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[Papstr]

- Gold bursts have been removed

Jackie on suicide watch.

Got some Chrono Phantasma information for those curious:

- Gold bursts have been removed, they've been replaced with something called "overdrive" Builds up over time, grants character-specific benefits. Duration depends on health. Freezes the timer when used.

- The guard primer/libra has been removed, each character now has certain moves that if you pay 25 heat and press A+B will break guard

- Wallbounce has been changed, characters now wall-stick instead (i'm assuming like GG)

Yea I've followed BBCP's stuff a lil bit, in hopes that I'll find something that'll spark my interest in this game again. Information has been rather...thin, especially since no pictures/video are allowed at the loketest.

Overdrive sounds interesting I guess, but I'm still a tad bitter than Ragna's BloodKain got moved to that instead of being a distortion. On the bright side though, it doesn't drain his health apparently, and he can now do Blood Choke Rape Storm raw, without needing to be in blood kain, although doing it IN blood kain doubles the damage (does the damage it does in BB games currently)

as for the AB moves, I'm not too sure. I had a nasty habit of never barrier guarding, so I'm sure to rage about that. Though from what I've heard, they're pretty easy to see coming (Ragna's for example, apparently he grows a giant hand kinda like when he Rape Storms, and does like a slow overhead type thing, and he flashes white to boot) though I still don't like the idea of guard crush period. Just lemme block shit lol. Throw me instead. Though you can still block these moves by barriering, so you can burn 25 of their meter.

With all this in mind, and that I've heard rumors characters have EX moves now? I wonder if heat gain'll be bigger, kinda like in GG, where even walking toward your opponent builds meter. That would be hella sweet.

This game is very slightly on my radar, if only for the fact that BB kinda holds an awkward place in my heart, where, even though there are alot of things I dislike about it, I still appreciate it. 'Specially since I played the damn game for, what, 2-3 years. Jesus.

I need to stop sayin' so much. >_>

[Milln]

Look at this way, Papstr. By the time you get 50 heat, the amount of time in a match might be equal to how long Blood Kain lasts currently.

[LuminAbyss]

- Gold bursts have been removed

Jackie on suicide watch.

Everyone needs to stop giving me signatures.

[Papstr]

Oh man I laughed so hard. I love you Lumin.

[Tophatmoffet]

Jackie no please.

Sudoku is not the way.

[LastStarSaviour]

I'm going to miss gold bursts, but I supposed overdrives will be hype. Apparently Noel's boosts her drives, HAHA! Sweet jesus, give niggas another reason to option select losses when they fight me why don't ya Aksytem.

Also, the first loketest apparently spelled quite a bit of gloom and doom for Noel...again

6B>6C apparently no longer works. Plus combos from 22BxN and 22C no longer work. How the hell do we get damage mid-screen? Also, the new shotgun move gatlings off of 2C, but they're sent flying so far from the opponent that it's impossible to combo...da heck is this? It wallbounces/sticks in the corner but reports have said you can't combo off of it in corner, the same with her 22B and 22C stuff. Optic barrels A and C are gone? Okay, now this just doesn't make any sense at all. Heard the input for optic barrel C got replaced with the Shotgun.

I like her new move after Revolver Blast though. Nerfs to 2D, people will still complain about that crap, and still get hit by it.

My main thing is 4D no longer combo'ing. If this comes to fruition i'm done with BB forever.

Edited August 6, 2012 by LastStarSaviour

[Seiki]

If they make Bang's overdrive Furinkazan I hope they remove the backdash and diagonal dash nerfs to it like how they removed Ragna's Blood Kain health degenerating.

[Urichinan]

Star, dude, you've got to quit overreacting. Most of these things are mistranslations and players only getting to play for one match then waiting two hours for the next. It's also a location test and a lot of it will more than likely change.

Calm yourself!

[Papstr]

Star, dude, you've got to quit overreacting. Most of these things are mistranslations and players only getting to play for one match then waiting two hours for the next. It's also a location test and a lot of it will more than likely change.

Calm yourself!

This. I've heard alot of retardedly outrageous shit on Ragna (something about 6b not having anything to gatling after? no dash canceling 5D or 6c?) First loketests always make troll worthy changes. Don't worry haha.

for naimat: Bang's overdrive is indeed furinkazan.

edit again: pretty sure the only thing noel's overdrive does is make her drives faster. there might be more to it, but that's all I recall reading. Don't see anything useful there but we'll see.

