10stars Posted July 10, 2009 Posted July 10, 2009 This match is imo, 7-3 for Bang. Tager has crap to really stop Bang from doing what he wants. The opener If Tager thinks you're going to open with some tk drive nails and uses sledge, 2d, a teleport, and eat him. If Tager thinks you're going to open with 2d he CAN walk forward and 360 you, but I haven't seen it happen yet. So 2d really isn't that bad of an opener, but if you're seeing the 360 happening off the start, tk drive nails to make him block, and move in for mixup. Tager decides to just block and see what's going to happen: You can deep dash, jump (you keep your dash momentum if you dash jump) hit j.A, which will make Tager either block, or get hit, then crossup j.4C after the j.A is done. Deep dash jump j.As ducked still allow you to do the crossup j.4C, whether he ducks the j.A or not. Bang Oki Tager doesn't have a dp, instead he has a very crummy version of heat fist, if you suspect him getting ready to counter your jump for his wakeup, deep jumping is again a viable option, as the j.a will counter hit tager, or his heat fist will just plain whiff for no reason anyway. If you suspect a 360 on wakeup, again - deep jump! free counter hits and stuff. If you think he's just going to block, feel free to go in for mixup. Think he's going to sledge on wakeup? 2d > eat him. Bumpers! After a midscreen OR corner 2c, 214C and 214A bumper placements are perfect for working in crossups on Tager. Remember that even in the corner Tager can be crossed up by normal jumping. On the defensive When you're cross screen from Tager if his magnet gauge is filled, you CAN react to the chest fireball with 2d > teleport to him, free combo. If you get hit by a buster, watch for followups afterwards, Tagers mixup is really slow and very punishable. His stomp overhead can be 2d ch on reaction, same with his 6C overhead, so you can be lazy and instead of going from crouching to standing, just chill crouching and hit drive. If you get magnetized from a heat fist combo, when recovering try not to jump, you'll be cross screen from him and can safely just avoid him while the magnetism wears off. However if you jumped and he's heat fisting again, you'll get sucked in, your option at this point is to toss a nail at him for a counter hit then follow up with mixup when you land. Drives 2d is your friend, your best friend. Only use on reaction to things though, mashing your drive button will get you 360d like its tagers only move. 5d is meh, 2d is the way to go, but that's only because of the follow ups that bang has to it. 6d is bleh, don't bother using it against Tager outside of combos.
Order Jeff Posted July 10, 2009 Posted July 10, 2009 If you are magnetized, launched, and Tager is using his anti-air grab, you can tech really late and use the magnetic momentum to close the gap very quickly, buffer the dp motion then command grab right as you land in front of him during his recovery. Very high risk but also high reward imo, plus if you pull it off you look totally pro.
AtTheGates Posted July 11, 2009 Posted July 11, 2009 2d is highly risky as an opener, and gets beaten by for example 5A. 5D is ok as an opener, but gets beaten by tager's anti-air (if he actually expects you to jump). j.A is absolutely vital for that matchup. use it while jumping up and see what happens, you will still have a lot of movement options, then. you can also sometimes do a j.A out of a blockstring, then while you land behind him j.B or j.4C and so on.
10stars Posted July 12, 2009 Author Posted July 12, 2009 2d is highly risky as an opener, and gets beaten by for example 5A. 5D is ok as an opener, but gets beaten by tager's anti-air (if he actually expects you to jump). j.A is absolutely vital for that matchup. use it while jumping up and see what happens, you will still have a lot of movement options, then. you can also sometimes do a j.A out of a blockstring, then while you land behind him j.B or j.4C and so on. Correct, 2d is high risk. Also brings a high reward if Tager sledges though.
SSMugen Posted July 14, 2009 Posted July 14, 2009 Sorry If this isn't correct but I don't have the game with me right now to test if this works 100%. I was thinking that if you were magnetized and you jump in the air to bait the Atomic Collider that you could use the magnetic momentum to use D Nails to Hit Tager before he grabs you and you'll be able to combo him after they hit.
10stars Posted July 14, 2009 Author Posted July 14, 2009 Sorry If this isn't correct but I don't have the game with me right now to test if this works 100%. I was thinking that if you were magnetized and you jump in the air to bait the Atomic Collider that you could use the magnetic momentum to use D Nails to Hit Tager before he grabs you and you'll be able to combo him after they hit. Risky, sometimes you'll be pulled in front of your nails and he'll still hit his heatfist. But yeah it does work, I've done it before.
solidshake Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 i keep eating spin cycle when trying to 2D on oki. it's pretty funny to watch (happened twice in my last tager match), and i imagine it's safe if i do C teleport, but i've decided to just not try oki if he has 50+ heat
AtTheGates Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 oh, since it hasn't been mentioned yet: i think 3C is quite good in this matchup, once you attacked a couple of times with jump, shuri, late airdash, and airdash in general. max range 3C, of course. also nice to catch tager out of the air from far away, but it depends on the specific situation - sometimes his late j.B can beat the slide.
AtTheGates Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 i keep eating spin cycle when trying to 2D on oki. i often eat a spin cycle when i want to j.4C over tager- the hit will clash, then the super will hit you, so don't go for a j.4C if he has 50% and trigger happy.
10stars Posted July 15, 2009 Author Posted July 15, 2009 When tager has 50% and i get a knockdown combo, normally i go for anything that knocks him down with a 6d, that way he's forced to neutral tech, and i can 7 jump away from him, throw shurikens, and dash back in. This way if he throws the distortion, he just destroys some nails instead of destroying bang.
