mAc Chaos Posted June 18, 2013 Posted June 18, 2013 > Yes pay attention to when your opponent wants to press buttons. Hakumen is the worst character to press buttons on when you're on the defensive. What about Jin. He practically lives off it. As for using Renka and followups in case something got blocked, remember that it's not the end of the world if they block and don't mash out. You will be safe most of the time and can just block and wait for your next chance. You should just do Renka when you think they will mash out or when they have mashed out before, rather than just "OH SHIT THEY BLOCKED, RENKA TO COVER MYSELF."
Saeor12 Posted June 18, 2013 Posted June 18, 2013 Yeah I tend to stagger my attacks and either go for the Renka or try for the 3C CH when I think he is going to press buttons. And Mac, funny that you mention Jin since that is who my friend plays as.
BladeOfJustice7 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 What about Jin. He practically lives off it. You forget Jin also has shenanigans and scumbag tools. Hakumen does, have shenanigans and scumbag tools, they're just not as readily accessible as Jin's Yeah I tend to stagger my attacks and either go for the Renka or try for the 3C CH when I think he is going to press buttons. And Mac, funny that you mention Jin since that is who my friend plays as. Don't make 3c your aim during your block string, as it is terrible move when blocked. 3c should only be used to outspace or punish your opponent. Nothing else. What is the Jin player mashing to get out of your pressure exactly?
mAc Chaos Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 (edited) Man I was all set to troll Toan or something when I saw this post in the post feed until I saw it was a new forumer. Stagger is when you deliberately pause and delay your attacks, to give yourself some time to see if the other person is going to try and do something. So if you are fighting a Ragna, and he loves to Inferno Divider, instead of just trying to attack him as fast as you can and giving him the chance to Inferno Divider you, you will instead poke him once, pause and see how he reacts, then poke again, and so on. It tends to mess with the defender's reflexes, and sometimes might cause them to try and attack only to get hit. Sometimes that tiny, slight delay will convince them that you are not going to do anything, and they will think they can successfully attack. But since you only delayed it a little, they will not be able to make it in time and you'll still hit them. Basically it's almost a trap to make them stop blocking so they get hit. It's almost its own type of mixup. It can also have the effect of actually making them block MORE. Why? Well, if they already tried to poke out a few times while you were doing this delay pressure, then they will be afraid the next time that they'll be walking into this trap. So they will hesitate next time there is a pause, and that gives you more freedom to try and do slower things without getting hit. Edited June 19, 2013 by mAc Chaos
mAc Chaos Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 By the way, if you're still confused, just ask. It can be hard to figure out the difference between that and just baiting stuff if you never saw it before.
Saeor12 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 What is the Jin player mashing to get out of your pressure exactly? Just random 5A's and 2A's. It's not that bad, but its just enough for him to air dash away or get a small combo going to start his ice shenanigans.
BladeOfJustice7 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 You haven't gotten him to respect your pressure yet if he's hitting buttons in order to get out or to get a combo.
Bluddy Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 Man I was all set to troll Toan or something when I saw this post in the post feed until I saw it was a new forumer. Stagger is when you deliberately pause and delay your attacks, to give yourself some time to see if the other person is going to try and do something. So if you are fighting a Ragna, and he loves to Inferno Divider, instead of just trying to attack him as fast as you can and giving him the chance to Inferno Divider you, you will instead poke him once, pause and see how he reacts, then poke again, and so on. It tends to mess with the defender's reflexes, and sometimes might cause them to try and attack only to get hit. Sometimes that tiny, slight delay will convince them that you are not going to do anything, and they will think they can successfully attack. But since you only delayed it a little, they will not be able to make it in time and you'll still hit them. Basically it's almost a trap to make them stop blocking so they get hit. It's almost its own type of mixup. It can also have the effect of actually making them block MORE. Why? Well, if they already tried to poke out a few times while you were doing this delay pressure, then they will be afraid the next time that they'll be walking into this trap. So they will hesitate next time there is a pause, and that gives you more freedom to try and do slower things without getting hit. Oh if that's it then it ain't new, I'm just not familiar with terms and stuff. I'm new to the forum, not the game Anyway, wat to do with a Tao that zones
mAc Chaos Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 (edited) push the off button on the console ill try to post something later tonight even though that was the best advice Edited June 19, 2013 by mAc Chaos
BladeOfJustice7 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 > jin > respect You can get him to respect your pressure like any other character lol. And I honestly hate Tao.
Saeor12 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 Thanks for all the advice...now if i can just get used to netplay and not drop all of my corner combos lol
dioxideUniversa Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 Anyway, wat to do with a Tao that zones do not let tao get a life lead so zoning does not happen do not let tao get away once you establish momentum do not push slow and unnecessarily risky buttons (a lot of them in this matchup compared to others)
BladeOfJustice7 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 Thanks for all the advice...now if i can just get used to netplay and not drop all of my corner combos lol If you're not a regular netplayer, simplify your combos make them slightly shorter you don't need to do your extremely advanced combos if it means you'll drop them 60% of the time due to lag. And strengthen your neutral game too. I'm more reliant on my neutral game online than offline to be honest with you.
Saeor12 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 I do pretty basic combos already online or at least try to. The main combos i drop are throw, Gurren, hop 5a, and j2C mistimed in the corner combos so it blue beats.
BladeOfJustice7 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 j2C mistimed in the corner combos so it blue beats. Those are the hardest to perform online, so I usually go for 1 or 2 loops less to get guaranteed damage. If it bluebeats you're lucky lol.
dioxideUniversa Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 dropping throws hop 2a > 5a instead of hop 5a can help you salvage these against most characters (but not against characters like noel where the 2a is required)
BlackYakuzu94 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 You can get him to respect your pressure like any other character lol. Not when they spam 623C.
BladeOfJustice7 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 Not when they spam 623C. >meaty 2a >rehhyou whiffs your active frames >punish rehhyou into "hold that shit"-combo
BlackYakuzu94 Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 >meaty 2a >rehhyou whiffs your active frames >punish rehhyou into "hold that shit"-combo My timing is severely off then.
dioxideUniversa Posted June 19, 2013 Posted June 19, 2013 it's a 20 frame startup DP, meaty 2a only has up to 11 frames recovery
BladeOfJustice7 Posted June 20, 2013 Posted June 20, 2013 My timing is severely off then. rehhyou (623c) is only really used to beat really fast dps that have short startup time, hotaru/inferno divider. That is because it is a VERY slow dp as dioxide pointed out. There's a reason you rarely see Jin players use it in matches. The only dp you have to be afraid of is Hirenso (623d), which will most likely be used once they have 25% heat. Otherwise, unless you're extremely telegraphed in your matches, you don't need to worry about his dp's on wakeup. If I remember correctly bang can even 5b through Jin's rehhyou on wakeup.
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