[CP] Amane Nishiki Gameplay Discussion

[Eternal Blaze]

It looks like your opponent can hit your Hariken drills to destroy them. Potofu tried to destroy 6D as well but he got clipped by the hitbox.

Yeah I noticed that too. Reminded me of people setting off Testament's trees and shit with crouching limbs.

I'm also noticing that people's usage of j.2b is very rare now as opposed to the first week or so.. i barely see it anymore.

I've also yet to see any combos with j.6D in matches, even when people start a combo in the corner and have lvl3 no one seems to use it, wouldve thought that more people would use it for the wallbounce to extend their combos.

[Nannoth]

EDIT 2x: Bullet versus Amane

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4_9mGOmQSw (at 3:12 ish-Amane says "Not today!" in English. I wonder if that's character specific dialogue)

It is not to Bullet, at least, because I heard him say it against Ragna as well. I am not convinced he randomly switches to English to say "Not today!" for no apparent reason.

[WillWork4Instal]

C moves cannot beat Platinum's bullets (darn)

Shadow and his genius improv combos

Seeing Jin use his counter super on Hariken reminded me that Hakumen can pull shenanigans. Bang could close in on us using his counter on that too.

More stuff! Throw > Hariken does NOT work, though it looks like it could.

Our crush trigger really is crap. I saw a Litchi and Bullet tech out after the hit like nothing. We caught them with Hariken afterwards, but I don't think that's an unblockable setup.

Hinane-chan actually tried to play Amane as a rushdown a little bit, and it worked out okay (Which is good for me, I don't think I could play Amane without being a rushdown)

PICK HER UP! This read is beautiful, and a great combo to start the round too. Arguably my favorite Amane combo so far.

Edited December 8, 2012 by WillWork4Instal

[Boodendorf]

I've noticed something from Shadow, he's really good at instant blocking, which is really important since it gives more meter (which means you'll have your GTFO moves faster), but how does one train at IBing? I've been having trouble with it.

Oh and is it me or it seems that Amane has a slightly different voice against Jin?

[STenSatsu]

A lot of times I treat it kind of like a rhythm game. Most of the time people don't really stagger so you get a feel for when the next hit comes. If you have a copy of a BB you can set the opponent to do common blockstrings and practice IBing. If people start staggering then I just try to do it by sight.

[soujiro seta]

I can't believe i'm just realizing amane gains a lot of heat off lvl 3 hand and leg drills, blocked or hitconfirm. He and his opponent gain heat, but more so amane than his opponent even off his insane chip.

1.55-1.58

7.27-7.40

[DerQ]

I'm also noticing that people's usage of j.2b is very rare now as opposed to the first week or so.. i barely see it anymore.

I don't think it's because it's bad though, I think it's because certain matchups won't allow you to be able to freely use it. If you take a look at amane matches where they use it a lot, you'll notice that most of the time amane gets hit or loses control of the match is when j.B fails. When you are faced with a matchup or a player that can deal with that j.B gameplan, you're forced to learn how to deal without it. It's like some of the guys who played the japanese at blazblue during NEC. They were saying that they're so used and conditionned to mixups that you feel you can't use it on them, so you have to beat them using something else.

if jump.B is good but they condition themselves quickly on beating it efficiently so early in the lifespan of the game, then it's most likely the explanation as for why you might not see it that much. Or maybe only during certain matches.

Oh and I assume it's also due that they've gotten more efficient at using the drill and if your levels are up, your gameplan changes.

Edited December 9, 2012 by DerQ

[Eternal Blaze]

Yeah i never said its bad, definitely has its uses. Was just making an observation more or less..

Do we have a clear pic of Amane's first 6 colors? Dont think i've seen those

[Toasty]

Do we have a clear pic of Amane's first 6 colors? Dont think i've seen those

No, the only things (colors included) from the game that we've been able to see are those that are unlockables via Nesica account for the arcade. Since the first 6 colors are default, they would not appear in the things to be unlocked so we don't get them. D:

[WillWork4Instal]

I'll find the default colors in previous videos. Just give me a little bit~

I'll edit this as I go. Keep in mind these won't be good quality, because the early vids with the early 6 palletes did'nt have that good of footage. Sorry.

Number 1: Default

Number 2:?

Number 3:? http://vvcap.net/db/_KI3qJf4AmTIN0zf9xQp.htp

Number 4:? http://vvcap.net/db/ihgLBLCQITuK2tc2ukPj.htp

Number 5: http://vvcap.net/db/9kyOiYvPDqgrTdGCt4Pu.htp

Number 6: http://vvcap.net/db/NAaIEODYYhIE4X9Y_vxc.htp

Don't know the orders of 2,3, and 4

That's the ones I could find.