AtTheGates Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 When tager has 50% and i get a knockdown combo, normally i go for anything that knocks him down with a 6d, that way he's forced to neutral tech, and i can 7 jump away from him, throw shurikens, and dash back in. This way if he throws the distortion, he just destroys some nails instead of destroying bang. yeah, if i get a corner knockdown and expect a lariat super, i usually jump back at the last moment, then j.236C shuri. if it hits late, it will web him out of the super.
SSMugen Posted July 15, 2009 Posted July 15, 2009 Wouldn't j.236 B be a more reliable way to knock him out of it as the original shuriken will eat the auto guard then the following explosion would hit him out of it? (just theory fighter atm cannot test this out)
10stars Posted July 15, 2009 Author Posted July 15, 2009 Wouldn't j.236 B be a more reliable way to knock him out of it as the original shuriken will eat the auto guard then the following explosion would hit him out of it? (just theory fighter atm cannot test this out) Immediate air dash is not available after anything besides drive nails. The rest of them have landing recovery. If you can predict it well enough to do a B nail, then you might as well just 2d it.
RPGsFTW Posted July 17, 2009 Posted July 17, 2009 Don't know if this is already known, but it might be very useful. If you hit Tager with 2B >6C, him blocking or not, you can jump after your 6C, already known, and dash away, if needed, or you can do a j.4C. It seemed to me like a very good mix-up, especially if it hits, allowing for more extended combos on him.
AtTheGates Posted July 17, 2009 Posted July 17, 2009 Don't know if this is already known, but it might be very useful. If you hit Tager with 2B >6C, him blocking or not, you can jump after your 6C, already known, and dash away, if needed, or you can do a j.4C. It seemed to me like a very good mix-up, especially if it hits, allowing for more extended combos on him. can't tager crouch the 6C? if he can, you are DEAD. also, if you hit with 6C, what's the point in escaping ^^
RPGsFTW Posted July 17, 2009 Posted July 17, 2009 can't tager crouch the 6C? if he can, you are DEAD. also, if you hit with 6C, what's the point in escaping ^^ I was saying that if he guarded, and sometimes if you hit, you can just jump over with a j.4C to mix it up a little, not that it's necessary at all, but as another option to possibly be safe. I do not know if he can crouch block the 6C. He is quite tall after all, so maybe not. I'd have to check.
AtTheGates Posted July 17, 2009 Posted July 17, 2009 well, using 6C in a blockstring is suicide imo, if it whiffs, you are wide open, like, 1,5 seconds.
Browncoat3 Posted July 21, 2009 Posted July 21, 2009 Tager can crouch the 6C and it will whiff completely. Trust me.
Reioumu Posted July 22, 2009 Posted July 22, 2009 I forgot, can Tager 360 6b after you're in the air?
sergetrigger Posted August 16, 2009 Posted August 16, 2009 Found out that Tager can eat through a burst with his B command grab... Won't connect though, but still able to put pressure like that.
seventwenty1 Posted August 17, 2009 Posted August 17, 2009 I forgot, can Tager 360 6b after you're in the air? as in throw you out of the move? no he can't, but he can throw you during your long ass recovery if he blocks it and i thought only his 360A and 720C throws could eat a burst? iono I do know that if he's mashing either of those moves he can throw you out of a meaty cross-up j.4C....bulllllllshiiiiiiiiit, so I've had to learn to watch for that. I played Sol in guilty gear so I love this match as on Tager and a few others you get to do a nice little sidewinder loop 5b > 2B > 6C > j.623B > 2B > 623B > 66 6C > j.623B if you start with 5A or a jump attack though, the second 623B won't connect so you do something like j.4C > 5B > 2B > 6C > j.623B > 2B > 6C > j.B > j.C > j.623B which does the same/better damage but just isn't as cool
WUT Posted August 17, 2009 Posted August 17, 2009 I love fighting tager. He can't stop you from doing anything and the only things you need to watch out for are mashing on 5/2a, throws (all except 360b during pressure), and spinny super. If they try to psychic aa during a gap in your pressure via 2c (lol), either autoguard or nail. J.d is awesome. Ch punish on any command throw attempt. I always have 4-seals when fighting tager. Bang install is awesome against him, but some of the stuff he can mash on (2c, j.2c, 360a, spinny super) are a real pain when it comes to pressuring him.
ShoMeYaMoves Posted August 17, 2009 Posted August 17, 2009 as in throw you out of the move? no he can't, but he can throw you during your long ass recovery if he blocks it and i thought only his 360A and 720C throws could eat a burst? iono I do know that if he's mashing either of those moves he can throw you out of a meaty cross-up j.4C....bulllllllshiiiiiiiiit, so I've had to learn to watch for that. I played Sol in guilty gear so I love this match as on Tager and a few others you get to do a nice little sidewinder loop 5b > 2B > 6C > j.623B > 2B > 623B > 66 6C > j.623B if you start with 5A or a jump attack though, the second 623B won't connect so you do something like j.4C > 5B > 2B > 6C > j.623B > 2B > 6C > j.B > j.C > j.623B which does the same/better damage but just isn't as cool You can also do the loop from counter hit j.D and rapid cancelled 6B. It works on some characters other than Tager as well, but it's easiest on him.
RPGsFTW Posted August 18, 2009 Posted August 18, 2009 Wow. I must be the only Bang that hates fighting Tager. Yesterday's weekly tourney here in Vegas I got 2nd, losing to a Tager. I love playing as Tager, him being my 2nd and all, but I hate fighting him. Whenever he grabs me I swear to god that I tech, but no, I'll eat that 3000+ grab combo damage instead. I hate it. I know that I can mess up Tager real bad, but once I get magic grabbed out of nothing and I don't tech, like I plan to, I lose. I'm thinking that maybe I'll actually learn a bit more about FuRinKaZan just for this match-up.
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