[CP] Bang Gameplay Discussion

[Skye]

Full invul.

[DragonLordZ]

A SEXILY practical 4 seal combo right here http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=x8jbqbw_Dyo#t=597s

CH 6D > 9jump > C-nail > dash 2D > normaljump/s.j (not sure which) j.D > C-nail > 5D

I don't think it looks corner dependant and I'm not sure if you could get daifunka after the 5D or if that only works at the end of FRKZ combos but damn that looks nice!

EDIT: I posted the rest of the videos from this set in the videos thread, and Sanshan does some GODLY things in the rest so I suggest you watch all three parts!

Edited December 17, 2012 by DragonLordZ

[superscience890]

What do you mean by full invuln? I... don't understand.

[kaeru]

A SEXILY practical 4 seal combo right here http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=x8jbqbw_Dyo#t=597s

CH 6D > 9jump > C-nail > dash 2D > normaljump/s.j (not sure which) j.D > C-nail > 5D

I don't think it looks corner dependant and I'm not sure if you could get daifunka after the 5D or if that only works at the end of FRKZ combos but damn that looks nice!

EDIT: I posted the rest of the videos from this set in the videos thread, and Sanshan does some GODLY things in the rest so I suggest you watch all three parts!

yea, 5D is no longer super cancellable as of the last info we got. BUT the 5D in FRKZ is different, that one is super (and maybe special) cancellable

[heavymetalmixer]

How did he cancel his 5D here?

http://youtu.be/y5BEWGTOzlY?t=8m37s

[Lucalibur]

What do you mean by full invuln? I... don't understand.

It means that during the entire startup you're INV. Think pre CP Blood Kain where the animation keeps going but Ragna can't get hit.

[kaeru]

How did he cancel his 5D here?

http://youtu.be/y5BEWGTOzlY?t=8m37s

at 8:41 - 8:42, i really don't know what that is. Mu clearly hits the guard point, and right where Bang wouldve teleported, he got downback barrier instead. This is some sort of kara cancel i guess. Most moves are kara cancellable into barrier during superflash if they are early in startup, but i don't know what's required to pull this off.

[superscience890]

How did he cancel his 5D here?

http://youtu.be/y5BEWGTOzlY?t=8m37s

My guess is that he kara canceled 5d into barrier during guard point frames!?!?!? The only way this is possible is if it hits the earliest guard points, but still seems weird.

So... start up invuln right?

Edited December 17, 2012 by superscience890

[zeth07]

I hope that is just an additional change to where we can just block after a successful guardpoint instead of teleporting or letting it go. Meaning we aren't committed to the move completely now.

[Skye]

That'd be really cool.

[Dat_Boy_DeAnte]

Please tell me the Platinum player is just being dumb here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n5DlMIgwZYw&t=5m55s

EDIT: Wait a sec. Does FRKZ still give Bang +2 when activated?

As for platinum she tried to back step and she got caught I remember bang's DD only catching you if your in the air and since your in the air when you back step she got caught. SICK SHIT!

[GreekAngel]

As for platinum she tried to back step and she got caught I remember bang's DD only catching you if your in the air and since your in the air when you back step she got caught. SICK SHIT!

Actually, you see she was trying to block it. Idk what would make you think its blockable, but that Platinum didn't really know what to do about it

[mAc Chaos]

It catches you if you're on the air or on the ground. The only time it won't catch you is if you're in jump start up or doing something invincible.

[DragonLordZ]

It catches you if you're on the air or on the ground. The only time it won't catch you is if you're in jump start up or doing something invincible.

I don't think the bold part is true as Dora was trying for literally nothing but the grab in one of his matches and it was plain to see that when he tried it on a grounded opponent they had time to jump out from neutral standing position.

I've also seen it beaten in the air if they are already doing an attack that hits behind them and their attack is in its active frames, and one weird instance with a Mu player where the Bang did the FRKZ version but the Mu got behind him and landed on the ground before it went active, resulting in the ground version of the DD but weirdly he teleported in FRONT of the Mu player and not behind, and was beaten by Mu's 2A when it wasn't already in active frames.

