[CS2] Mu-12 CS2 Changes Discussion

[pulsr]

I don't know what to say, I've been staring at this stupid box forever and can't think of anything. Just give her to me already so I can quit her and go get my magical girl on.

[NickExtreme1]

I don't know what to say, I've been staring at this stupid box forever and can't think of anything. Just give her to me already so I can quit her and go get my magical girl on.

Same, but with the wolf man :/

[Shinkada]

^^Exactly, so we get to keep all our oki off grounded hits into 6C. Except now average damage is a bit higher, and our block-strings are a bit better (trying to end on 2C is a big improvement on ending on 3C), and we can get oki from a farther range. Though the j2C will probably nerf our max damage stuff (like the 6C>7.2k).

When you put it that way it sounds really good. I hope you're right about it. Honestly the 7.2kFC pissed me off because it was so stupidly strong, I'm all for punishing people for falling for what is effectively a spacing tool (as opposed to reliable combo-starter) but 5-5.5k would've been just fine. 7.2? Ridiculous. So imo Mu is doing well.

And Pulsr, you're seriously switching to Platinum? That's sad, you're the best Mu there is. :c

You'll just have to step up your game, Ve. ;3

[MainG_Jago]

Mu is starting not to seem as fun as she is now

with unlimited Mu you not really get off a proper oki because people got it by the steins while you set it up i wonder if this works the same 4 loketest 5 Mu

PS i want to fight Pulsr

[FlyingVe]

~>6C>5D>214D>5C>6C>oki should provide exactly the same oki we get now. Depending on how high the opponent is after the 'splosion, it might be even better.

This is assuming all the previous changes were kept.

[Jugiatsu]

I have to say I am not keen on a lot of the changes these loketests have brought to Mu. I am also by no means a hardcore player though so I guess these changes are relecting the best "interests" of tournament based individuals. To me BlazBlue was always a grab some friends and throw down for some matches and have fun doing it. We all definitely had the "play for fun" rather than the "play to win" mentality.

That being said, once these changes are implemented can we please get a new/updated combo thread going reflecting all these changes? I am afraid with all the changes we have gone through I have somewhat lost track of all way Mu's combos perform now. Like one of my favorites was:

2B->5C->2C->j.C->j.2C->2B->5C->2C->j.C->j.2C->2B->632146 C. Her Omoikane loop. Did I even spell that right? However now, I dont think that combo is valid anymore. So yeah new combo thread when patch comes out anyone?

[Zeromus_X]

We'll definitely have to make up new combos once the patch hits. I'm kind of worried how her max damage will end up with no more corner loops, no more pickup off the ground after j2C, or 6A/6B juggles. Sword of Decimation and the faster steins will probably play more of a part in combos.

Edit: And 236A too apparently.

[FlyingVe]

MU

Close range Tsurugi Combos are being found?

Make of that what you will.

Regarding her max damage. Just going straight into Omohikane without the extraneous hits (loops) still does a ton of damage. If you combo into the super you will still be getting an easy 5k.

[Zeromus_X]

I wonder if this means SoD wallbounces at level 1 now? This would give us more options. Like maybe "...SoD, dash 6A, 2C, 6C" or something.

[Synthesis]

Or, SoD dash 6A 2C 6C 5D 214D SoD etc...

[FlyingVe]

In a previous test they said SoD had more untech time, so it's probably related to that. If true, it seems it's quite a bit more untech time, we may have a whole new FC 6C loop.

I also cleaned up the OP so it's easier to see what has been done, and what is buffed or nerfed.

Edit: after this final Loketest is done, I will compile it all into one big list of changes, not separated by tests.

Edit #2: I'd also like to add, looking at the changes on the whole, Mu is looking more threatening in CS2 than she is now (in CS1).

Edited November 17, 2010 by FlyingVe

[Silfer]

~>6C>5D>214D>5C>6C>oki should provide exactly the same oki we get now. Depending on how high the opponent is after the 'splosion, it might be even better.

This is assuming all the previous changes were kept.

Its my understanding that 214D explosions lift the character a bit on every hit, so thats that.

Also sod having more untech time is nice...663B pickups in the corner maybe?

Its looking good overall, specially considering how badly some other characters where hit. She lost her initial combos, but her general playstyle remained largely unchanged and she got good buffs in key areas as well.

[FlyingVe]

I was bored so I updated the thread again. The top half of the OP now lists the cumulative changes to Mu-12 over the course of the loketest, and the second half has the old list by Loktest word for word. Looking at the cumulative list, Mu's gotten alot more Buffs than Nerfs.

Here's the cumulative list:

Compilation of all Changes:

Buffs:

+2B>2C combos

+2C>6C combos

+Better recovery on D's

+236A now has 5 hits

+236A Increased untech time

+63214C increased untech time

+2B longer reach

+3C jump cancelable

+D's have more guaranteed frames

+New combos off 63214C

+ ~>(214D>6C>5D)xN

+ 236A>Dash2B>~

Nerfs:

-j3D removed?

