Elochai Posted February 22, 2015 Posted February 22, 2015 I haven't watched a lot of Liz 2.0 footage, but I'm hoping Dia can be used as a sort of last-ditch defensive option or something now. I haven't seen it used a single time so I don't know if it has any invul or anything like that, though. Who needs defense options when you have ~c o m b o s~? It's nice that it's there in theory but I'm not sure how I feel about spending 75+ meter on a small amount of health. So-Called-Chaos 1
MegaBlues Posted February 22, 2015 Posted February 22, 2015 Just to stick my head in, that seems to be an eighth of her HP (1000 in non-awakening, effectively 1600 in awakening). Combined with the Blue Health of Mind Charge, it could be very effective. But that's just in theory.
Elochai Posted February 23, 2015 Posted February 23, 2015 I gave it some thought and I feel inclined to agree with you at least somewhat. Considering that combos in this version seem to be comparatively meter conservative, we should probably have the resources to dump into Dia. Outside of awakening for example, Liz can use the autocombo change really well. Autocombo>5A>5B> 5C>2C works afaik so perhaps we could go about this by building meter quickly, using Mind Charge, and then using Dia to recover the blue health.
OmnixTSC Posted February 25, 2015 Posted February 25, 2015 The thing about Dia is that you're basically giving up your advantage and some meter in exchange for a minimal amount of health. That meter you spend on Dia could be used to apply an ailment or do more damage while keeping your advantage. Especially with the nature of 2.0, that extra bit of health isn't going to save you very often from a full Shadow Berserk combo. You also have to consider the fact that Dia puts your opponent back at neutral. Depending on the matchup, that could be a good or really bad thing. Sure, Liz's neutral was buffed in 2.0, but there are still characters that win the neutral game against her. You probably don't want to use Dia in those cases unless the timer is a factor.
TastyPancakez Posted February 27, 2015 Posted February 27, 2015 Soooooo I'm not sure if this is worth mentioning but this Liz at one point hit 800 PSR: http://sp.p4u2.tv/member_profile_view.php?user_id=1934 I know PSR is kind of significant in Japan...right now it looks like he has 798 but maybe we can look out for this player... Any ideas? Is this even a big deal :L
LightlordIV Posted March 1, 2015 Posted March 1, 2015 Soooooo I'm not sure if this is worth mentioning but this Liz at one point hit 800 PSR: http://sp.p4u2.tv/member_profile_view.php?user_id=1934 I know PSR is kind of significant in Japan...right now it looks like he has 798 but maybe we can look out for this player... Any ideas? Is this even a big deal :L Well, I think it might be a big deal. We should take a look on how this player uses Elizabeth. Oh, and I found something quite interesting. I don't know if this is old news, but I found a very... Peculiar combo route in 1.1 5AAA, 236D(8), 2A, 5B, 5C, 2C, 214D/214AB/236A or AB. Sad thing is that it only works on Yosuke, Naoto and Akihiko. No fatal counter, non-awakening, does about 2.2k if you use 236D and grants fear + 1HSM flag. I wish it wasn't limited to those three characters. Even if this wasn't mentioned before, maybe it's kinda late to point this, since 2.0 offers us a better combo route in 5AAA, 214A, 5AA, 5B, 5C, 2C.
TastyPancakez Posted March 1, 2015 Posted March 1, 2015 i think you can use that route above on most characters in 2.0 which is probably better than using 214a. not sure if it's character specific edit: nvm rewatched the combo vid and it does less damage also that liz i mentioned earlier is beginning to climb the ranks a bit. he has 804 psr with a 61% win/loss ratio (although it's only ~1000/600). anyone know who it is? google translate is giving me a weird name 鳥・ゼルファー
Elochai Posted March 1, 2015 Posted March 1, 2015 Due to the meter gain change on autocombos, it really depends on what you want imo. If you want damage then go for 5AAA>Garu>etc, and if you want meter you can just do 5AAAA>5A>etc. You're getting the same 214D oki regardless. I wouldn't say one is better than the other since they each have a different use. I guess if you have 25+ SP though you should do whichever does more dmg . I'm also interested in who that 800 PSR player is. Perhaps I can ask around Twitter and see if anyone knows.
LightlordIV Posted March 1, 2015 Posted March 1, 2015 So in the end it is just a matter of meter vs damage, hmm. I wonder when 2.0 is coming for us, though. That player has really picked my interest, though. It makes me happy to see more and more people starting to play Liz again.
