itsme Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 http://ja.twitch.tv/central804/b/355397288 2:35:40 mark. I love the combo potential of our OD.
BladeOfJustice7 Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 I thought OD Shippu only wallbounced on CH, looks like as long as the opponent is in the air, it wall bounces. Is hotaru still air unblockable?
LegendaryRath Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 http://ja.twitch.tv/central804/b/355397288 2:35:40 mark. I love the combo potential of our OD. Oh my lord.... Being able to convert j.5C into a high damage combo really does show how ridiculous OD will be. If only that new challenger hadn't appeared!
Errol Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 Things you need to not get hit by vs Hakumen Counters Zantetsu Tsubaki 5B JC 3Cch 5C 6C 6Bch 4C Back throw (RC) Air throw
LegendaryRath Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 So what you're saying... is to get hit by 5A? Seriously, this guy is a threat to everyone around him.
itsme Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 I thought OD Shippu only wallbounced on CH, looks like as long as the opponent is in the air, it wall bounces. Is hotaru still air unblockable? I know the wave was wall bounce on hit from before though I think I remember a bit about it being only on CH during the loketests. I think it possibly still is air to air unblockable considering I haven't heard or read anything about that property being nerfed. So what you're saying... is to get hit by 5A? We honestly can't net as much as before from 5A though at least we can do stuff like 5A/2A > Shippu for a burst safe 2.5k~ combo. Speaking of combos, it seems a lot of the Hakus are doing forward grab > 6A > 6B instead of 6A > 3C for their 0 mag forward grab combos because 6B has less recovery/more frame advantage than 3C, though 3C still nets them about 100 more damage.
BladeOfJustice7 Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 We honestly can't net as much as before from 5A though at least we can do stuff like 5A/2A > Shippu for a burst safe 2.5k~ combo. Speaking of combos, it seems a lot of the Hakus are doing forward grab > 6A > 6B instead of 6A > 3C for their 0 mag forward grab combos because 6B has less recovery/more frame advantage than 3C, though 3C still nets them about 100 more damage. Yes, the day ol' debate between slightly better oki or slightly more damage. I'll probably be going for 3c depending on who I'm playing.
LegendaryRath Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 I've also seen forward grab > 6A > (they recover here) > Forward grab as a throw setup. I'll probably go for 3c as well
itsme Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 Actually, I just checked and the damage difference is about 22 damage (2007 vs. 1985). But I guess 3C and 6B both have different technical oki setups so mixing it up might work too.
BladeOfJustice7 Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 (edited) But the real question is, what is oki when you have agito? /being stupid 22 is THAT big of a deal, but throwing into another throw is hella scary now. This new staggering on grabs is a huge buff to hakumen's oki/pressure. The hype for CP Hakumen is slowly building, the better the rest of the cast is, the more hype I'll be. I already know hakumen is good I just want to know if he's finally going to turn into a mindless autopilot plowing machine. Also his new hope speed is a HUGE buff against nu13, because now we really don't have to rely on jumping to get in close. EDIT: Things you need to not get hit by vs Hakumen Counters Zantetsu Tsubaki 5B JC 3Cch 5C 6C 6Bch 4C Back throw (RC) Air throw Basically the same shit since CSEX/CS1, and excluding CS2. Why 4c though? Is there something I missed about the move in CP? Edited January 23, 2013 by BladeOfJustice7
BladeOfJustice7 Posted January 23, 2013 Posted January 23, 2013 Also double post because I can. I'm thinking we should be handling the matchup threads like this: http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showthread.php?12897-My-Ky-Trade-Secrets-thread&p=1221648&viewfull=1#post1221648 This is what I have in mind, I've been personally using ehuangsan's ky thread to relearn/improve on my Ky and learn to deal with matchups better and it's been helping a lot. So many tools I was unaware of about my main he's shown written up about them and why they're used and how/when to use them. ehuangsan's video demonstration of high level play of how to handle certain matchups is what I have in mind. Share your thoughts in this matter.
mAc Chaos Posted January 26, 2013 Posted January 26, 2013 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qe8ui01NK-4&feature=youtu.be&t=18m01s why.jpg
psycofang2 Posted January 26, 2013 Posted January 26, 2013 he and quite alot of the cast has always been able to do that.
