Lord Knight Posted June 11, 2011 Posted June 11, 2011 we're back! --- Good posts from last thread: Litchi Backstep, Midscreen Daisharin, Training mode Thought process Bang vs Litchi matchup strategy Hazama vs Litchi matchup strategy Reading players Reading players (2) Reading Players (3) Creating Matchup strategy Risk/Reward Risk/reward (2) Noel vs Litchi Neutral H-Kohaku general strategy Thought process Bursting Bursting (2) Bursting (3) Bursting (4) Baiting reversals CS1 Character Strengths
Tong Posted June 11, 2011 Posted June 11, 2011 Ok, let me be the first! Why air instant blocking doesnt beat unblockables anymore like CT? I know It's been around since CS1, but never gave too much though about it, were people really Air IB'ing everthing that was supposed to beat them? Also, do you believe wake-up Break Burst(Gold) is better than Green Bursting in general? Gold is just too good for it because It does what supposedly green was meant to do, get you off pressure and puts you back in the game. Why isnt Hazama doing very well in qualifying for SBO? Just lack of players or the char itself isnt that reliable? Same for Rachel, she's playable again but cant see many in Is game-chariot crew overrated? Cool.
GrandF'inStyle Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 Good stuff, i had forgotten a few things so u posting links to those posts are a godsend. I honestly cant think of any good questions atm..... scratch that whats the best way to go about air teching do i just mash or what? i find myself gettin caught by alota bam ass purple throws lately when i just try and do that. i feel like this was brought up b4 but the laziness...
Konflyk Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 Gameplay related, What's with all the Bluebeat combos and not being able to tech as of late.
C0R Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 I imagine it might have something to do with the new game...
Nakkiel Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 Ok, let me be the first! Why air instant blocking doesnt beat unblockables anymore like CT? I know It's been around since CS1, but never gave too much though about it, were people really Air IB'ing everthing that was supposed to beat them? Also, do you believe wake-up Break Burst(Gold) is better than Green Bursting in general? Gold is just too good for it because It does what supposedly green was meant to do, get you off pressure and puts you back in the game. Why isnt Hazama doing very well in qualifying for SBO? Just lack of players or the char itself isnt that reliable? Same for Rachel, she's playable again but cant see many in Is game-chariot crew overrated? Cool. Air instant blocking actually was taken out in CS1, it was a CT-specific defensive feature. It made sense due to the fact that if you bursted at all during the round, you lost your barrier. If air IB didn't defend from AUB attacks, jumping would have been certain death. With the revamping of the defensive system in CS1, air IB defending against AUB attacks while shaving off 10 frames of blockstun would just be too much. The barrier gauge no longer affects your burst, it's a fair trade and good decision. I'm not LK, but personally I think neither is more "useful" than the other. Wake-up gold burst is much more viable though for characters without a normal reversal or if you don't want to take the risk of having your dp blocked/baited. However it still costs you your get-out-of-jail card that you may need to escape a game-winning combo or to keep yourself from losing a large amount of life and being put in a bad position. Green is not as "good" as Gold burst since it'd be rather unfair to get out of a combo for free and get one yourself. It's the consequence for using it to escape damage. I wouldn't say Hazama isn't doing well, or that Chariot crew is over-rated. The qualifiers have been very rough, lots of top players showing up and competing at the same qualifier. They wind up knocking each other out. Good stuff, i had forgotten a few things so u posting links to those posts are a godsend. I honestly cant think of any good questions atm..... scratch that whats the best way to go about air teching do i just mash or what? i find myself gettin caught by alota bam ass purple throws lately when i just try and do that. i feel like this was brought up b4 but the laziness... Don't use B+C to tech. In CS2 I think it's a lot safer and smarter to use A+B (together, don't mash) along with your desired tech direction to increase your chances of defending against air unblockable resets.
