TheGreatReptar Posted May 6, 2012 Posted May 6, 2012 Funny thing I noticed from Kuresu's rampage here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjFwEW0WArQ&t=11m10s . He does 623A>j.236D>j.214D>IAD>j.CC>5C>2CC>blah. Interestingly enough, it one works when the orb only does 4 hits. If it does 5, it drops at 2CC. Seems to be really character specific, and of course spacing specific. Gets like 3/4 screen carry though.
Kiba Posted May 6, 2012 Posted May 6, 2012 Out of curiousity, why does it not work with j.214C? Should be the same result with j.214C, and in the case where I am wrong, then I am unsure as to why it does not work. No way of me testing to see if it is the same case, but try it. Funny thing I noticed from Kuresu's rampage here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qjFwEW0WArQ&t=11m10s . He does 623A>j.236D>j.214D>IAD>j.CC>5C>2CC>blah. Interestingly enough, it one works when the orb only does 4 hits. If it does 5, it drops at 2CC. Seems to be really character specific, and of course spacing specific. Gets like 3/4 screen carry though. Y'know I was surprised that combo worked, and I simply thought it was only due to the 623A P1 buff. Thanks for finding out that other factor TGR. Also, in terms of character specificness, it looks like it may not work on those with smaller hitboxes such as Platinum and Noel, but again I have no way of testing this out right now. It does depend on your execution, because you have to be pretty swift with the IAD j.C.
TheGreatReptar Posted May 6, 2012 Posted May 6, 2012 (edited) I couldn't get only 4 hits on Valk, but could get it pretty easily on Bang. Haven't really tested it on anyone else. Too bad you can't react to the combo counter and adjust accordingly =[ It works on everyone all the time with 623D though. 2500 damage and almost full screen carry off a reversal <3 Edited May 6, 2012 by TheGreatReptar
Kiba Posted May 6, 2012 Posted May 6, 2012 I couldn't get only 4 hits on Valk, but could get it pretty easily on Bang. This is very surprising haha, but for clarification purposes I will make a note of the fact that the combo is character specific in the combo thread.
Errol Posted May 6, 2012 Posted May 6, 2012 you can't get too many hits on noel even if you want to. mugen combos do a good 300 damage less on her. so it might just work auto on her.
TheGreatReptar Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) Possible, spacing specific: Bang Arakune Makoto Tsubaki Rachel Relius Tager (got as low as 2 hits on him..lol. I don't think you can followup with IAD j.C though?) Always take only 4 hits: Noel Platinum Carl (finally good news in the matchup) Mu Litchi Lambda Hazama Doesn't work on at all: Hakumen Valk Jin Ragna Tao Using 623D seems to have mixed results too. It seems sometimes the opponent won't be in untech time long enough for you to IAD j.C. I'll goof around with it maybe tomorrow. Edited May 7, 2012 by TheGreatReptar
Kiba Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) That seems a lot to take in for just one combo. I for sure will not be able to remember all that. I guess we're probably better off using: 623A > j.236D > j.214D > (Slight delay) 6CC > 236B > 214B > 22B Thanks for getting that TGR. Edited May 7, 2012 by Kiba
Errol Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) Man, I'm a little disappointed to clearly see that mugen damage is 3-400 less on like half the cast. I think a full D DP series lets you do an IAD regardless. In mugen you can do 5c>2cc before the IAD of course. I have question for you, if you can answer it, Kiba. How many different ways of doing the 5c>jbb>jc loop do you need to learn? Ragna, Jin, Hazama seem like they can all be done the same way.. Lambda seems like a bitch, although clearly possible, I don't have the timing on it figured out. etc... Edited May 7, 2012 by Errol
Kiba Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) I have question for you, if you can answer it, Kiba. How many different ways of doing the 5c>jbb>jc loop do you need to learn? Ragna, Jin, Hazama seem like they can all be done the same way.. Lambda seems like a bitch, although clearly possible, I don't have the timing on it figured out. etc... I believe it's 2. The majority works with 5C > jB stuff, but against characters like Makoto and Lambda, you may have to do 5BB > j.b stuff. I mentioned this in the combo compilation but I'm gonna double check over it to make sure it's right. Yea it's right. Though it may be unlikely that you will be in range to go into the air loop with 5BB, so unfortunately you may have to opt for the normal route i.e 5BB > 2BB > stuff Edited May 7, 2012 by Kiba
Shruikon Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 I started practicing the 5BB > j.b stuff but I just can't get it down consistently at all =/
Kiba Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 It's like you said dawg, you just started. It's tricky at first, but keep at it and you'll be just fine.
Shruikon Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 Is there any tricks to it or just something you gotta knuckle down and learn? On a related note, I landed a full 7k 5 stock mugen combo in a match today. Felt good.
Errol Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 what's different about using 5bb? what exactly do you do then, not sure I've seen that. Yes, combo compilation is useless!