Edited December 9, 2012 by WillWork4Instal

[Boodendorf]

So I've been thinking, only the second hit of C moves pull on hit/block right? Then against opponents we don't want closer to us, like Tager, when spacing with C moves, should we do something like 5C(1), 2C(1), 236D~D to avoid pulling them? (on block ofc, on hit you just want to get damages so you'll go for two hits and whatever combo you want)

[TD]

yes that would probably be ideal for zoning him, although everything matchup wise is just theory atm. looking at the way his ribbons work the MU might work like litchi vs tager did in extend where we have that one (maybe more with amane) super abusable move that keeps tager from starting any kind of offense. l don't compare it to lambda only because of the physical vs projectile zoning going on.

[Boodendorf]

yes that would probably be ideal for zoning him, although everything matchup wise is just theory atm. looking at the way his ribbons work the MU might work like litchi vs tager did in extend where we have that one (maybe more with amane) super abusable move that keeps tager from starting any kind of offense. l don't compare it to lambda only because of the physical vs projectile zoning going on.

Well my best guess would be something like that:

Amane would pressure constantly Tager using 5C(1) (does it whiff on crouched tager?) and 2C(1) cancelled into 236D~D or maybe a drill. Then if Amane think Tager is going to jump, he can catch him using 6C(1) 5C(1) 236D~D. 6D, backward fabhop into air Cs(1) would also be used a lot I believe.

[Toasty]

So I've been thinking, only the second hit of C moves pull on hit/block right? Then against opponents we don't want closer to us, like Tager, when spacing with C moves, should we do something like 5C(1), 2C(1), 236D~D to avoid pulling them? (on block ofc, on hit you just want to get damages so you'll go for two hits and whatever combo you want)

Just one slight correction- The first hit of C moves does pull your opponent in to some degree when on hit, as evidenced by combos that use 5C > 6C(1) as it pulls them towards you still. On block however, you are correct.

Also I'm not too sure how safe 236D~D would be against him after C moves, but it more than likely is at C range. If not, there's always a backwards fabhop to prevent you from pulling them in. Whichever works!

[Krusiv]

It's about time someone made an Amane combo video! www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3mWDNtFURU

[WillWork4Instal]

It's about time someone made an Amane combo video! www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3mWDNtFURU

I was so happy to see this. I was going to post it same time as you too!

j.236A > j.236C. Didn't know that you had to fabhop in order for that to work.

What was that last combo doing there? It was 5B > 3C all right, but why show a Drill cancel into a 2B like it's a combo? I guess the guy just wanted to notate it. (Ironic because he didn't add 5B but included the non combo part)

My hype for Amane has been restored again.

Edited December 10, 2012 by WillWork4Instal

[superscience890]

http://bbdabun.blog.fc2.com/blog-entry-67.html

Have some Amane data.

Character Combo rate - 80%

For the first section, it's

Move name, P1, P2, ???

Second section is moves and their startup.

Third is what's the move on block, and the last section has total frames for that move.

This isn't official, just what someone found out on their own.

[Boodendorf]

Nice to have a preview of his frame data. I'm surprised his 2A has 7 frame startup.

Not surprised about the huge negative on block/hit(?) for any other attacks than his 5A/2A, seeing how you can cancel everything into fabhop it actually makes sense, to me at least.

Gonna watch that cmv now.

Edited December 10, 2012 by Boodendorf

[STenSatsu]

His P2s look kinda bleh, though I guess 80% combo rate is a bit higher than most characters in CP. Can we gatling into 6b at all from like 5b? Seems like starter>6b>air C attacks would be some of our bigger damage. Looks like we should always let C moves hit twice unless you cannot do the combo thanks to it since they only apply P2 once. Wonder if you can do 623c>CT as an anti-jump starter with them in corner, would lead to hilarious damage.

EDIT: Also, for anyone on the Amane board who can speak japanese, https://twitter.com/SPINKING_ONLINE. One of the better Marvel/'kusoge' players in Japan seems to have a lot of posts about Amane judging by google translate. He also has like 2k games played as Amane already and is I think 3rd or 4th highest ranked.

Edited December 10, 2012 by STenSatsu

[Robawtninja]

Ahh Spinking, one of the Kusoge Gods, plays Amane. Yay!

[FatalCounter]

Here are the Amane data, I don't know if they are the right numbers but some are questionable, really weird. We will wait and see. Can anyone translate what is written in japanese?