I've seen some GODLY uses for the DD and it should make Bang's late game MUCH better if he can get those seals because there wasnt much point in FRKZ when you both had low health but with this new move we should be able to do some mind games to get the grab out and make it hit, it's also worth noting that it does as much damage as Ashura used to which is a very good thing.

[zeth07]

I don't think these were the combos I posted from the jbbs last time:

このスレで書かれたマーク回収コンをまとめました

漏れがあったりこっちの方がいいよー的なものがあれば申し訳ございませぬ

問題が無ければ現状のまとめも兼ねてwikiに載せようと思います

○中央3～4枚コン

5A>5B>6C>JD>C釘>ディレイ6D>C釘>5Dor2D　【林火+風or山】

タオカカ　ハザマ　レリウス　アズラエルのみ対応

空コマ投げ>バング着地後rc>2D>JD>C釘>5C>6D　【　林火山】

とりあえずコマ投げから３枚

投げ>キレC釘>微ダ2D>JD>C釘>5C>6D 　【　林火山】

ヴァルケンハインのみ非対応

投げ>ムササビ>C釘>2D>JD>C釘>5C>6D　【　林火山】

ヴァルケンハイン用

投げ>キレC釘>(微ダ)2D>JD>ディレイC釘>6D>C釘>5D　【風林火山】

タオカカ　ハザマ　レリウスのみ対応(アズラエルも？)

5Cfc>6A>5A>5B>2B>5D>5A>5B>2B>6C>JD>C釘>2Dエリアルor5C>6D　約2600　【風林火　】

5Cfc時は6A>5A、5D>5A　6A>6B　2B>6Bが繋がる

○端寄り～端4枚コン

中央からやや端(全キャラ対応)

2A>5B>2B>6C>JD>C釘>5D>6D>C釘>2D　ダメージ不明

5A>5B>2B>6C>JD>C釘>5D>6D>C釘>2D　ダメージ不明

5B>2B>6C>JD>C釘>5D>6D>C釘>2D>JC>J2C　3460

5B>2B>6C>低ダJC>J2C>微ダ5A>2B>5D>6D>C釘>2D>JD　未確認

　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　　>2D>JD>C釘>5C>6D　　　

端(全キャラ対応)

5B>2B>2C>双>2B>5D>5B>6C>ｊｃJD>ディレイC釘>6D>C釘>2D>JC>J2C　3200

5C>(6Aor2C)>双>2B>5D>5B>6C>ｊｃJD>ディレイC釘>6D>C釘>2D>JC>J2C　　5C>2Cで2950

6Brc>5B>2B>2C>双>2B>5D>5B>6C>ｊｃJD>ディレイC釘>6D>C釘>2D>JC>J2C　3200

(2C)>双>2B>5D>5B>6C>ｊｃJD>ディレイC釘>6D>C釘>2D>JC>J2C　不明

6D>双>2B>5D>5B>6C>jcJD>ディレイC釘>2D>(JC>J2C?)

画面端付近投げ

投げ>C釘>2D>JD>ディレイC釘>6D>C釘>5D　2400?

投げ>ムササビ>JD>C釘>5D>6D>C釘>2D>JC>J2C　約2500　端不可端寄りで可 　壁まで近すぎるなら5D>2Dで

カウンター始動

5D地上ch>(微ダ)2D>JD>C釘>5C>6D>(双>2B>6C>JC>J2C)　全キャラ可

端寄り

5D空中ch>ダッシュ6D>C釘>2D>JD　中央不可（位置調整が難）　全キャラ可

2Dch>(ディレイ)JD>ディレイC釘>5D>6D>双>2B>6C>JC>J2C　中央不可　端限定　全キャラ可

JDch>2B>5D>ダッシュ6D>C釘>2D>JC>J2C　中央不可　端限定　全キャラ可

6Dch>2B>5D>5B>6C>jcJD>ディレイC釘>2D>(JC>J2C?)

