguard the hit and then do B.
Mooshi-Q Posted October 2, 2009 Posted October 2, 2009 Tsubame also can punish sledgehammer if you throw it towards the end of the attack. Basically, sledge guards against projectiles. So, any time the staff is leaving Litchi's hands it won't affect him. Flying staff, Tsubame, Itsuu, 6C[m] etc will be eaten. I generally use 5B if they're close or 6B if they're at a distance.
A.X.I.S. Posted October 2, 2009 Posted October 2, 2009 Can someone list which staff attacks sledgehammer will ram through without taking any damage? I know tsubame doesn't work(which can very annoying) and itsuu B doesn't work(dunno about C). all green any of her drives when the stick is flying. stick man super. riichi hikkake and the super that launches the stick at you and at the end it crashes down.
Heroic_Legacy Posted October 30, 2009 Posted October 30, 2009 All of your normals beat Sledge. Sledge beats everything else. Note: Tager can sledge your staffless 5C. So if we IB staffless 5B, be careful. You may eat a combo.
geist Posted October 31, 2009 Posted October 31, 2009 All of your normals beat Sledge. Sledge beats everything else. Note: Tager can sledge your staffless 5C. So if we IB staffless 5B, be careful. You may eat a combo. note, you can pretty much tsubame any string when tager goes into sledge (usually 5D->sledge I think) you get the invincibility right when he loses his
Heroic_Legacy Posted October 31, 2009 Posted October 31, 2009 Protip: Instead of sledge we can use Voltic Charge if we know you know about the opening. And Charge leads to 360/720.
geist Posted October 31, 2009 Posted October 31, 2009 Protip: Instead of sledge we can use Voltic Charge if we know you know about the opening. And Charge leads to 360/720. thanks for the tip...I assume that the charge recovers in time to 360 before the staff comes down? does it really have enough invuln? also sledge is pretty slow so litchi might be able to just react to the charge and punish another question...is the charge invuln to projectiles the entire time it's held?
Heroic_Legacy Posted October 31, 2009 Posted October 31, 2009 Charge is invulnerable to everything but grabs and lows. It goes through everything. Charge ends and the pole has yet to come down so if we input a 360/720 during the recovery we can catch you before you can move.
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