craz Posted July 4, 2009 Posted July 4, 2009 Maybe I'm just bad (And if I am I'll just delete thread or something), but this matchup gives me all sorts of hell. I can't seem to find anything I can beat her with and her blockstrings seem really safe. How do you handle her?
Mike Z Posted July 4, 2009 Posted July 4, 2009 Remember 2 things: - All her pokes move her far forward, so you can 360A them from further than you think. - You can Sledge the DP for massive damage (against Capitalist Regime, etc) Also, look for the following awesome punish: If she is doing a corner combo; has already called her staff in the combo, so it is returning to her; and she does 6C (2 hit slow up/down kick), then she will most likely DP afterward to keep the combo going. In this case, if you sense a DP, you can gold Burst through it as it starts and 720/360B for free. Keep this in mind, as usually vs. Litchi you'll have 50% and get corner combo'd before you die.
DiasFlac Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Mike Z or anyone else who knows. Is there anyway to escape Litchi's move where she stand on her pole and kicks continuously? because it seems once im hit by it I can't air tech it or anything and the combo numbers keep racking. Is it that the move is inescapable once it hits and the player times each hit correctly? If there anyway to escape this move after being hit other then guard burst please let me know. Thanks in advance
AlmightyGnat Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Remember 2 things: - All her pokes move her far forward, so you can 360A them from further than you think. This is great info. Also, look for the following awesome punish: If she is doing a corner combo; has already called her staff in the combo, so it is returning to her; and she does 6C (2 hit slow up/down kick), then she will most likely DP afterward to keep the combo going. In this case, if you sense a DP, you can gold Burst through it as it starts and 720/360B for free. Keep this in mind, as usually vs. Litchi you'll have 50% and get corner combo'd before you die. Wow. I can dig it.
DiasFlac Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 Mike Z or anyone else who knows. Is there anyway to escape Litchi's move where she stand on her pole and kicks continuously? because it seems once im hit by it I can't air tech it or anything and the combo numbers keep racking. Is it that the move is inescapable once it hits and the player times each hit correctly? If there anyway to escape this move after being hit other then guard burst please let me know. Thanks in advance Yeah lol I'm still waiting on someone who knows to answer the question AlmightyGnat but from what I've been doing in training you can air tech it at some point the most she will hit is maybe 6 but I'm not 100% this could of just been due because I missed the timing on the hits. Anyone with more knowledge wanna help us fellow Tager mains with this question?
Koozebanian Fazoob Posted July 6, 2009 Posted July 6, 2009 My advice is to get Volt Spark and sit on it. While you have it ready, it really limits her options. Wait for a mistake, missed poke, or bad idea, and nail her for it. Being really patient when at a distance is important. Also, she has no pokes and no defense without her staff. If you catch her without it, keep the pressure on real good because suddenly you have better range and pokes than her. If she calls her staff back, just remember that all you have to do is tap her (block or hit) and it is no longer a threat. Also as I recall, if you see her do the staff super from a distance, you can just Volt Spark her for it. Just watch you don't get hit by the super anyway. Oh and definitely don't jump at her when she has the staff, but that much should be obvious. Remember 2 things: - All her pokes move her far forward, so you can 360A them from further than you think. Also I think they have really short active time so chances are even if you miss the 360 you won't get hit for it.
Catastrophy Posted July 9, 2009 Posted July 9, 2009 I don't like using Volt Spark to respond to a staff super as they are usually waiting until the staff is behind me. Not being able to follow up on spark because you need to block the super coming up behind you seems like a waste. I'll have to practice more on those 360As for her cause man her mixup is crazy.
Osuna Posted July 10, 2009 Posted July 10, 2009 I don't like using Volt Spark to respond to a staff super as they are usually waiting until the staff is behind me. Not being able to follow up on spark because you need to block the super coming up behind you seems like a waste. I'll have to practice more on those 360As for her cause man her mixup is crazy.I think he meant the Other staff super, but even that one still hits me so I'm not sure.
Plasma Posted July 11, 2009 Posted July 11, 2009 I notice compared to other characters, A good consistent Litchi player can combo from what seems like half screen. Spark Volt is good, but any good player can see it coming or block it with that staff. Any tips for avoiding the corner in this match cause it seems particularly hard in this match if they bait out sledge hammer and have 1/3 screen combo's.
thehuntsmen5434 Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 yea I'm having trouble too. She has that one combo that can repeat about three times on Tager. Once she touches me its combo city, and I can't seem to tech at all from it.