Rhiya Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 I am hype for this thread. Now I just need questions. >_<
WolfCrimson Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 (edited) Oh cool, thread is back up. LK, do you feel you learned something new when it comes to game-play, now that you've been to the Revelations tournament and competed in it? Or maybe like we need to give more importance to a certain facet of game-play? Also, what do you think of Japan-level gameplay? Edit: Actually, other tourney participants are free to answer the questions, not just LK. Edited June 13, 2011 by WolfCrimson
St1ckBuG Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 Also, what do you think of Japan-level gameplay? They're playing a totally different game, in both mindset and execution.
WolfCrimson Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 They're playing a totally different game, in both mindset and execution. Wait, you were there too? Or did you experience Japan-level gameplay yourself before?
St1ckBuG Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 Wait, you were there too? Or did you experience Japan-level gameplay yourself before? You asked for an opinion, and I gave it. I was not at Revelations. The term 'Japan-level play' is very subjective (since that covers anywhere from scrub level play to high level play), but yes, I've played people who are very good at their respective games, in both BB and GG. Your question is very simple, and can be applied to almost anything: -Has anyone ever played against LeBron 1v1? What did you think of his game-play? (Not trolling his recent loss, he's still a great player.) -Has anyone ever swam against Michael Phelps in the 200 butterfly? What did you think of his speed? -Has anyone ever fought Anderson Silva? What did you think of his striking? You could easily answer any of these questions with what I said before: They're playing a totally different game, in both mindset and execution. I'm not saying that all Japanese that come over here for a tournament are godlike, but I'm just assuming that when you say 'Japan-level gameplay' you mean (Japanese) SBO gameplay. Look at it this way: they take it more seriously than you do, they've played more than you have, and their hit-confirming/yomi/execution/spacing/matchup knowledge/character knowledge far surpass your own. You're playing against someone who is very good at what they do and take it more seriously than you do. If you're asking how I personally did against the really good people I've played: I. Got. Bodied.
TD Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 lk are you you going to pick up rachel now that shes good again? rather, does she look decent enough to consider picking up.
WolfCrimson Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 You asked for an opinion, and I gave it. I was not at Revelations. The term 'Japan-level play' is very subjective (since that covers anywhere from scrub level play to high level play), but yes, I've played people who are very good at their respective games, in both BB and GG. Your question is very simple, and can be applied to almost anything: -Has anyone ever played against LeBron 1v1? What did you think of his game-play? (Not trolling his recent loss, he's still a great player.) -Has anyone ever swam against Michael Phelps in the 200 butterfly? What did you think of his speed? -Has anyone ever fought Anderson Silva? What did you think of his striking? You could easily answer any of these questions with what I said before: I'm not saying that all Japanese that come over here for a tournament are godlike, but I'm just assuming that when you say 'Japan-level gameplay' you mean (Japanese) SBO gameplay. Look at it this way: they take it more seriously than you do, they've played more than you have, and their hit-confirming/yomi/execution/spacing/matchup knowledge/character knowledge far surpass your own. You're playing against someone who is very good at what they do and take it more seriously than you do. If you're asking how I personally did against the really good people I've played: I. Got. Bodied. Sorry, I should've been more specific, when I said 'Japan-level play' I meant Satoshi (since LK and co. just played him recently). Or any other Japanese players he (or any other tourney player) has played BB against previously before Revelations. I was just wondering how someone who has first-hand experience against a good Japanese player, feels about the Japanese play. Not how they did against them. I'd like to think that the opinion of someone who experiences something (LK, Zong and Co.) differs from someone who just observes it (me). So I wanna know what's the former's opinion about it. How do you know what my execution/yomi/hit-confirming/spacing/match-up knowledge is like? I've never disclosed what I do and don't do when I play, where did you get your info on me? Not saying that it isn't true, but I'm not saying it isn't false either, I haven't played a Japanese player myself to gauge how well I'd do. And I'm not American nor do I live in the Americas, so you can't just blame it on me being American. And could you just chill? I wasn't patronizing you with my question before, nor did I mean to.
Tong Posted June 13, 2011 Posted June 13, 2011 Just look at how your Champion looks like against an average japan player. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9aJxhq-2UKM Not hating tho, I think BOTH are great players on their own, but their meta/realities are entirely different.