○cODを絡めた回収コン

中央立ち喰らい

5A>5B>2B>6C>JD>C釘>2D>cOD1>JC>空双(OD終了)>5C>6D>双or大噴火　3000or3800　【　林火山】

5A>5B>2B>6C>JD>C釘>2D>cOD2>JC>空双>5C>6D>5D>(大噴火)　2800or4000　【風林火山】

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低ダJC>J2C>A釘>5A拾いのパーツって6C>最速低ダJCじゃないと

J2CA釘後の微ダ5Aが当たらないと思うんだが

ちなみにノエルとかは微ダなくても5A当たると思う

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6BRC>JB>J2C>5B>(2C)>双>2B>5D>5B>6C>ｊｃJD>ディレイC釘>6D>C釘>2D>JC>J2C

最初のJBJ2C入れても多分できると思

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Ａ釘挟んだ３～４枚コン、割とどのキャラにも出来るかも

５Ｂ>２Ｂ>６Ｃ>２２Ａ>ＪＣ>５Ｂ>ｈＪＣ>低ダＪＣ>Ｊ２Ｃ>Ａ釘>微ダ５Ａ>６Ｃ>ＪｃＪＤ>Ｃ釘>６Ｄ、もしくは５Ｄ～

とりあえず～２Ｄ>ＪＣ>Ｊ２Ｃ〆でどっちも3750くらいだった

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5B2C双って入っても最後のJCJ2Cまで確認したので

6B始動もそこそこコンボ時間結構長く設定されてるぽい

ちなみに3200～3300くらい

5B>2B>6C>ムサJC>微ダ5B>JC>jc空ダJC>J2C>5A>5B>JA>JB>JC>jc>JB>J2C

これJ2C後の5A>5B拾いが中々安定しないんだけどキャラ限かな…？

安定してる人コツ教えてほしい。とりあえず全部最速でやればok？

最初のJC当てるのが遅くて高度が高すぎて拾えないのか

jc空ダJC>J2Cのパーツにディレイが必要なのかいまいちわかんね。

見た目かっこいいし3700くらい出るので是非習得したい

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普通に2Cですね

ところで空投げからのコンボ↓よりもっとダメ出るコンボある？

なんかもっと伸びそうなんだがいまいち確認してない

空投げ>(5C)>2C>双>2B>5B>エリアル

空投げ>6D>双>2B>5B>エリアル

空投げ>ダッシュ3C>微ダ2A>5B>エリアル

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Proration Stuff:

キャラコンボレート80%

ダメージ 初段/乗算

_A:300 100/77

2A:300　90/75

6A:540　90/89

_B:640 100/89

2B:620 100/89

6B:780　80/92

_C:760　80/92

2C:750 90/79

6C:820 100/84

3C:880　95/94

_D:560　80/84

2D:710　80/87

6D:710　80/87

JA:300　90/77

JB:560　90/85

J4B:840　80/94

JC:600　90/92

J2C:650　90/89

JD:630　80/84

投げ:0,1400 100/100,60

空投げ:0,1400　100/100,60

双:1300 80/72

空双:1300 80/92

A釘:300 70/90

B釘(1):300 70/90

B釘(2):300 [初段*乗算約63%]

C釘:300 70/75

(3本投げ…詳しく調べてないけど個々の値は1本と同じだと思う)

D釘: [3hit587]

傘:CPUで調べるの辛い

コマ投げ:0*2,600,653,842 -/-*2,-,50,-(3段目追撃約81%,4段目追撃約40.4%)(2段目巴投げ部分忘れた)

空コマ投げ:0,700,785,1000 100/100,85,85,-(2段目追撃約85%,4段目追撃約72.3%)

大噴火:0,910*4,3733 75/80,92*4,65(生当て2836,最低保障-%--)

阿修羅:0,2475 100/40(生当て1980,最低保障40%990)

疾風撃:？(生当て2754)

[0枚OD…大噴火1867,阿修羅1188。4枚OD…大噴火3719,阿修羅1980,疾風撃4905]

CT:1000 80/100(キャラコンボレートを無視する)