itsme Posted January 26, 2013 Posted January 26, 2013 Also double post because I can. I'm thinking we should be handling the matchup threads like this: http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showthread.php?12897-My-Ky-Trade-Secrets-thread&p=1221648&viewfull=1#post1221648 This is what I have in mind, I've been personally using ehuangsan's ky thread to relearn/improve on my Ky and learn to deal with matchups better and it's been helping a lot. So many tools I was unaware of about my main he's shown written up about them and why they're used and how/when to use them. ehuangsan's video demonstration of high level play of how to handle certain matchups is what I have in mind. Share your thoughts in this matter. I can agree with adding video demos to give a better visual guide to how the match up should be ran, though we should probably break the match up threads instead of sticking it to one thread and we should keep it formal and to the point so it is easier to get the needed info asap. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qe8ui01NK-4&feature=youtu.be&t=18m01s why.jpg Why would you use 6D in CP ever? Jokes aside, is it me or are the hitboxes for our drives follow up attack nerfed in CP? I know there are instances where it would whiff in CSE but it really looks like a lot more of them are whiffing in CP. I wonder if the shortened hit stops have something with this?
psycofang2 Posted January 26, 2013 Posted January 26, 2013 last i checked our grab range was nerfed quite a bit.
mAc Chaos Posted January 26, 2013 Posted January 26, 2013 Yeah that's what I was getting at. He actually used 6D successfully too.
BladeOfJustice7 Posted January 26, 2013 Posted January 26, 2013 I can agree with adding video demos to give a better visual guide to how the match up should be ran, though we should probably break the match up threads instead of sticking it to one thread and we should keep it formal and to the point so it is easier to get the needed info asap. Obviously not make a thread for all matchups, but the format in which he broke it down. I think that's an important template to use. Surpirsed it took this long to get a response about it from you guys -__- Why would you use 6D in CP ever? Exactly, why would you >_> Jokes aside, is it me or are the hitboxes for our drives follow up attack nerfed in CP? I know there are instances where it would whiff in CSE but it really looks like a lot more of them are whiffing in CP. I wonder if the shortened hit stops have something with this? No they are nerfed you'd have to be in denial not to realize that. It's suplimented by being able to do enma though in theory. Hiwch can lead into amazing damage. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qe8ui01NK-4&feature=youtu.be&t=18m01s why.jpg #RIP6D. last i checked our grab range was nerfed quite a bit. Yea, all of them are nerfed, it's to the point where 2d only really catches things up close because it's hitbox, to me at least, doesn't extend out of his down hurtbox. The 5d grab nerf range made sense to me though, that counter was his best normal counter by far.
dioxideUniversa Posted January 26, 2013 Posted January 26, 2013 (edited) as someone who has tried to access matchup information occasionally, my realistic response to that matchup thread proposal is "when have we ever made that much content for a single matchup" that and i am bad enough with matchups on average that I chose not to comment?! honestly though i would just go with "yes." also i wasn't at all shocked that 6D didn't work (sure i was surprised he landed it but still) Edited January 26, 2013 by dioxideUniversa
SansProtocol Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I don't know about you, but Hakumen's a dude in armor, not a Jedi. Having an invincible Force Push after every successful 6D was pretty silly. You'll still catch those falling jump attacks and other stuff that you're supposed to catch so I'm not too worried. I like the change. And with Dioxide here, a video would be an awesome way to break it down and the thread style's great, but we'll never have that much high-level experience on each other character let alone the strong playerbase to do a proper job with it. I hate being a downer.
Starlight777 Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I like the counter change because suddenly being warped to Hakumen every time Relius' 214A gets countered just filled me with salt.
mAc Chaos Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 I don't know about you, but Hakumen's a dude in armor, not a Jedi. Having an invincible Force Push after every successful 6D was pretty silly. You'll still catch those falling jump attacks and other stuff that you're supposed to catch so I'm not too worried. I like the change. And with Dioxide here, a video would be an awesome way to break it down and the thread style's great, but we'll never have that much high-level experience on each other character let alone the strong playerbase to do a proper job with it. I hate being a downer. And Tager weighs like 3000 tons but he still jumps into outer space every time he grabs someone. :P And then there's Hazama grabbing the air with his chains and flying around. Make it 15 frame startup, or nerf the grab range, not both. Or neither. :P
Ctrlaltwtf Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 Tager uses rocket boosters though. Science and all that jazz.
LegendaryRath Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 What's the point of even using 6D now? Everything 6D can do 5D can do better... Now I feel like singing.
toanenadiz Posted January 27, 2013 Posted January 27, 2013 (edited) 6D has a 10 frame start-up in CP Edit: Maybe my whiff 236D set-ups will work in CP now Edited January 27, 2013 by toanenadiz
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