-3C techable

-6B less forward movement

-j2C no longer knocks down

-6A shorter untech time

System Changes (Relevant to Mu-12):

+Guard Crush no longer prorates

+Guard Primers reduced by half (rounded down) after any burst

Edited November 17, 2010 by FlyingVe

[pulsr]

Well, honestly these changes help her a lot. 95% of the time you are just out of range to land the 2b combos but it makes rage that they give this to her after they remove tech time on 3c. The 2C, 6C is freaking amazing though.

j2C is the one i'm really curious about.

[TD]

Does omhikane keep it's min. damage? l was going to drop her honestly post patch but tbh these changes are very interesting...

[NickExtreme1]

Increased untech time on 63214C and increased 2B range made me go

So much more combo potential if these changes stick

[FlyingVe]

Mu

- Tsurugi wallbounce is restricted to the end of the screen (only wallbounces on corner, probably)

+ j.2C's ukemi has not been removed, sorry (probably the untechable state j.2C puts you in; you Mu players should know what he's talking about)

Lol. The japanese players never really played Mu, so they don't know that j2C is fine.

As for SoD, it looks like the move will be quite a bit different than it is currently. I wonder if it has any bounce on lvl2 or lvl1. Bleh, looks like we'll have to wait till the final release to see what's really up with Mu.

[TD]

I doubt it. SoD gives mu space which she always needs... Wallbounce is bad imo. Maybe on ch, but otherwise no

[FlyingVe]

Yeah, but the wallbounce is a big part of her Max damage. Plus, being able to combo off it if for some reason it does hit, is nice. But I agree, it's not really a big nerf. In fact, the only serious nerf we got, is 3C techable, and in exchange we got an even better BnB. (maybe)

For a frame of reference. The new SoD will probably work like Hazama's Jabaki (236D) on CH. It sounds like an attempted wall bounce. Meaning it will bounce if in range, otherwise you'll get the slide effect.

I'd like to say again, j2C is totally fine.

Edited November 17, 2010 by FlyingVe

[Shockna]

Mu

- Tsurugi wallbounce is restricted to the end of the screen (only wallbounces on corner, probably)

+ j.2C's ukemi has not been removed, sorry (probably the untechable state j.2C puts you in; you Mu players should know what he's talking about)

Lol. The japanese players never really played Mu, so they don't know that j2C is fine.

As for SoD, it looks like the move will be quite a bit different than it is currently. I wonder if it has any bounce on lvl2 or lvl1. Bleh, looks like we'll have to wait till the final release to see what's really up with Mu.

Wait, does that mean we've been annoyed with nerfs that only existed because Japan isn't very far into Mu's game? >_>

I'm not sure if he meant "j.2C is still techable, sorry", or "j.2C was never changed, sorry".

[FlyingVe]

You wouldn't get Okizeme if it was techable.

I think the problem is the way that move works. You really can't follow it up in all situations, somebody not so familiar with Mu might accidentally describe that as techable. So yeah, it sounds like all our j2C loops are back (they didn't do huge damage anyways), but 6A>j2C might not work with the 6A nerf.

Edited November 17, 2010 by FlyingVe

[GenoWhirl]

You know, Tsurugi being attempted wallbounce near corner is not a nerf, I'd suppose

[Shockna]

You wouldn't get Okizeme if it was techable.

I think the problem is the way that move works. You really can't follow it up in all situations, somebody not so familiar with Mu might accidentally describe that as techable. So yeah, it sounds like all our j2C loops are back (they didn't do huge damage anyways), but 6A>j2C might not work with the 6A nerf.

Alright, thanks. I guess I'm still trying to fully grasp oki as a concept.

If 6A no longer works, wouldn't we still have the 5C - 2C - XX type of loop that the game itself tries to teach you in challenge mode? Does less damage, to be sure, but I guess it's better than losing them altogether.

[Silfer]

We sorta got the corner loops back, to some extent at least. Do we know how bad 6a got anyways?

-edit-

Mu:

*Tsurugi wall bounces, not just in the corner. Also, they didn't make j.2C untechable. Apologies for the mistakes.

So its either back to square 1 (lvl 3 wallbounce) ooor normal wallbounce...wich would be awesome.

Edited November 17, 2010 by Silfer

[FlyingVe]

^^ is that a better translation? It changes a few things.

Edit: yes it is, so at worst SoD is exactly the same as it was before, and at best we get more wall bounce. Quite frankly it sounds like that last set of updates was alot of "we don't really know this character, sorry for our mistakes."

So in short, it sounds like j2C and SoD are exactly the same as they are now.

Edited November 17, 2010 by FlyingVe