Edited August 6, 2012 by Papstr

[LastStarSaviour]

I really like how Bang has to use all four of his drives in order to get all four seals. I always thought he needed to work a bit harder to get something as broken as furin.

@Woz: Nah, ignore half of my doom alerts for Noel. This has happened every iteration of the games' loketests. I hear terrible news, depression hits hard as hell, a ray of hope shines on release, then I find out she's still crappy as hell but can somehow deal with it.

[Urichinan]

then I find out she's still crappy as hell but can somehow deal with it.

Except for CS2, you mean.

[LastStarSaviour]

Except CS2 Woz...

I wish they would give Noel more than 2 new moves though. She really deserves a overhaul of moves this time around.

Edited August 6, 2012 by LastStarSaviour

[Seiki]

lol if Bang Install is "broken" why don't you see anyone use it? Hardly any of the Japanese do. Dora just does it every now and then to style. Nezu goes for it if he can finish you off with it. Outside of combos it's dangerous to use especially against characters with range and good number of active frames on their moves which is most of the cast. The invulnerability frames are really small and a lot of characters have normals that outlast the invincibility on the dash and he is in counter hit state so they get a free counter hit.

No matter how badly they nerf Bang it will never be as bad as CT, so I don't care what they do to him so long as he doesn't end up CS1 Rachel tier.

[Urichinan]

lol if Bang Install is "broken" why don't you see anyone use it? Hardly any of the Japanese do. Dora just does it every now and then to style. Nezu goes for it if he can finish you off with it. Outside of combos it's dangerous to use especially against characters with range and good number of active frames on their moves which is most of the cast. The invulnerability frames are really small and a lot of characters have normals that outlast the invincibility on the dash and he is in counter hit state so they get a free counter hit.

No matter how badly they nerf Bang it will never be as bad as CT, so I don't care what they do to him so long as he doesn't end up CS1 Rachel tier.

If it didn't require so much to set it up, then it would be used a ton. The damage you get from it is the highest in the game. The problem is that you'll be using meter in other ways, so you never can use it. A good player will combo into it and go for a 7K combo kill.

It's really, really good. It just requires to much to make it work.

Personally, I feel that people need to explore bumpers more. I mean seriously, you can't pass up on that kind of mixup and oki, as well as his combo potential with it.

Bang players are just super lazy.

[LastStarSaviour]

Not really broken, but it's hella good (broken) you have to admit. You net about 6K off of anything and the mobility on that thing is ridiculous. Chances are, someone who goes Furin will never get caught, it's not used much because it takes some actual skill to use, and in high-level matches people don't tend to stick their necks out for things that could ultimately back-fire if you don't know what you're doing.

With that said, I do like Extend's Furin. Especially J.2C loop, I specifically learned how to do that with bang if nothing else.

Edited August 6, 2012 by LastStarSaviour

[LastStarSaviour]

Bang players are just super lazy.

There's so much truth to this it's not even funny.

[Seiki]

If it didn't require so much to set it up, then it would be used a ton. The damage you get from it is the highest in the game. The problem is that you'll be using meter in other ways, so you never can use it. A good player will combo into it and go for a 7K combo kill.

It's really, really good. It just requires to much to make it work.

Personally, I feel that people need to explore bumpers more. I mean seriously, you can't pass up on that kind of mixup and oki, as well as his combo potential with it.

Bang players are just super lazy.

It doesn't require much to set-up. 4 seals and 50 heat. The former you can get from 5a or 2A starter 3 seals in one combo. and off a 2D all 4 seals. 50 heat is just pressing buttons. lol. That isn't why it isn't used. It's the reasons I've stated above.

lol you guys obviously don't play Bang outside of training mode. Especially because you guys are so fixated on damage. First off most characters can net the same damage off of fatal counters and utilizing the same amount of meter...so no he doesn't do the "highest amount of damage in the game". Second, You do know to net 6k+ you need a J.C or 5B starter. J.C can be easily blocked on reaction even from a crossup dash and 5B is slow. Plus you need 100 heat and not all starters build you the 50 heat you need for the ashura ender. If the opponent bursts mid combo they reset the situation, you lose your combo, and you aren't going to be able to get in without taking a large risk of getting counter hitted out of your dash. Idk if you have seen his dash in Extend but it's not that great. The dashes are short, invulnerability lasts like 3 frames and are in the middle of the dash (frames 9-14, total frames of a dash is 19), you are in counter hit state, and you can't barrier immediately...