TastyPancakez Posted March 1, 2015 Posted March 1, 2015 http://sp.p4u2.tv/ranking_view.php?mode=exe&type=psr_rank&character=el&pref=0 the rankings for liz btw. that mysterious liz is #2 on the leaderboards -- he's slowly catching up to damosu
LightlordIV Posted March 1, 2015 Posted March 1, 2015 I thought Damosu had dropped Liz for Adachi but taking that data into account, now I really want to see some footage of this Mystery Liz X.
Murray Posted March 2, 2015 Posted March 2, 2015 So... I've been "away" for a bit, so I might have missed this, but how does the new auto combo meter/burst gain work with Liz? Unless they changed the auto combo we're spending 25 SP (SB Bufu) to get 10, which doesn't make sense.
TastyPancakez Posted March 2, 2015 Posted March 2, 2015 ^ In 2.0 there's a new meterless route that lets Liz combo after A Bufu 5AAA > 214A > 5AA > 5B > 5C > 2C > 214D oki or something like that
Elochai Posted March 3, 2015 Posted March 3, 2015 So... I've been "away" for a bit, so I might have missed this, but how does the new auto combo meter/burst gain work with Liz? Unless they changed the auto combo we're spending 25 SP (SB Bufu) to get 10, which doesn't make sense. Doesn't autocombo w less than 25% give you A Bufu & not SP? You can use 5AAAA then.
Murray Posted March 3, 2015 Posted March 3, 2015 It does (I knew that), though I guess my point was that at 25+ SP you're now forced to spend SP for the bonus SP (and burst regen) Granted Liz has (much) better options than auto combo at 25+ SP, it just seems a bit contradictory in design/concept...
firedraco Posted March 3, 2015 Posted March 3, 2015 You can hold 4 during the autocombo you will always get the meterless version IIRC. Also, anyone have a list of enders that you can get safejumps off of for Liz? I know you can do it off D Agi enders, and I've heard you can do it off some j.C enders but I could never figure out how.
Elochai Posted March 3, 2015 Posted March 3, 2015 You might wanna check this doc out. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Zy2a3zpJ--o6o-jkAJNGNfILZjKKDjiUEZ56gSKYsWo/edit?usp=sharing
OmnixTSC Posted March 3, 2015 Posted March 3, 2015 It does (I knew that), though I guess my point was that at 25+ SP you're now forced to spend SP for the bonus SP (and burst regen) Granted Liz has (much) better options than auto combo at 25+ SP, it just seems a bit contradictory in design/concept... It's probably a design oversight. It happens sometimes, but Liz should rarely be sitting at that range of SP anyways with good meter management anyways.
OmnixTSC Posted March 4, 2015 Posted March 4, 2015 So, I found some new combos for 1.1...which is funny this late in the game. I'll see if we can figure something out with editing the opening post in the combo thread.
TastyPancakez Posted March 12, 2015 Posted March 12, 2015 For safejump enders (j.2B > j.B > j.C stuff) can I use j.B or is it just preference between j.A/j.B? Also, how useful is j.C in the corner? I have some decent non-awk combos for it but idk how often i'll be able to confirm off of it
OmnixTSC Posted March 12, 2015 Posted March 12, 2015 For safejump enders (j.2B > j.B > j.C stuff) can I use j.B or is it just preference between j.A/j.B? You should be doing j.B > j.2B > j.C to make sure they're close enough for the mixup afterwards. j.A meaty safejumps most DPs, j.B will safejump Yosuke/Kanji/Margaret DP if spaced properly, and you have to just hard bait Rise's DP. Also, how useful is j.C in the corner? I have some decent non-awk combos for it but idk how often i'll be able to confirm off of it It's okay. Using it depends on spacing and how your opponent generally responds on defense. You don't want to just throw it out a lot, as your options after it aren't great.
LightlordIV Posted March 13, 2015 Posted March 13, 2015 Does anyone know when 2.0 hits the console versions?
OmnixTSC Posted March 20, 2015 Posted March 20, 2015 Does anyone know when 2.0 hits the console versions? There's no estimated release date. We just have to wait, sadly. Btw, I might start uploading some 1.1 Liz stuff for you guys to have more to work with. I added some more oki routes to things.
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