Nakkiel Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 i'm pretty sure no one thinks dacid is america's hero or anything like that anymore, lol and satoshi isn't just an 'average japan player'
Dacidbro Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 I mean.. it makes a lot of sense why I got bodied. He's better at footsies than I am by a wide range, and I am forced to play footsies with Makoto despite having worse footsies tools. The ability for Makoto (and for Satoshi to fully utilize) punishing Bang's whiffs while Bang is incapable of doing so is very frustrating. In any case, I should have been more free with using nails. Although she can theoretically parry them, I have to be close enough for her to do that, so it was un-wise to approach the match the way I did. I learned a lot, and was grateful to be outplayed so much to learn such valuable information concerning the game's fundamentals. Also, calling Satoshi an average japanese player is just outright disrespectful. You have no idea how good he is. And before we get into the "not in japan" argument, you're wrong, he's among the best over there as well.
St1ckBuG Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 And could you just chill? I wasn't patronizing you with my question before, nor did I mean to. If you took my post like I was calling you a scrub or being offensive then I'm sorry. When I want to answer someone's question I try to be serious, I'm not going to beat around the bush and then just call you an idiot. (Unless you say something like 'I think throws are cheap because of online lag, so I kick everyone who uses throws in my rooms'.) Your question wasn't scrubby at all so I'm not going to give you a scrubby/lame answer. When I say 'you' I don't mean you personally. If you thought I was talking about you then I'm sorry. I was just saying when you generally play someone better than you (not you personally), they're better than you for a reason. What does it feel like playing someone better than you? Have you ever lost? It's that feeling, and any good player would walk away from losing knowing what to improve on so they stand a better chance next time. I know LK is going to shrug off his loss(es) and try and get better because he cares about getting better in BB. He's going to just keep playing so that he gets the skills necessary to make himself a better player. If that means learning another character (to learn their weaknesses) or grinding combos/matchups then he'll do it. He's going to do what anyone would do after losing and wants to get better (and you can apply this to anything, which is why I used basketball/swimming/MMA as examples). ZONG is going to actually go into practice mode so that he doesn't drop unblockable resets... and probably try playing the game for once. Maybe? Dacid is just going to keep doing what he's been doing: mash 6D. Stay gdlk Dacid. Omni is probably going to come out to more tournaments so that he can get over tourney/stream nerves. I know he's a better player than what I watched. Sorry if I'm putting words in their mouth, but I doubt any of them are going to come in here saying Japan was free as hell, and they just let Satoshi win so he could pay for his plane ticket back. They're not going to say he got lucky: they're going to take their losses, shrug it off, and get better. Japan is better than us right now. A lot better? Yes. We've only had the game for less than a month, they've had it for about half a year now. All we can do is play more, put in some effort, and get better.
Zidane Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 [09:13] zidanel33t: I don't feel like posting [09:13] zidanel33t: So perhaps you should edit or post [09:13] zidanel33t: That the argument that we had this game for one month and japan had it for X is a shitty excuse [09:13] zidanel33t: Not only is it shitty, it's the wrong excuse to blame [09:14] zidanel33t: The average skill level of the FGC community at large is... average [09:14] zidanel33t: The average skill level of the BB community is actually low [09:14] zidanel33t: Not only do we not have the matchup exp of Japan since they're so close together [09:14] almu 2000: well yeah [09:14] zidanel33t: Our matchup exp is horribly inadequate cause of how much everyone sucks [09:15] zidanel33t: Tired of seeing this game has been out for a month, shut the fuck up [09:15] zidanel33t: You suck, deal with it [09:15] almu 2000: I'm not going to just say [09:15] almu 2000: america sucks [09:15] almu 2000: JP is da gawd [09:15] almu 2000: that's too easy [09:15] almu 2000: and too troll [09:15] zidanel33t: It's not about how good Japan is [09:15] almu 2000: even if I word it like you did [09:15] zidanel33t: It's how bad American BB is [09:15] almu 2000: people just take offense it it [09:15] zidanel33t: So what you're telling me is [09:15] zidanel33t: You're a bitch and i'm gonna have to post it [09:15] almu 2000: yeah [09:15] almu 2000: do it [09:15] zidanel33t: Nigga i'm about to post this AIM log [09:15] almu 2000: lmfao [09:15] zidanel33t: Put your info out there. [09:15] zidanel33t: Stay free.
