[CP] Noel Vermillion - Gameplay Discussion

[Litherain-XIII]

I do it all the time actually _-_

[mMarikom]

It's not bad at all. Literally with dash normals just keep in mind you shouldn't be touching the dpad/stick when you're hitting the button for the normal

[blackhybrid]

5B>5C>236C>RC>66>5B

I can't seem to do much after the 5B part of that, tried j.C but it whiffs, maybe my reaction time needs to be faster. My execution overall hasn't been that good to begin with though, I think I need to be more relaxed and calm down a bit. Sometimes I get a bit excited when I see I have a moment to combo into something and screw everything up in the process.

[Adsfzxczxc]

You can dash pretty far before they tech, so you can get pretty close to them and that should make it a bit easier to combo.

You can do also do 236c>RC>66>5b>5c>SJC>j.c>j.d>stuff rather than just the 5b into j.c. I find that its actually a bit easier do. That might just be me though.

[LunaKage]

The main issue is your spacing when the combo starts. Max range 5B > 5C > 236C > RC > 665B is much harder than a close range hitconfirm, the other issue is that even if you hit it, you need to modify the combo on a lot of characters to make it work, since you will be pretty far after the 665B connects. usually you can do sj.A > j.C > j.D to rectify this problem. That method is also a good idea on characters like Makoto when doing the midscreen overhead confirm into OB.

[Alpha152]

Jin DP OS

[LunaKage]

That's kinda cool, but I think it would probably just be a better idea to use the standard drive oki setup, I'd assume doing the 6D(Whiff) > d.5A(Whiff) > d.6D route of the drive oki will produce similar DP beating results.

[Alpha152]

However with the regular set up both d.4D and d.6D are beat by more options. When using d.4D you're committed to baiting a dp and you lose pressure, and when using d.6D it is not meaty and gets beat by mash. Of course this OS also has flaws such as not dealing with delay/roll tech but specifically against neutral tech it covers more options.

[SixWingedAngel]

Jin DP OS

yes

yes

YES

[LunaKage]

I think roll teching is a much bigger threat, since an opponent can see the post-22B setup a mile away, with the drive oki, we have the advantage of unpredictability, with the Jump OS, once an opponent sees that a few times, they will just roll it for free on reaction.

[Alpha152]

That's a valid point but this also can be applied mid screen.

It worked better in EX since it forced blocking on down tech and punished roll tech but it doesn't quite work as well in this version lol

Oh and Luna when you said Drive oki beats roll tech, did you mean it forces blocking?

Edited November 7, 2013 by Alpha152

[LunaKage]

it resets forward roll, but it doesn't seem to punish back roll in corner. they still have to block it though. it also punishes no tech. and that's not even counting the mixup portion. the roll and no tech options get punished by the first 6D that's supposed to whiff, if you react to that reset, you get a 3.7k combo meterless back into the same setup.

[Alpha152]

Hmm, I'm can't seem to punish the forward tech with 6D. Could you explain it or upload a quick video please?

[LunaKage]

I can't make a video right now, I'm at work :c

I do want to make a big drive oki tutorial video sometime soon though.

[LunaKage]

unless you're trying it midscreen? I don't recommend using this setup midscreen, I prefer to just use the 2B method. If it doesn't catch rolls midscreen, then its all the more reason not to use it midscreen. did I say midscreen enough?

midscreen

[Alpha152]

Ok cool. So right now I'm only able to punish delayed forward tech, but not immediate forward tech.

[LunaKage]

you might still be too close, throw more shots in there, and make sure you do 6D asap.

[legacy49i]

Jin DP OS

Ok, so on the last one, you went right to Drive 6B....

Is this the same thing as when you buffer, say Spring Raid, by double tapping D just before you land to start Drive, but skip the first move and go straight to finisher? Or is there some way in CP around this? I'm pretty sure it's the first one, but since I didn't import, I just figured I'd ask anyway.

[LunaKage]

yeah it's the first one, it's the same thing she's had since CT.

[legacy49i]

I'm still pretty upset about the loss of Optic Barrel A, but is it very detrimental to her play as a whole? And what about floating on 4D now? Any good ways to properly confirm a 4D Fatal? Right now, I pretty much 4D auto-pilot to 6A to give myself that tiny second to get my bearings. Plus, I've never had anyone cut inbetween the 4D and 6A, so it seems pretty safe.

[Adsfzxczxc]

The best confirm off of a 4d is 4d>d.6c>d.2d>d.5c>d.5b>stuff or just 4d>d.2d>d.6b>d.5c>d.5b>stuff which does around 3.5k. Theres not really any special combos on a 4d fatal now, other than the fact that you can link spring raid into a 5a>5c for a side switching combo that IMO is slightly easier to do (and it looks freaking badass).

If you want to just autopilot the d.6a though, you can do 4d>d.6a.>d.5c>d.5b>236a>stuff though you have to essentially autopilot the d.5c after the d.6a.

You can also do 4d>d.6a>d.5b>d.6c>d.5b>236a>stuff and the d.5b has to be slightly delayed, so there's time to figure out if you want to do mixup or confirm the combo.

As for Optic Barrel A, I don't see too much of a difference, as the main use of it was for combos, and for the 5b>236a counterhit OS. I would say trading up optic barrel for chamber shot is beneficial as Noel finally has a proper combo ender for standing opponents, and if spaced properly, is safe on block.

[confusedxphreak]

I know people have made use of jump drive canceling into d.6B for mix-up, but has anyone made use of jump drive canceling into d.2D? Since it crosses up on crouchers and beats lows and throws, it should theorectically be useful.

[Alpha152]

Losing A Optic Barrel isn't detrimental I think. At most you're losing a good air confirm tool but even then it's still possible to air confirm well, it just takes faster reactions.

4D is much easier to confirm in this game. 4D > d.2D will always work regardless of ground/air and CH/non-CH with the exception of not working around max air height. I think 4D > d.5D might also work off air/ground and CH/non-CH, with the advantage being that it's gapless on block.

d.2D does not cross up on crouching, if it did it would not be practical off a jump in as they would not low block.

Edited November 8, 2013 by Alpha152

[Litherain-XIII]

actually on the subject of d.2D crossing up there is only 1 situation in which this had occurred in a crouching combo and it resets. Not positive about it being useful outside of RC after its follow up but see for yourself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gop9ILDhirw&list=UUyV9c57z3v5Ot5d4PklDxeA&feature=player_detailpage#t=677

[LunaKage]

d.2D crosses up after a j.D.