Osuna Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 Clarified today that all of her supers win against spark volt. I wis I could see a video of 360A's catching her pokes, because I can't even hazard a guess when I'm supposed to try that. It just seems she can poke me from a range I can't punish and every mistake I make leads to the same combo, which means a lot of waiting.
Rampage Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 Same, I'm having trouble with Litchi now, her pokes are a pain.
Smurvis Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 (Edit: I forgot to specify, these questions are about Litchi with the staff and not bare-handed.) I'm having trouble with two specific things. One is her 5B > 5C (2) > 3C combo. I can't jump the 3C without IBing the 5C, but they can decide whether or not to allow both hits, as well as just NOT doing the 3C afterwards. EVEN if I jump it, I can't do anything about it. (Edit: Apparantly if I IB I can 360A or 360B her depending on the range. But it's still not as reliable as what I'm looking for.) The second is 6B and 2B. I realize that I can 360A farther than I know... but I can't do it as far as she can hit. Against really good Litchi players, I have NO answer to this move. They're smart enough to not do it at a range where I can do anything with 360A. And they're also not stupid enough to do something that's going to result in getting hit with a Spark Volt at that range. At full screen they'll dash into a 6B that would CH if I tried to Spark Volt. Between these two things, I find approach impossible without being a mind reader. I tried to look at some nicovideos of Tager and Litchi, but I can't get to the actual video. (Might have to check the forums for how to get those to work)
fragile Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 (Edit: I forgot to specify, these questions are about Litchi with the staff and not bare-handed.) I'm having trouble with two specific things. One is her 5B > 5C (2) > 3C combo. I can't jump the 3C without IBing the 5C, but they can decide whether or not to allow both hits, as well as just NOT doing the 3C afterwards. EVEN if I jump it, I can't do anything about it. (Edit: Apparantly if I IB I can 360A or 360B her depending on the range. But it's still not as reliable as what I'm looking for.) The second is 6B and 5B. I realize that I can 360A farther than I know... but I can't do it as far as she can hit. Against really good Litchi players, I have NO answer to this move. They're smart enough to not do it at a range where I can do anything with 360A. And they're also not stupid enough to do something that's going to result in getting hit with a Spark Volt at that range. At full screen they'll dash into a 6B that would CH if I tried to Spark Volt. Between these two things, I find approach impossible without being a mind reader. I tried to look at some nicovideos of Tager and Litchi, but I can't get to the actual video. (Might have to check the forums for how to get those to work) I have the same problem with her. If she spams 6B I try to sjC or jC to get above it.. other than that, I just try to charge as much as possible and Yomi my way with bolt. :S
Koozebanian Fazoob Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 I don't like using Volt Spark to respond to a staff super as they are usually waiting until the staff is behind me. Not being able to follow up on spark because you need to block the super coming up behind you seems like a waste. Yeah actually I've changed my mind on this. Her staff super (the controllable one) is really very dangerous to try to do anything to. You can make the super really cover the hell out of someone, and Litchi can bait/punish sledges in the mean time. I'll have to practice more on those 360As for her cause man her mixup is crazy. I hope you mean without the staff, because Litchi has absolutely no mixup with the staff on. Like I said, if she's just poking you endlessly with the staff safely, just wait till you have a Volt Spark. The match turns slightly in your favor once you have it, as it really limits what exactly she can be doing. You can't really approach Litchi in this match, for the most part. 2D, 236B, jump in, these are all really easy to see and a good Litchi isn't going to let you get away with them. Your best bet is to try and match her spacing and try and fiddle in a random hit. If Litchi drops her staff or sends it out, this is good for YOU. Suddenly your pokes are MUCH better than hers, and she no longer has a DP or anything resembling AA at all. You can't be afraid of it hitting you, you need to use this time to get in and at minimum, get her to block something that gives her magnetism. You need to learn the timing on when the staff's first and second hit start/end, because say for example if litchi throws the staff and then IADs at you, you can probably 236A, 2C her for a launch into massive damage. Also, Litchi gets Negative Penalty insanely easily. If she gets it, hit her. Do whatever it takes, even if you have to blow 100% meter to do it. Any basic combo you land on her with negative penalty is going to do 80-90% of her life.
