LuminAbyss Posted January 10, 2013 Posted January 10, 2013 dead spike > dc is either plus or zero on block, i've seen a purple throw done before I'd say plus, if it was zero, I'm pretty sure the throw would have been green. that's some good news at least, then.
Spirit Juice Posted January 10, 2013 Posted January 10, 2013 Kaqn's been everyone inspiration since CT... that's not easy to change. But indeed, there are more solid players. I wonder if this happens in Hazama/Jin forums, but with Buppa. Except Buppa was actually a very strong GG player though. I don't follow Hazama players so I'm not sure how he stacks up to the best, however. dead spike > dc is either plus or zero on block, i've seen a purple throw done before At what ranges/conditions though? Looks like it's safe if you do it max range. Not sure about point blank DS or point blank DS with dash cancel after it.
Ctrlaltwtf Posted January 10, 2013 Posted January 10, 2013 Is DS recovery faster than DS->DC recovery? At close ranges obviously you wouldn't "have" to DC in order to continue pressure.
Tong Posted January 10, 2013 Posted January 10, 2013 Is DS recovery faster than DS->DC recovery? At close ranges obviously you wouldn't "have" to DC in order to continue pressure. You do, otherwise it's mad negative.
KayEff Posted January 10, 2013 Author Posted January 10, 2013 At what ranges/conditions though? Looks like it's safe if you do it max range. Not sure about point blank DS or point blank DS with dash cancel after it. this was a purple throw done after a dash cancel, which means there's no need to provide conditions in terms of distance. moreover, if there's any delay in any of the steps, it only makes dead spike > dc that much more plus. dead spike standalone i have no idea.
skd Posted January 10, 2013 Posted January 10, 2013 this was a purple throw done after a dash cancel, which means there's no need to provide conditions in terms of distance. moreover, if there's any delay in any of the steps, it only makes dead spike > dc that much more plus. dead spike standalone i have no idea. I think he means if dead spike hit later on the active frames as the dash cancel being doable on whiff probably means that the cancel point is earlier than the move actually connects, so dc > purple grab COULD be affected by what point of the move the dead spike connected at. this is under the assumption that dead spike dc purple grab is doable from beyond the first active frame of dead spikes hitbox though (if it isn't then this is pretty moot, I don't know how far the dc brings ragna). dead spike is dc on whiff right, I'm not crazy? I don't know what is real anymore Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
KayEff Posted January 10, 2013 Author Posted January 10, 2013 i'm pretty sure DS hit on its first active frame, though i wish i had saved the match so that i can refer to it again (although it probably got deleted with jourdal's channel, RIPRIPRIP). and yeah DS is dc-able on whiff
LuminAbyss Posted January 10, 2013 Posted January 10, 2013 I think that DC property on whiff could potentially lead to some fun oki stuff in the corner.
BlackYakuzu94 Posted January 10, 2013 Posted January 10, 2013 Sounds like some mixup potential as well probably.
LuminAbyss Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) I was also thinking of aerial bloodscythe as a potential replacement to D Inferno Divider > Axe kick as a combo ender. Think about it, it seems to me like Ragna recovers faster from BS than from ID ender, and the opponent would end up teching in similar ways. Of course, because of repeat proration, this would mean giving up BS mid-combo in order to use it at the end, but it might be a worthy trade off? It really all depends on what the recovery on it is like in comparison to ID. Thoughts? Edited January 11, 2013 by LuminAbyss
Final Ultima Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 Maybe in some circumstances, but for the most part, probably not. Even if the untechable time gives you better oki, it's considerably slower, so it's not going to be as versatile. I wouldn't want to shorten combos for it, at any rate.
BlackYakuzu94 Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 Doesn't BS recover a lot more health than D Inferno Divider anyway?
LuminAbyss Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 It might not be a whole lot of damage we miss either, depending on the combo.
Tong Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 From what I've seen, it sometimes sends the opponent behind you. So it might be actually good if you're combo'ing off the corner.
Fluck Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 I was also thinking of aerial bloodscythe as a potential replacement to D Inferno Divider > Axe kick as a combo ender. Think about it, it seems to me like Ragna recovers faster from BS than from ID ender, and the opponent would end up teching in similar ways. Of course, because of repeat proration, this would mean giving up BS mid-combo in order to use it at the end, but it might be a worthy trade off? It really all depends on what the recovery on it is like in comparison to ID. Thoughts? What are you going to put before the aerial BS? 3C? That's unlikely to work. 6A -> tk BS might work even at the end of combos but then you need to find a way to combo into 6A at the end of combos too. D Divider works no matter what.
WolfCrimson Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 What are you going to put before the aerial BS? 3C? That's unlikely to work. 6A -> tk BS might work even at the end of combos but then you need to find a way to combo into 6A at the end of combos too. D Divider works no matter what. I think Lumin meant aerial BS after an aerial combo, not necessarily a tk BS.
Fluck Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 Couple of problems I can think of regarding j.D -> BS. The first is how resilient the j.D -> BS cancel is compared to D Divider. Cause of how slow BS is, I can't imagine it always working under the new combo system, especially if you started with an A move. The second is, as Tong mentioned, that BS might crossup and send them behind you, which is an obvious problem if you're nearing the corner. If we discover a spacing that always crosses up, then I agree that it's a great option for side-swap combos, but if it's too difficult to control, then I'd consider it more of a weakness than a strength. Of course there are other problems like the fact that you can't have already used BS in the combo. I think it could have its uses, but I don't see it replacing D Divider as a combo ender until we learn more about it.
Tong Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 ID untechable looking good: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=GR-23B4W5Co#t=820s Useful?
-Kid Posted January 11, 2013 Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) ID untechable looking good: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=GR-23B4W5Co#t=820s Useful? Probably going to have to still spend 50 heat to follow-up from that. Also that unteachable time may only be apparent when you hit with the tip of ID. Still pretty handy though, since it means that your opponent will now tech on the ground instead of teching in the air. Also it seems that Ragna recovers faster than the opponent neutral techs. So.. Edited January 11, 2013 by -Kid
Spirit Juice Posted January 14, 2013 Posted January 14, 2013 I think after matching more Azrael videos, I'm going to have to say bye to Ragna.
MashThat5A Posted January 15, 2013 Posted January 15, 2013 I think after matching more Azrael videos, I'm going to have to say bye to Ragna. You won't be missed because I'll be joining you
VR-Raiden Posted January 15, 2013 Posted January 15, 2013 I dunno...kicking people really hard repeatedly does look fun... I was sorta considering maining him too, but I doubt I will now. Unless I find him THAT much more fun. I'll at least sub him.
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