[CPEX] Hakumen Gameplay Discussion

[BladeOfJustice7]

yeah when i did become a good lambda player?

Oops my bad :p

But yea we need to run it back lol. And if you're the #1 hated, I'd have to give #2 mAc

EDIT:

So...j.D can be followed up now with 5A > JC > Air Combo? New news or am I really behind?

I remember posting it somewhere in this thread, if not Spark. So you're kinda late, but not really. But to answer your question, yes it can be followed up, HOORAY :D

[Ctrlaltwtf]

I'll be online tomorrow night if anyone else is interested. Thank god dustloop and all these strong players exists or I would only be playing GG lol, CP makes it feel pointless playing csex hakumen :/

I need a runback with ctrl, hopefully our connection is better. And also tectal, dat lambda. I have a hard time with people who refuse to press buttons while blocking.

My conn seems to be back to normal, thankfully.

[BladeOfJustice7]

My conn seems to be back to normal, thankfully.

Wonderful news, needz moar ouroboros.

[Skeletal Minion]

Edit: Nevermind.

[itsme]

I remember posting it somewhere in this thread, if not Spark. So you're kinda late, but not really. But to answer your question, yes it can be followed up, HOORAY :D

I'm kind of sad that the special cancel-able jD during OD can't go into much because jD shoots them up too high :/.

[BladeOfJustice7]

I'm kind of sad that the special cancel-able jD during OD

WHAT?! o_O

[mAc Chaos]

I'm kind of sad that the special cancel-able jD during OD can't go into much because jD shoots them up too high :/.

j.D > Tsubaki > Hotaru?

[itsme]

WHAT?! o_O

I thought this was old news? I guess it might be surprising since you see literally nobody doing it but Hakumen's drives are all special cancel-able during OD, including his jD.

j.D > Tsubaki > Hotaru?

There was a video that got posted here I think and I think the guy kept trying to do both Tsubaki or Hotaru and neither of them worked since the jD rocketed the opponent too high. Maybe a delayed Tsubahotaru might work but if the P2 of it is still 45 during OD, I don't think the damage would look that good and the combo probably won't go for so long though 3.2k off of jD > Tsubaki actually sounds okay.

[BladeOfJustice7]

I'm online if anyone's interested, can't read anymore :/

[LegendaryRath]

Blade, do you mainly play on Live or PSN? I'd be willing to play with you sometime. Just be warned that I'd probably suck because I've been going all out on p4a recently.

EDIT: I've got no clue what we could expect connection wise, but it couldn't hurt to try it out for a few matches.

[BladeOfJustice7]

Our connection will probably be bad since we live on opposite ends of North America, but we can still play. I'll post here if I'll be free today or not.

[Isuna]

Can you special cancel JD during landing recovery?

Then maybe JD > land Gurren works?

... by the way Mac's new deal-with-scumbaggery avatar is awesome

[psycofang2]

i highly doubt that, unless its in OD.

OD might llow it but only if it actually lands.

[Skeletal Minion]

Yeah, I don't think that will work. Even if you could special cancel upon landing, Gurren is way too slow--Haku barely has time to link a 5A after j.D.

If you were already in OD, I'm assuming you could Tsubaki/Hotaru cancel it though.

A good question this brings up: does OD activation completely pause the game until it's over? Like if you land a hit that puts you at, say, +10 and activate, are you still at +10 when the OD flash is over?

If so, I can see j.D > land > OD > 5A > stuff working.

[psycofang2]

yes its either a 1f start up or a 0 frame start up. ive seen it used a s a reversal. i believe it also has invincibility on its start up.

[Fluck]

By the way, does anyone know if Yukikaze has been nerfed like the rest of his counters? I'm pretty sure it hasn't been, but it'd be nice to have some confirmation.

[TheBossGiga]

It may have actually been buffed to activate faster on a projectile catch or maybe it just looks that way because the game has gotten faster also Im not 100% on this either but dmg may have been nerfed slightly.

[dioxideUniversa]

there weren't any reported nerfs to yukikaze besides its normal damage being lowered (to give its full damage to OD version i suppose)

[mAc Chaos]

Continuing the Tager discussion.

All the match vids I've seen VS Tager involve him bodying Haku, so I dunno. Haku can pour his stars to get damage, but it ends up being 4-5k which is pretty much what Extend Haku gets anyway. Not much change there.

[itsme]

Yeah, I don't think that will work. Even if you could special cancel upon landing, Gurren is way too slow--Haku barely has time to link a 5A after j.D.

If you were already in OD, I'm assuming you could Tsubaki/Hotaru cancel it though.

A good question this brings up: does OD activation completely pause the game until it's over? Like if you land a hit that puts you at, say, +10 and activate, are you still at +10 when the OD flash is over?

If so, I can see j.D > land > OD > 5A > stuff working.

I'm not entirely sure but from the looks of the video, there seems to be some recovery to the OD since I see the opponent recovering from their move before the person who used the OD can punish the opponent, though the invincibility seems to last through out the OD. I also think I remember reading that the OD possibly having recovery in the jbbs too.

On an interesting note, Hakumen's step seems to be OD cancel-able on recovery since forward grab > OD > step 5C will not work because the opponent recovers by the time the 5C comes out while forward grab > step (land) OD > 5C connects perfectly fine.

Continuing the Tager discussion.

All the match vids I've seen VS Tager involve him bodying Haku, so I dunno. Haku can pour his stars to get damage, but it ends up being 4-5k which is pretty much what Extend Haku gets anyway. Not much change there.

I'm not sure if losing reliable counters to catch Tager's react-able offenses was worth gaining bigger zoning damage as jC, Shippu buff. A lot of the new Tager tech shows that you honestly cannot afford to get near him with his entirely new sets of options, I honestly don't know if this match up is looking to be even or one-sided though I feel Tager could be at the offensive advantage because he can freely magnetize Haku more now with his drives.

Edited February 4, 2013 by itsme

[Wander]

A lot of the new Tager tech shows that you honestly cannot afford to get near him with his entirely new sets of options

This is how i play the matchup in Extend, even after corner knock down, i mostly backdash and 4C his wakeup if he neutral techs. Though im not sure if thats worth it. I actually like the buffs haku got in exchange for his nerfed counters.

[psycofang2]

This is how i play the matchup in Extend, even after corner knock down, i mostly backdash and 4C his wakeup if he neutral techs. Though im not sure if thats worth it. I actually like the buffs haku got in exchange for his nerfed counters.

thats actually the right way to go, despite all the tager whining hes faaaar too dangerous to allow him to get close or mash 360/720 and set the round to neutral or put him at the advantage.

he wants you to get close, we need to be close to do damage, only option is to zone, scumbag, and capitalize on your random hits if you can.

[mAc Chaos]

That method rarely works for me in practice though.

I zone and zone and chip away at his life and then he touches me once and makes up for all of it.

I do better when I zone until I get a knockdown and then I win off mixup. But that's me, not dealing with JP Tagers.

Generally I feel that it's better to kill him when you can though than to nip him a few times and give him time to make a comeback. But that's definitely going to be harder in CP up close.

[psycofang2]

capitalize off random hits for me does well enough. its when i try to go in for mixups do the 730 360 mashing comes out and god knows ill get hit.

[itsme]

Against CSE Tager on knockdown, I try to time a meaty 5A so that it'll catch Tager if he tries to mash 360 on wake up and I can do a second one on whiff to tag him if he back dashes, and then if he blocks it then I go for my mix up or just back off to see what he does; if he delays his tech or rolls away for free, I just take it back to neutral to stay away from his shenanigans. I generally tend to be much more careful once he has 50 meter or playing one online.