CA:0 -/-

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画面端

5B>2B>2C>双>微ダ2B>5B>jcJB>JC>ムササビJC>ディレイ空双>5A>5B>JA>JB>JC>jcJC>J2C　3700程度　

端に近いと、5B>2B>6C>ムササビJC>微ダ5B>jcJB>JC>ムササビJC>ディレイ空双>5A>5B>jcJA>JB>jcJC>J2C

とかも確認しました。

ディレイ空双は空中判定の下？か足らへんギリギリじゃないと、5Aが繋がりませんでした。

です。やってる事が、EXと似てて既出だと思いますがどうでしょうか？

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簡単な実戦でも十分狙える難易度のODコン

中央

ODゲージがかなり短い時用（火のみ点灯時

～>OD>2C>JD>OD大噴火　大体3000～4200程度

OD1（体力半分　火のみ点灯時）

5C>OD>2C>6C>JD>2B>双>5B>6C>8dJC>空双>5C>6D>OD大噴火　4800

5B>2B>OD>5B>2B>2C>6C>JD>2B>双>5B>6C>8dJC>空双>5C>6D>OD大噴火　5600

双のバウンド後ひきつけて5Bやらないと空双スカる

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ODゲージがかなり短い時用（火のみ点灯時

～>OD>2C>6C>JD>OD大噴火　大体3000～4200程度

訂正

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JD>C釘が安定しないようなレベルじゃ誰使ったってコンボ安定しないでしょうよ。

画面端5B始動

5B>2B>6C>ムサ>JC>空双>5B>6C>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双or大噴火

4200or5100

毒ダメ有るから実際はもっとダメ高い。

まじで高火力になってきたなｗ

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Cjc低ダJCJ2Cで3回拾いなおす奴が今作最高の鬼畜難易度。

俺はディレイが全く安定しないから諦めて毒釘の運びコン使ってる

5B>2B>6C>低ダJC>J2C>A釘>(スライド)5A>2B>5D>5B>(2B)>JA>JB>JC>JC>J2C

3500＋毒　（風　　　）

5B>2B>6C>低ダJC>J2C>A釘>(スライド)5A>2B>5D>6D>C釘>2D>JC>J2C

3200くらい＋毒　(風林　山)

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A釘コン　5B始動(J4Bとか補正緩くて立ち喰らいなら大体可）

5B>2B>6C>微dl低ダ(高度調整)>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>5B>JA>JB>JC>JC>J2C

5B>2B>6C>微dl低ダ(高度調整)>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>5B>JA>JB>JC>JB>JC>空双（中央スラ5Aしなかったときなど）

5B>2B>6C>微dl低ダ(高度調整)>JC>J2C>A釘>(スライド)5A>2B>5D>5B>(2B)>エリアル

5B>2B>6C>微dl低ダ(高度調整)>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>2B>JC>jc低ダJC>J2C

5B>2B>6C>微dl低ダ(高度調整)>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>2B>5D>5B>(2B)>エリアル

5B>2B>6C>微dl低ダ(高度調整)>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>6C>(jc)JD>C釘>5C>6D>双or大噴火

6C後に最速ではなくやや高度調整でディレイかけるのが重要

以下JCJ2CA釘5Aを全て最速で入れると安定する。

特にA釘後の5Aは最速じゃないと厳しい

スライド5Aのみ対応キャラがわからんので調べてくる

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始動別にダメージ重視のコンボまとめてみた。つってもまだ足りてないと思うけど……。

火力はマーク無し時。

中央

5B>2B>6C>空ダJC>J2C>A釘>5A>2B>JC>空ダJC>J2C>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

3600

5B>2B>3Crc>2B>5B>JC>空ダJC>J2C>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

3700

JB>5A>5B>2B>6C>空ダJC>J2C>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

2600

JB>5B>6C>空ダJC>J2C>A釘>5A>2B>JC>空ダJC>J2C>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

3100

A釘>5B>2B>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

約2000

6Brc>空ダJB>JC>2B>5B>6A>2C>双

2700

投げ>ムサ>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

2600

投げ>JB>JC>5C>6A>6C>JC>空双

3100

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端

5B>2B>3Crc>5C>6A>6C>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>(5C>)6D>双