Lol "skill" isn't the barrier to utilizing Bang Install. It has fundamental weaknesses that I stated above. Controlling mobility isn't hard after spending 30 mins just dashing around in training mode and remembering that all your normals are dash cancelable.

@Star: "it's not used much because it takes some actual skill to use, and in high-level matches people don't tend to stick their necks out for things that could ultimately back-fire if you don't know what you are doing"

Dora and other high level Bang players don't use it often...so they don't have the skill to use it right? lol. They don't use it that often because they understand the inherit weaknesses it has. Also...you say it's hella good...and then you say in a high-level match it isn't used...because they might not know what they are doing...doesn't a high-level match consists of two players who know what they are doing...v.s. two people just mashing buttons?...logic please.

"someone who goes Furin will never get caught"....Star, you need to stop typing absolute statements (ones with words like never, always, etc). Yes you will get caught and it's for the reasons I stated in my previous post...it's like you guys don't read what you are arguing against...and you just go in with a preconceived argument.

@Woz: "It's really really good. It just requires to much to make it work"...I already argued against this but I need to criticize your logic here. If you were to apply this logic to another fighting game, say Marvel, why isn't Jill or Doctor Strange top tier?....yeah. Jill and Doctor Strange require alot of setting up for them to be good. The viability, and hence it's effectiveness, of something decreases if it becomes more and more situational and therefore cannot be "really really good" a.k.a. "broken".

Yeah...Bang players are super lazy...more like you guys are too lazy to spend some time in training mode to figure out countermeasures.

[Papstr]

Naimat your walls of text are a pleasure to read. And for once I'm not even being sarcastic. You're a smart dude. That is all.

[Seiki]

Naimat your walls of text are a pleasure to read. And for once I'm not even being sarcastic. You're a smart dude. That is all.

<3

[LastStarSaviour]

Furin is very easy to get, and activating it is somewhat just as easy. Bang doesn't have to spend meter for much of anything, his pressure and combos just don't require it.

Also, Furin does net the best damage in-game (via counter and non-counter hit), where you're getting he doesn't I don't know. He doesn't require 100 heat to get more than 5K in Furin either, you've been wasting your meter if you do spend this much. You're guaranteed a good 4K off any hit that manages to connect in Furin, regardless of positioning. Do you understand how good this is? Being in a state where your speed and ability to return to neutral/safe positioning anytime you want to is unmatched. You say he needs 5B to get damage, bang's 5B is not that slow. Only 10 frames and it's jump-cancelable on block (combined with the distance Furin sends you in a dash, that's pretty good).Not many characters can punish his back-dashes, like you said they need really good, long-ranged pokes, which most characters DO NOT HAVE!

The fact that once Bang enters Furin, that turns the entire match afterwards into a horribly laid out guessing game for your opponent (so blocking on reaction and punishing on reaction is difficult). Maybe you could try and block Furin mix-up, but the fact of the matter is, most times you won't be able to block everything (and in most character's cases, you're going to have to mash in order to get out of situations). Topped with the fact that his D nails give him automatic ability to get in, no matter where he is on screen and you have to respect it is amazing.

I could go on and on about how great that move is, but the fact of the matter is, against many characters in the game the reward he gains off Furin outways the risk.

Edit: I could understand why Furin isn't used against characters like Ragna, Litchi, and Mu-12. Everyone else you'd have to explain to me why not.

Edited August 7, 2012 by LastStarSaviour

[Volpe-de-Glacio]

Yeah, it seems I'll need to pick up some legitimate debate skills before stepping up to Naimat again lolz.

[Papstr]

Yeah, it seems I'll need to pick up some legitimate debate skills before stepping up to Naimat again lolz.

If there's something I learned from Phoenix Wright, proper debate goes like this:

1. Shout "OBJECTION!" really loudly.

2. Slam your hands down on a table

3. Show evidence.

In the case of Naimat, distract him with some frosted flakes.

HOLY I just remembered. Dude Naimat, when we drove up to Kansas to pick up Rofl's girlfriend (lol) we saw a friggin street called Kelloggs street, and we immediately thought of you and cracked jokes about it for like an hour. I'm sorry.

[Astaroth136]

Tager players are just super lazy.

Fix'd. We just spin sticks during blockstun and press C sometimes to finish it off.