Catastrophy Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 She doesn't have the staff for very long when I play her so yes I only mean w/o staff on mixup. Also, I never have problems against a defensive Litchi...it's the good rushdown she has that can tear me up. The only character in this game that I see Negative Penalty often on is Rachel because a lot of people tend to back up as if they were Nu to zone with all those projectiles.
ConHuevosGuey Posted July 19, 2009 Posted July 19, 2009 I'm curious of this matchup, I ran into a Litchi last night that had me in what almost seemed like an infinite combo she would do over and over. I don't use Litchi much so I'm not sure what the hell she was doing but it was like the same 4 hits over and over and I couldn't tech out of it, definitely one of the tougher Tager match-ups. Curious in know what the hell this was and how to avoid/get out of it.
Osuna Posted July 19, 2009 Posted July 19, 2009 If you're talking about her staffless loop, you don't get out of it until after around 13-14 hits. As far as avoiding it she can do it from 90+% of any hit she lands on you, so that's not going to happen either, learn how to block her moves and avoid stupid counterhits. Also, don't be tempted to burst too early, I'm rather fond of my barrier in this match, and the loop is annoying, but the damage you would save is not actually worth it unless you are dying and even then I'd rather have my barrier.
ConHuevosGuey Posted July 19, 2009 Posted July 19, 2009 I see, that must be the one then because she didn't have her staff and I'm also a fan of keeping my barrier, especially with Tager. He has enough health to where you don't ever wanna burst early, I really save it for the end of the line.
Brent-quest Posted July 20, 2009 Posted July 20, 2009 DP Punish 50% meter 4900 damage CH 5C>2D>RC>6A>2C>Atomic>6C>Atomic
Osuna Posted July 20, 2009 Posted July 20, 2009 DP Punish 50% meter 4900 damage CH 5C>2D>RC>6A>2C>Atomic>6C>AtomicI though you could only 6C corridor Tao and people in the corner? (oh right, magnets>.>) nvm. If we were awesome we'd probably be 720ing her with some combination of IBing and walking forward.
RedTao Posted July 20, 2009 Posted July 20, 2009 -sweet advice- Thanks, that's some awesome help. Even if it's not what I wanted to hear. No way to approach her... looks like it's time for another waiting game. Oh well, at least Litchi will let you get some mag charges off. Bleh. This is pretty simple, but don't forget that 236B goes through her staff anytime it's not in her hands. A lot of Litchis will boomerang their staff at you for cover in order to start a rushdown - most characters have to sit and block or dance around until it returns - but you can sledge away. Even if you just tap her the staff will drop and you don't have to worry about getting thwacked in the back of the head.
Smurvis Posted July 20, 2009 Posted July 20, 2009 I realized my problem with 5B > 6B (2) > 3C was just me not being used to pressure. Between that and 6B with staff pokes, I was getting locked down. Seems that sj.C is a great way to get around 6B. If Litchi starts predicting that, empty jumps with just guard or barrier guard stop the DP or j.B? (not sure which j. it is). Makes it a little bit easier to get around her 6B pokes and close in. Not sure if there's more that she could do that she's not, so forgive me if this is info is useless. Now that I've found more options on what I can do, I'm understanding this fight a lot better. I'm finding that Collider > 6C > 5D > Voltic Charge is making people start teching early since I'm not doing 5D > Collider and they're getting greedy cause they don't want me to get spark volt ready. So a lot of the times if I don't have magnetism I'll throw out a test 5D > Collider just to see and I'm catching a lot of people with it. I'm having trouble gold bursting the DP though into 720. I think it's just a matter of training and timing and watching for the combo. I didn't even realize that Barrier Burst was blockable until I watched a few replays. Which makes sense, if I time the Burst during the invincible frames on Litchi's DP. A lot to learn, new to both Aksys and the fighting game scene as a whole, but it's a lot of fun.
Mike Z Posted July 21, 2009 Posted July 21, 2009 I did it in the tourney at Evo (sorry Ken!) Basically, if she has the staff coming back and does a 6C, next part of the combo is either DP or 5C xx DP.
DiasFlac Posted July 28, 2009 Posted July 28, 2009 Litchi is a pain for me. I've never lost to one seeing I don't play against them much but from the ones I've have played and beaten I was able to tell she'll be tough to play against when played by someone who knows what they're with her. but this info it good. I've recently played with all the characters for a bit to get to know there moves so its a matter of playing this match up more and using this info to help me win.
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