rei-Scarred Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 Wow I can understand complaining about something thats an obvious change but whats this about getting all up in arms about an ambiguous statement? How is "3C knocks enemy into air" == "3C 236D~C does not combo"?? Like seriously when I read that my first thought was "pointless change it just makes the combo look different" Complain if you see a video of it not comboing.
smooshman Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 nobody is "supposed" to have the best anything, and that's just stupid reasoning but it does seem to be how this game is being run nowadays. ragna had the best dp in ct, he has the best dp in cs, people have just come to expect that from him, and I think it's wrong. if his dp only has the one hit (air), it means it won't magically restart from a clash leading to an easy dp, and he'll be left vulerable for counter-hit, i know it's a small change that seems insignificant, but it will fix "chance-hits" that seem to happen. actually it happens a lot, it helps give them a base line to work around. I mean look at ID then look at every other DP, don't tell me it wasn't designed to be the best.
Kristoph Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 That's why I included that last line It's not like we're forced to get stuck with CSII changes. At least not for competitive shit. you mean that one?
FormerlyUnknown Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 actually it happens a lot, it helps give them a base line to work around. I mean look at ID then look at every other DP, don't tell me it wasn't designed to be the best. so they're baseing all of ragna around his dp...great... seriously though, it's rigid thinking like that that keeps games from becomeing balance, it's hard to look at the rest of the cast and see he was purposefully designed to be able to mash dp when there are only 5 characters that have dps and they all work like ragnas (aside from mu's) what was the thing they based kune off of that they kept from ct, one would think it would be his curseing, but they were perfectly fine with completely redoing kunes curse from the ground up.
smooshman Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 seriously though, it's rigid thinking like that that keeps games from becomeing balance, it's hard to look at the rest of the cast and see he was purposefully designed to be able to mash dp when there are only 5 characters that have dps and they all work like ragnas (aside from mu's) what I mean is that his DP is designed to be better than everyone elses, and it by leaps and bounds, and his is the only DP in BB that has an air and ground version and has actual follow ups (Jin's doesn't count). that being said having the best DP=/=just mash it and win even if it maintained the nerfs from the 1st loketest it still would be the best.... in fact, imo, the only way they could realistically make it not the best is the seriously buff the other DP's. what I meant by it having a base line means they can get a general idea of where the character's going, not necessarily just base the character around one move (though that can happen).
Varamathras Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 stuff No, they based Arakune around the principle of the curse; it's that it was completely broken in CT was the reason it was changed so much.
FormerlyUnknown Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 what I mean is that his DP is designed to be better than everyone elses, and it by leaps and bounds, and his is the only DP in BB that has an air and ground version and has actual follow ups (Jin's doesn't count). that being said having the best DP=/=just mash it and win even if it maintained the nerfs from the 1st loketest it still would be the best.... in fact, imo, the only way they could realistically make it not the best is the seriously buff the other DP's. what I meant by it having a base line means they can get a general idea of where the character's going, not necessarily just base the character around one move (though that can happen). it's obvious to everyone that ragna's dp is better than the entire cast, i know that. and I get that it's supposed to be better than everyone elses, but that doesn't make it immune to nerfing. if that means nerfing the rest of the cast's dp just so that you can nerf this one persons, that's a stupid reason, but so be it. you could fix up ragnas dp and it will always be the best, if only for the fact it has 2 verions, you can do both in the air and can auto-combo off of it. that in itself makes it better than the other dps, you don't also need 2 hits, instant startup, and super easy extra hits. also why does he even need 2 versions, does anyone use the d version? i've never seen it come out in competitive play since all his combos come from the c version. the d version just seems un-needed and extra. @varamathras: i understand that, but it seemed they just made curse more risk/reward than it needs to be. you were very quick to shoot down everything i posted, so i have to ask, how was what I put for his curse system so terrible. in ct, it was you hit them once = you win, in cs its you hit them 5 times + hit once more = win, why can't curse be on and off throughout the match with easy curses+limited curse time. in ct it was way too easy to curse and it was constantly switching, in cs it's harder to curse but once you get it you're stuck with the same motion over...and over...and over...throughout the match until your opponent dies. if you meet somewhere in the middle with the system (and change the bugs/ we stop calling them bugs...cause they're not...) I don't see what's the problem
AdamNW Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 Platinum seems like Tira times three Are we going to have a platinum-coated trash can?
smooshman Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 it's obvious to everyone that ragna's dp is better than the entire cast, i know that. and I get that it's supposed to be better than everyone elses, but that doesn't make it immune to nerfing. if that means nerfing the rest of the cast's dp just so that you can nerf this one persons, that's a stupid reason, but so be it. you could fix up ragnas dp and it will always be the best, if only for the fact it has 2 verions, you can do both in the air and can auto-combo off of it. that in itself makes it better than the other dps, you don't also need 2 hits, instant startup, and super easy extra hits. also why does he even need 2 versions, does anyone use the d version? i've never seen it come out in competitive play since all his combos come from the c version. the d version just seems un-needed and extra. D version drains life, and I think it's more powerful, the "instant" start up is only the air version. the 2 hits was actually explained above, but basically it's so they they don't just tech before the follow ups. I'm sorry if I implied that it can't be nerfed, it just seems that the nerfs you suggest are kinda things inherent to DP's. My problem with it is that Ragna can get some stupid damage with it considering that it's a reversal, so the untechable time off the the non-followups could go down, but beyond that I can't really think of much else. Also it's a bad idea to just eliminate a move.