[LastStarSaviour]

I'd have to say the same about my own debate skills as well. I have to get better at making my arguments sound smarter. I'm told I have some good points, but they don't come across as intelligent due to grammar issues and what-not, thus getting written off.

Astaroth, Tager players do have to work, don't ever think you don't. It's just not as much as the community makes it out to seem.

[Seiki]

Lol, to break 4k you need atleast one of two things ashura or a good starter, like 6A,5B,J.C, 5C, 2C all slow moves that can be out mashed with jab or chicken blocked. To break 5.5k you need a good starter AND ashura. If you get hit by 5B you deserve the damage because you are an idiot and you pressed another button besides your jab on block. If you got outspaced and got hit by it you deserve to because his hurtbox comes out before the hitbox...and that is when his arm is fully extended too (look on the dustloop wiki for the hitbox data).

Yes there are situations where you will have to guess on block but you aren't hopeless...you have defensive burst and counter assault. Oh and before you even get into taht situation you can run up gold burst it will catch him mid dash and if he blocks (and he has to barrier to block) you are given +5 frame advantage on him. +5!!!!!!! And any following mixups you have he has to barrier. And the fact that he has to hold back and A+B means he has to buffer the barrier...meaning if you delay your blockstrings he will accidentally get a backdash and you can punish that backdash, like how you punish advancing guard in marvel, with any move that has below 9 frames of start up...which everyone has.

You don't need really "good" long ranged normals to beat his dashes, it just makes things easier. I just read his frame data and actually he has no invulnerability on his dashes in FRKZ in Extend LOL. Was going off CS2 properties in my previous post, didn't know they removed them completely. So really all you have to worry about is his attacks out of his Dashes...and he can't attack until 9f into his dash...and his fastest attack is at 5 frames so realistically he takes 14 frames to do his fastest attack and EVERYONE has atleast two or three moves that are faster than 14f...even Tager...

If you jump and instant block D Nails (which isn't hard) he can't apply a mixup off of it and you can press buttons to net you a counter hit even if he goes for something like j.A....(his fastest air normal at 7f). You don't even need to instant block it just jump and chicken block...hell getting hit by it isn't even a bad idea because they do less than 200 damage and have really small amount of hitstun so Bang can't convert the hit into a combo on reaction. He has to preemptively press a button to convert to a combo and D nails prorates it.

As for characters I'll list a few to demonstrate the general reason why he can't on most of the cast:

Taokaka: ....almost self explanatory but she controls the air...her normals are faster and she can pick up off of a counter hit aerial into great damage and then Bang is forced to respect her on his wake-up. You can dash....but the whole design concept behind tao is that she can dash with an attack, her drive, so any attempts at trying to fight her in the air will be you on the losing end because you can't dash and attack you can only dash then attack by then it's too late.

Stay on the ground you say?...lol staying on the ground...against Tao...lol. That's where she wants you to be so she can cross you up and high low you all day.

Tager: Yes even Tager...but he needs resources. If you end up in a neutral situation v.s. Tager it is extremely dangerous. He has large active frames on his moves and if you are running away he charges up the spark bolt and even if you block it now you are magnetized. Your dashes mean nothing when you are magnetized and when you block its barrier blocking so he gets even more frame advantage. And you never want to have to barrier block Tager's blockstrings.

Hazama:...chains...where do you think you are going?

Lambda: sword projectiles cover the screen...though when you do get in she sweats but until then...you are sweating...and it's not like she doesn't have fast dashes to get out of a soon to be sticky situation if she knows it's coming.

Litchi: throw the staff, and run after it. Do the staff super, spam J.C or J.B until i dash into it.

Valk: his wolf form has invincibility on his dashes lol, he has wolf form standing B which will anti- air any of my aerials, and it's not like he can't catch me...he's a flying wolf.

Rachel: tempest dhalia to get me to block, set-up george so I can't stay in her ass, and she can just wind herself away and it fucks up my approach too cause my dashes get fucked by the wind and I end up running in place in counter hit state.

Hakumen: space with J.C 4C...etc

Platinum: Cat missiles, and all of her staff stuff that covers half screen fucks me over.

Relius: he can stay far away and just spam ignis attacks

Carl:...you are just making his job easier

Arakune: FRKZ just makes it easier for arakune to hit me with a bell bug and smoke cloud since i can't block whenever i want and if i move i can't block for a bit.

characters who do have a problem dealing with FRKZ in the neutral game: Makoto, Noel and Tsubaki. and they all three have something in common, they lack good mid range control.