Dorian Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 If you took my post like I was calling you a scrub or being offensive then I'm sorry. When I want to answer someone's question I try to be serious, I'm not going to beat around the bush and then just call you an idiot. (Unless you say something like 'I think throws are cheap because of online lag, so I kick everyone who uses throws in my rooms'.) Your question wasn't scrubby at all so I'm not going to give you a scrubby/lame answer. When I say 'you' I don't mean you personally. If you thought I was talking about you then I'm sorry. I was just saying when you generally play someone better than you (not you personally), they're better than you for a reason. What does it feel like playing someone better than you? Have you ever lost? It's that feeling, and any good player would walk away from losing knowing what to improve on so they stand a better chance next time. I know LK is going to shrug off his loss(es) and try and get better because he cares about getting better in BB. He's going to just keep playing so that he gets the skills necessary to make himself a better player. If that means learning another character (to learn their weaknesses) or grinding combos/matchups then he'll do it. He's going to do what anyone would do after losing and wants to get better (and you can apply this to anything, which is why I used basketball/swimming/MMA as examples). ZONG is going to actually go into practice mode so that he doesn't drop unblockable resets... and probably try playing the game for once. Maybe? Dacid is just going to keep doing what he's been doing: mash 6D. Stay gdlk Dacid. Omni is probably going to come out to more tournaments so that he can get over tourney/stream nerves. I know he's a better player than what I watched. Sorry if I'm putting words in their mouth, but I doubt any of them are going to come in here saying Japan was free as hell, and they just let Satoshi win so he could pay for his plane ticket back. They're not going to say he got lucky: they're going to take their losses, shrug it off, and get better. Japan is better than us right now. A lot better? Yes. We've only had the game for less than a month, they've had it for about half a year now. All we can do is play more, put in some effort, and get better. I love you, yes homo.
skd Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 lmao, this fucking thread. What exactly did you lose to when it came to noel? i assume i should mash 2D more tell me when you get back into new york!
Tong Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 I mean.. it makes a lot of sense why I got bodied. He's better at footsies than I am by a wide range, and I am forced to play footsies with Makoto despite having worse footsies tools. The ability for Makoto (and for Satoshi to fully utilize) punishing Bang's whiffs while Bang is incapable of doing so is very frustrating. In any case, I should have been more free with using nails. Although she can theoretically parry them, I have to be close enough for her to do that, so it was un-wise to approach the match the way I did. I learned a lot, and was grateful to be outplayed so much to learn such valuable information concerning the game's fundamentals. Also, calling Satoshi an average japanese player is just outright disrespectful. You have no idea how good he is. And before we get into the "not in japan" argument, you're wrong, he's among the best over there as well. Sorry, I didnt mean to be disrespectful. Its just that are SO MANY Gdlk JP Players, not to mention the ones who come out of nowhere and just... "own"? at the Arcade. I just cant afford to say everyone is highlevel.Damn, people call the likes of Buppa and Kaqn overrated as soon they watch non-chariot games and see another Ragna/Hazama moping the floor. I believe Satoshi was a Bang player in CS and fared pretty well in SBO...
Dacidbro Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 (edited) He got second, only losing to the godlike Tsujikawa in a really awkward matchup. He's reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaally high level JP. Also shoutouts to Zidane keeping it real. He's completely right, Satoshi outplayed the living fuck out of nearly everyone but LordKnight and Zong, as far as I could tell. Me and Huey did well against him until he understood how the new Bang functioned. There might be a couple others I'm missing. Edited June 14, 2011 by Dacidbro
ZeroRaider Posted June 14, 2011 Posted June 14, 2011 I just wish the BB community could somehow be closer to each other. (OR HAVE SOME GDLK CONNECTIONS)
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