キャラコンボレート 80, ( amazing)

技名 ダメージ 初段 乗算 (DDの保障)

5A 300×2 100 77once

5B 200×3 100 89

5C 585,315 100 89once

2A 300×2 484 100 77once

2B 450 90 85

2C 520,280 89 90once

3C 720 90 85

6A 500 90 89

6B 500 90 94

6C 845,455 100 89once

JA 300×2 90 77once

JB 200×3 90 89once

J2B 700 90 89

JC 520,280 90 89once

J6C 650,350 90 89once

J4C 520,280 90 89once What is wrong with this move? j5C or j4C?

クラッシュトリガー/ Crush Trigger 1000 80 100 キャラコンボレート無視

投げ/ Throw 1400 100 60

空中投げ/ Air throw 700,700 100 60once *初段キャンセルも補正同じ

5D

level 1 180×n 70 60once

level 2 233×n 75 60once

level 3 324×n 80 60once

2D

level 1 200×n 70 60once

level 2 260×n 75 60once

level 3 360×n 80 60once

6D

level 1 300×n 70 60once

level 2 300×n 75 60once

level 3 300×n 80 60once

JD

level 1 130×n 70 60once

level 2 169×n 75 60once

level 3 234×n 80 60once

J6D

level 1 220×n 70 60once

level 2 286×n 75 60once

level 3 396×n 80 60once

236C 180×6,600 100 80once

236D

level 1 200×15 70 92×15

level 2 200×15 75 92×15

level 3 200×15 80 92×15

623C 0,2300 100 100,70

J236C 150×n,800 100 72once

632146C

level 1 800,950 100 92,60 160,190

level 2 800,1600 100 92,60 160,320

level 3 800,2350 100 92,60 160,470

OD

level 1 800,400×2,950 100 92,89×2,60 160,80×2,190

level 2 800,400×3,1600 100 92×4,65 160,80×3,320

3 800,400×6,2350 100 92,94×6,65 160,80×6,470

632146D

level 1 200×n 70 90 40×n

level 2 200×n 75 92

level 3 200×n 80 94

OD

level 1 200×n 70 90

level 2 200×n 75 92

level 3 200×n 80 94

・発生/ Startup?

5A 6

2A 7

5B 11

2B 9

5C 20

2C 21

6A 12

6B 15

6C 30

3C 14

JA 6

JB 14

J2B 13

JC 18

J6C 19

J4C 19

投げ 8

クラッシュトリガー 30

5D 17

2D 14

6D 44

J5D 13

J6D 19

236DA 50

236C 15

623C 25?

J236C 11

632146C 5+5?

・硬直差 Frame advantage on block ?

5A +2

2A ±0

5B -10

2B -16

5C -5

2C -10

6A -8

6B -3(空中)

3C -6

最低空J2B +3

5DLv1 -1(以降長押しも同じ)

5DLv2 +1

5DLv3 +3

6DLv1 +2

6DLv2 +4

6DLv3 +6

236C -8

J236C -9

236DA +49

632146C -24

・主要技全体

5A 25

2A 28

5B 41

2B 40

5C 49

2C 55

6A 36

6C 62

3C 38

5D 44

236DD 20

Edited December 10, 2012 by FatalCounter

[superscience890]

Here are the Amane data, I don't know if they are the right numbers but some are questionable, really weird. We will wait and see. Can anyone can translate what is written in japanese.

http://bbdabun.blog.fc2.com/blog-entry-67.html

Have some Amane data.

Character Combo rate - 80%

For the first section, it's

Move name, P1, P2, ???

Second section is moves and their startup.

Third is what's the move on block, and the last section has total frames for that move.

This isn't official, just what someone found out on their own.

投げ - Throw

空中投げ - Air Throw

クラッシュトリガー - Crush Trigger

キャラコンボレート無視 - Ignore char combo rate

[Toasty]

1-6

[Starlight777]

Color 5 is what dreams are made of.

Color 3 still looks like Jin to me.

[STenSatsu]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhxNjEcoav4 v Nu

http://youtu.be/LYdwBnp64Nk v Nu

http://youtu.be/DcymtAzMtZc v Ragna

Speaking of SpinKing. I really like how you can see him learn the Nu matchup as the first vid comes along. Really good use of insta-j.2b as a mixup and to punish rolls in the corner. 5c looks to tag both Nu's 4d and spikes at neutral. And SJ fabhop (think it is 236b) seems to get you over 2d quite a bit, perfect for then divebombing with j.236c.

Only watched the first Nu vid so far, but I like what I'm seeing from him, just needs better combos/confirms. Though I think he's actually learning BB from scratch rather than just learning Amane.

EDIT: Now I'm wondering if you could corner tech trap with OTG 3c>delay Gekiren if they just mash back tech.

Edited December 11, 2012 by STenSatsu