TheGreatReptar Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) 623X>IAD>j.C just gets a little bit of extra corner carry. On Tao's stage, starting in the corner, I was just in front of like the barrels by the mailbox in the background, compared to being just behind the mailbox by doing j.214D>run a bit>5C>2CC. It's really almost negligible..lol I can't get j.BBC to work on Lambda for anything. j.BB always misses. I just discovered the most bizarro thing with Ragna and the j.BBC loops. If you start with 5BB, on counterhit, Ragna gets a forward reeling sprite on the 5BB, which causes j.B to whiff. You have to delay the mess out of 5BB to get the backwards reel, or just go into 5C. Edited May 7, 2012 by TheGreatReptar
Kiba Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) Is there any tricks to it or just something you gotta knuckle down and learn? On a related note, I landed a full 7k 5 stock mugen combo in a match today. Felt good. Be sure to be inputing J.9B and you have to micro dash the 5C followup to get the 2nd air loop in. The 5C > j.B loop doesn't work against Noel, Carl or Platinum. what's different about using 5bb? what exactly do you do then, not sure I've seen that. Yes, combo compilation is useless! Here, not sure why it's different exactly. All I know is that 5BB puts their animation in a way which allows for the j.B loop. You find the combo compilation useless?! Is there any way in which you would make it better? 623X>IAD>j.C just gets a little bit of extra corner carry. On Tao's stage, starting in the corner, I was just in front of like the barrels by the mailbox in the background, compared to being just behind the mailbox by doing j.214D>run a bit>5C>2CC. It's really almost negligible..lol I can't get j.BBC to work on Lambda for anything. j.BB always misses. Lol, and maybe I made a mistake about it working on Lambda. Did you try 5BB > j.B too? I just discovered the most bizarro thing with Ragna and the j.BBC loops. If you start with 5BB, on counterhit, Ragna gets a forward reeling sprite on the 5BB, which causes j.B to whiff. You have to delay the mess out of 5BB to get the backwards reel, or just go into 5C. Yea this is the same with Jin and 5C CH. If you start with a 5C CH the j.B followup will whiff unless you delay it. This is really specific stuff which needs to be adjusted tbh. It's these little things that people can miss that could completely put the game into our disadvantage. Edited May 7, 2012 by Kiba
Errol Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 You find the combo compilation useless?! Is there any way in which you would make it better? Lol, and maybe I made a mistake about it working on Lambda. Did you try 5BB > j.B too? The combo compilation would be better if it proactively sent me messages about how to do the combos I'm having trouble with. I've even gotten 5c>jbb>jc to land on Lambda. But it's like, so infrequent that I don't think it'd be reliable ever?
Kiba Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 The combo compilation would be better if it proactively sent me messages about how to do the combos I'm having trouble with. Look man, if you're having any trouble with the combos, bug me man! Haha! I've even gotten 5c>jbb>jc to land on Lambda. But it's like, so infrequent that I don't think it'd be reliable ever? Hm, thanks, though in that case we're better off with the standard combo then.
TheGreatReptar Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 I tried 5BB>j.B on Lambda as well. There seems to be 4 categories of characters for the j.BBC loop. Characters it works on, characters it's awkward on, characters that j.B works, but j.BB doesn't, and characters j.B just doesn't work on at all. With characters that only j.B works on, you can still do j.BC>j.236C mixups.
Errol Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 What falls in characters it works on, vs chars it is awkward on for you TGR? Jin/Ragna/Hazama are all pretty easy, I assume Hak, Tager,Relius are similar.. And Kiba, yea, That's what I'm doing!
Kiba Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 I tried 5BB>j.B on Lambda as well. There seems to be 4 categories of characters for the j.BBC loop. Characters it works on, characters it's awkward on, characters that j.B works, but j.BB doesn't, and characters j.B just doesn't work on at all. With characters that only j.B works on, you can still do j.BC>j.236C mixups. In that case, we should probably concentrate on those that the combo completely works fine on. I'll probably make a note of this later, and I figured there were only 3 categories, but the more the merrier eh? And Kiba, yea, That's what I'm doing! Good!
BatousaiJ Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 j.BB and j.236D crossover combos are character specific nightmares but they're both useful so it's good to keep it mind who it works on and who it doesn't.
Errol Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 (edited) Here's my Practical list: Tsubaki, Jin, Ragna, Hazama, Hakumen, Arakune, Rachel, Litchi, Relius, Tager, Valk Two groups within practical really: 1. Have to delay jbb to hit with jbb>jc (Jin, Tsub, Rag, Haz, Rachel) 2. Don't have to delay really to hit with jbb>jc, but if you don't have your timing down anyway then you won't combo with the following 5c, etc. (Tager, Relius, Litchi, Arakune, Hakumen, Valk) Either group seems the same to me, should use the same timing for both I think. Awkward?: bang (feels like, jbb misses, or if jbb hits, jc doesn't combo or hits too high...) Impossible? lambda/mu (jbb hits, but jc doesn't have enough time to come out) noel (jbb almost always just misses?) Taokaka/Makoto (jb always misses for me, whether off 5bb or 5c) Platinum Carl (didn't test) The other thing I'm wondering is how safe it is if you just do it until it drops. is that jC after it drops safe like a safe jump? Built in reset into that would be pretty damn nice... Edited May 7, 2012 by Errol
Kiba Posted May 7, 2012 Posted May 7, 2012 Awkward?: bang (feels like, jbb misses, or if jbb hits, jc doesn't combo or hits too high...) You can do it on Bang but as you said it's VERY awkward. I saw Kuresu land it in one of his matches and I was very surprised as to the fact that it worked. Iunno man, I wouldn't even try it against Bang. Carl (didn't test) It definately will not work on Carl. He's too small. The other thing I'm wondering is how safe it is if you just do it until it drops. is that jC after it drops safe like a safe jump? Built in reset into that would be pretty damn nice... Depends on how much you prorated the combo. If you begin with a 5C, it'll drop at the j.B if you attempt the loop the third time. I think it drops at at j.C if you include j.A/5AA in the combo but you may have to followup with something like j.B > j.CC (you'll get the reset at j.CC). Not sure about the safe jump thing.
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