4100

5B>2B>6C>ムサJC>空双>5B>6C>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

4200

J2C>5B>6C>ムサ>JC>空双>5B>6C>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

3900

J2C>5B>2B>6C>ムサ>JC>空双>5B>双>6A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

4100

J2C>5B>2B>(2C>)双>2B>6C>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

3400

5C>2Cor6A>双>2B>6C>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>空双

3000

6A>2C>双>2B>6C>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

3000

6Brc>5B>2C>双>2B>6C>JC>J2C>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

3200

投げ>A釘>5A>6C>JD>C釘>5C>6D>双

2600

投げ>A釘>5A>2B>5D>5C>6D>双

2400

投げ>JB>JC>双>6A>6C>JC>空双

3100

以下補足。

6A以外のA系統は、恐らく基礎コンが一番ダメージ高い。

CTは当てても繋ぎに良いのがない。

中央だと裏当てになったりするし、現状はA釘コン安定かな。

使うとすればODコンか。

J攻撃のコンボ時間はJA以外は同じみたい。

ダメージ表記は毒抜きのダメージ。

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3Cfc>【2B>6B】*4>2B>5B>JA>JB>JC>JC>J2C

3Cfc>【2B>6B】*3>2B>5B>JC>低ダJC>J2C>5A>5B>JA>JB>JC>JC>J2C

両方4600くらいだったと思うから好きな方使って。ゲージ回収みてない

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火をつけた状態でODいけるので使えるかと思ったんですが、早い段階で空双使うせいかあまりコンボ伸びませんでした

スパーリングの体力半分位で

5A>5B>2B>6C>JD>OD>6C>空双>5C>6D>2D>5D

で4枚とって復帰される、５B始動だと５Dの後に大噴火が繋がって5000くらい

5B>2B>6C>JD>OD>6C>空双>5C>6D>大噴火でも同じく5000くらいなんでダメージとるならこっちでいいかも

端の位置によって空双>5Cが繋がらないので結構微妙かもしれません

jccODにすると５Aくらいしか間に合わずB始動時なら5B>2B>6C>JD>jccOD>５A>6C>～

が出来たけど調べれてません

もっと良い繋ぎがあれば伸びそうなんですが、

今のとこ５B始動ならほとんどの場合OD使わずループコンにしてますね

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Pastebin of everything I've posted from the jbbs so far in this thread so it doesn't get lost in all these pages:

http://pastebin.com/uQFGg9PG

Edited December 18, 2012 by zeth07

[Tofma]

I don't quite understand why making FRKZ his overdrive would change the +2 advantage. The mechanic itself is universal, sure, but isn't it still the same FRKZ?

FRKZ-->New super possibly being a legit fullscreen AA just sounds kinda cool. Though I guess doing the new super straight afterwards might give a purple throw if it's 1f.

[YukiBlue]

All I want for Christmas is float on 5D Regular hit.

[Lucalibur]

All I want for Christmas is float on 5D Regular hit.

Either this or enough stagger to follow up with dash 5A for me.

[kaeru]

if you hit with 5D raw as first hit, even on non counter hit, you can combo with 5A or 2A afterwards.

Also i think the new 5D forces standing, if you're willing to spend the meter, you can potentially convert a crouching combo with it using rapid cancel.

Edited December 18, 2012 by kaeru

[Skye]

I remember a change being 6c being able to connect on crouch. Did that change stay? If so why not use that?

[YukiBlue]

I remember a change being 6c being able to connect on crouch.

That shit is straight up TABOO here.

[kaeru]

I remember a change being 6c being able to connect on crouch. Did that change stay? If so why not use that?

I'm afraid that's not the case, Skye

[YukiBlue]

Shit guys. I get tingly feelings just thinking about 6C hitting crouchers.

[Skye]

Damn, then if I get that first seal, I'll just go into 2c > 214b midscreen. I love that shit.

[zeth07]

Damn, then if I get that first seal, I'll just go into 2c > 214b midscreen. I love that shit.

Not to say you shouldn't do that, but why would you do that if 5D ender gives you an almost guaranteed mixup while a bumper mixup is more or less a crapshoot on whether or not you'll even get the mixup off it.