[CP] Bang Gameplay Discussion

[Dreiko]

Yes I know they all work the same. I'm just saying that FRKZ's length scaling is crap given that we can't continue our combo after it without them being able to tech so far as I know, without the use of this 'cancel overdrive' which would severely reduce its usefulness especially given its current length. And this reduction in length seems to plague all the jp bangs, since I don't think I've ever seen them cancel into OD (Is this an example? Cuz that is unacceptable. Even dora realised he couldn't do a real combo off that). We won't have the luxury of playing mixups with our mobility anymore, so its comboability is necessary. The only non-OD cancel confirm I can think of is CH j.623B > wallbounce > j.OD > j.2 > 5C > continue. :/

There have been some combos which had the OD cancel where bang was not even in orange life and people managed to get easily over 5k midscreen with it. You basically do it for a kill combo or end it in a reset into the new DD if you have the meter. It doesn't need to last for ever and as long as it lasts long enough for a single full combo it's fine. As for ways to activate it without an OD cancel but still combo, stuff that you can jump cancel or web nails should work. I think 5B>2B>6C>jump FRKZ>stuff should work, 2D counters and 6D counters as well.

Yup. And j4C is now jC. j4C is j2C now.

Actually, J4C is JC and JC is J2C now. :p

[Assassin Cross]

There have been some combos which had the OD cancel where bang was not even in orange life and people managed to get easily over 5k midscreen with it. You basically do it for a kill combo or end it in a reset into the new DD if you have the meter. It doesn't need to last for ever and as long as it lasts long enough for a single full combo it's fine. As for ways to activate it without an OD cancel but still combo, stuff that you can jump cancel or web nails should work. I think 5B>2B>6C>jump FRKZ>stuff should work, 2D counters and 6D counters as well.

Hmm that sounds reassuring. The problem is getting that one hit in to confirm into a combo without wasting too much time on OD gauge (or dying), which seems to be the problem for the jp bangs. :/ And that combo that you wrote seems like it should work, so I find it odd that I haven't seen anyone do it, and instead they opt for activating it during a blockstring or at neutral :/. Really don't like this new timed FRKZ TT^TT

Edited December 22, 2012 by Assassin Cross

[Skye]

He meant j.c is now j.2c.

On the subject of OD cancelling, just jc or jcc into OD, this way Bang gets the full duration, in pressure I've seen it TK'd for an instant overhead, I'm sure it can be hit confirmed into the same stuff from say, 5c or a raw 5b or 2b. It should work since air FRKZ halts all air momentum and Bang just drops.

Just a few thoughts.

[DragonLordZ]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=dRnX0q5mZ9c#t=420s

WOW, that looked cool as FUCK, it looks like the momentum continuing properties of j.22A haven't even been touched on yet by anyone but this guy in comparison to what else I've seen so far.

Seriously, this new move is so underused in the matches I've seen so far.

[gamester]

It glides you down nicely to make mix-ups more complicated to read by the looks of things. How about hanging around for Astral Input xD

Edit: I don't see why that move can't be used to then pull of an astral.

Edited December 24, 2012 by gamester

[Dat_Boy_DeAnte]

Yup. And j4C is now jC. j4C is j2C now.

Am I the only one hype for this change? This is gonna make IAD Combos a lot easier off 6C BnBs! Also 5B combos look a lot longer (adding the IAD combo BnB) so we have standing mid screen but what about crouching combos? Someone me a great one if you see one that is...

[Dreiko]

IAD combos were already kinda easy lol, what this will affect is FRKZ air confirms off of random pokes that you can't react to in time and had to guess which side the dash would put you on and hope you get J4C and not JC, which now won't be an issue any more.

[YukiBlue]

IAD Combos always made me trip up compared to ones with Tsubaki etc. Holding back after doing it was a pain to learn.

[GreekAscendedDust]

It was always kinda hard to IAD J4C off of J4C. Now I can just JC into relaunches without that hard of a time

[Solemen]

http://youtu.be/owfCb5lAh3g?t=2m53s

Bang just threw 3 POISON nails right? Right O_O?

*EDIT: Did I miss that change somewhere...?*

[zeth07]

http://youtu.be/owfCb5lAh3g?t=2m53s

Bang just threw 3 POISON nails right? Right O_O?

*EDIT: Did I miss that change somewhere...?*

It's been mentioned a few times. Maybe not in this thread though.

[GreekAscendedDust]

http://youtu.be/owfCb5lAh3g?t=2m53s

Bang just threw 3 POISON nails right? Right O_O?

*EDIT: Did I miss that change somewhere...?*

I don't even know if we can do that. Those nails don't have yellow scarves.....

[DragonLordZ]

http://youtu.be/owfCb5lAh3g?t=2m53s

Bang just threw 3 POISON nails right? Right O_O?

*EDIT: Did I miss that change somewhere...?*

Seems pretty weird to me tbh, and i'm surprised that no ones done it before I mean those nails definitely don't bounce, Bang stops in the air before he throws them and they clearly arent B-nails with explosions.

[heavymetalmixer]

Seems pretty weird to me tbh, and i'm surprised that no ones done it before I mean those nails definitely don't bounce, Bang stops in the air before he throws them and they clearly arent B-nails with explosions.

The angle of nails is like the A nails angle (like 30°)

[Dreiko]

Hehe, one of Bang's lines during the startup of Shipuugeki (the new DD) is "I live in the moment!" lol. That's one way of saying either I'll get blown up or I'll be awesome.

[GreekAscendedDust]

Hehe, one of Bang's lines during the startup of Shipuugeki (the new DD) is "I live in the moment!" lol. That's one way of saying either I'll get blown up or I'll be awesome.

That fits so well. Either they eat it or you do, no exceptions

[Assassin Cross]

So we can get 4 seals with grounded 5d and 6d CH. what about 2d and j.d? Does does CSE's 2d combo still work? Can't remember. :/

[Skye]

2d maybe. Might be character/positioning specific, because it would involve * > 6d > j.236c.

On the subject of seals, why aren't Bang players hustling for them the way they used to? I know my agenda is first and foremost to grab seals so when I got meter, I get real estate with it. Is it some bit about honor or not being cheap?

[Assassin Cross]

Dunno whats so dishonorable about getting seals. And Dora almost always prioritises seal combos over IAD combos iirc, so I'm just guessing that it's just a difference in play style on whether they want good raw damage, or stronger dd's and air control.

[GreekAscendedDust]

I keep thinking that reason A is the seal placement on certain drives and reason B is that FRKZ is an overdrive.

Its probably a mental thing rather than an actual game mechanic thing

[Skye]

But then they haven't been using FRKZ either.

I don't know, again my first order of business is to satisfy any prerequisites I need to in order to compromise my opponent's moving space.

Simple strategy. Effective strategy.

[GreekAscendedDust]

Its effective yes, but meh... Its all a subjective playstyle thing

[Skye]

I guess...

Something like this I say is objectively optimal, though.

[GreekAscendedDust]

So the New DD gives frame advantage on knockdown... At least blowing 50 heat on new DD is incredibly worth it http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=anMZIXakpCk#t=447s

[rei-Scarred]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=LDKAYEpf-wo#t=408s

woah, was this known? looks like you could maybe get a lot of this with like 2B 6C j.D web etc