FormerlyUnknown Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 i get what your point is, and i understand the 2'nd hit, i just think it sucks that it pretty much makes ID unstoppable =p i guess i just have a problem with how dps are built, full-invincible aa's that are usually the best/most spamable moves in a characters move-list =p i blame street fighter for this, since that's where the dp comes from. i say keep dp in street fighter =p it's terrible anyway. also i fermly beleive that if a move is pointless/broken/useless, it should be removed, not buffed/nerfed, but removed (see FRKZ)
Mightfo Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 i like how anyone is horribly concerned at "omg my bnb is totally gone" especially when it's characters like hazama who people thought was shit for a while until they figured out combos. i am reminded of them removing pivotal litchi combo stuff during CS loketests and her ending up just fine in comboability.
zeth07 Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 i'm dissapointed in what i've seen for the locktests, but that's just me. I have my own ideas on what should happen, but then again so does everyone so i'm not going to expect anything i want to happen. (and my changes are too much for just a patch, perhaps bb3 but again they're never going to happen) in terms of nerf/buff all i have to say is: bang- remove FRKZ steal rain impossible without nails daifunka no longer hits knocked down less daifunka invincibility triple-nails don't bounce no pheonix wall-bounce (they did this =D) these are the only characters i've spent time thinking about =p if we're not doing the whole "wishlist" thing i'll delete it but i just felt like giveing my two cents o3o If that's not trolling then I don't know what is anymore.
FormerlyUnknown Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 If that's not trolling then I don't know what is anymore. oh plz bang has so many tools in this game you can just shut up =p the man doesn't need 4 supers to everyone else (aside from tao)'s 2
AdamNW Posted October 9, 2010 Posted October 9, 2010 also i fermly beleive that if a move is pointless/broken/useless, it should be removed, not buffed/nerfed, but removed (see FRKZ) That's like saying Arakune's curse should be removed.
FormerlyUnknown Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 That's like saying Arakune's curse should be removed. arakune's curse is the only way he's going to get some damage, hence he needs it. it needs to be changed, but if you take it away he's not a playable character anymore. whereass FRKZ is used purely for trolling and is not vital to bangs gameplay in any way.
smooshman Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 i get what your point is, and i understand the 2'nd hit, i just think it sucks that it pretty much makes ID unstoppable =p i guess i just have a problem with how dps are built, full-invincible aa's that are usually the best/most spamable moves in a characters move-list =p i blame street fighter for this, since that's where the dp comes from. i say keep dp in street fighter =p it's terrible anyway. if someone is spamming DP's then.... bad things happen to them. You just have to get over the fact that your pressure and approach isn't free like Litchi's or Bang's.... or CT top 3 for that matter.
FormerlyUnknown Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 if someone is spamming DP's then.... bad things happen to them. You just have to get over the fact that your pressure and approach isn't free like Litchi's or Bang's.... or CT top 3 for that matter. you forgot to bold usually as well o3o just sayin.
Mightfo Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 If that's not trolling then I don't know what is anymore. nah man..you just dont understand..ct bang was overpowered as hell...he knows because having more supers than others breaks an arbitrary rule
FormerlyUnknown Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 nah man..you just dont understand..ct bang was overpowered as hell...he knows because having more supers than others breaks an arbitrary rule ct bang was wonderfull, i had fun matches against him. however when you nerf an entire cast and buff 1-3 characters, they tend to end up broken in the long run. bang was fine and then they buffed him, now he's not fine so they need to nerf him.
Alex073088 Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 If they are going to make 6a like cs, it needs to be top invunerable im sick in tired of fuckin players jump mindlessly against rachel. in a game where jumping is very friendly espically for litchi arakune taokaka ragna jin and bang characters need good anti air moves. This will lead blazblue more in the direction of a better overall fighting game.
smooshman Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 ^agreed, BB needs good AA's.... in fact I'm pretty sure Ragna's the only one with reliable AA. you forgot to bold usually as well o3o just sayin. but they're never spammable.... not even hotaru which is +3.
Leaf Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 i like how anyone is horribly concerned at "omg my bnb is totally gone" especially when it's characters like hazama who people thought was shit for a while until they figured out combos. i am reminded of them removing pivotal litchi combo stuff during CS loketests and her ending up just fine in comboability. Hazama's new BnB will probably be 5B>3C>2B>5C>2C>4D>air shit
FormerlyUnknown Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 i have to stop replying the moment everyone replies =p but anyway yes spamable is wrong, i apologize, overpowered is usually correct though in terms of the rest of the characters movelist
Whiteboywilly Posted October 10, 2010 Posted October 10, 2010 arakune's curse is the only way he's going to get some damage, hence he needs it. it needs to be changed, but if you take it away he's not a playable character anymore. whereass FRKZ is used purely for trolling and is not vital to bangs gameplay in any way. Dude bang has some crazy damage frkz combos.
Recommended Posts