[CP] Ragna Gameplay Discussion

[KayEff]

He asked what 22C was, and it's obviously an anti-air grab

obviously an anti-air grab

obviously

an anti-air grab

first thing i'll do when i get cp is catch an airborne opponent with 22C.

and then infract you for not actually catching anyone.

(okay i won't infract you but seriously that was one dumb comment)

[Tong]

But that's exactly what happened in the video, I know it's not easy to notice.

22C can only catch airborne opponents.

[Final Ultima]

22C can only catch airborne opponents.

Watch your choice of words. Last time I checked, 6B air hit > delay 22C, CH 3C/2D > delay 22C and hell, even a stubborn refusal to ground tech > 22C does not constitute high level thaumaturgy. Edited May 29, 2013 by Final Ultima

[Tong]

Of course it also works on downed opponents, but downed also counts as airborne theorically (since a hit during that state will count as such).

I used the meaning broadly because it is obvious enough that 22C is mostly used on downed opponents.

[Final Ultima]

Hitting a downed opponent may treat them as if they're airborne, but downed and airborne are two clearly different conditions. Therefore, do not use the word "only". If someone new to BlazBlue were to read your posts and come to the conclusion that 22C doesn't work on downed opponents because it "only works on airborne opponents", or even worse... that 22C's function is "obviously an anti-air grab", then that is spreading misinformation.

[mAc Chaos]

> anti air grab

Did Ragna get a new 22C or something.

[Tong]

Hitting a downed opponent may treat them as if they're airborne, but downed and airborne are two clearly different conditions. Therefore, do not use the word "only". If someone new to BlazBlue were to read your posts and come to the conclusion that 22C doesn't work on downed opponents because it "only works on airborne opponents", or even worse... that 22C's function is "obviously an anti-air grab", then that is spreading misinformation.

Indeed, two different conditions but can be treated as the same if we're talking specifically about that case. The poster even asked about that.

Of course its primary fuction is as command grab to catch grounded opponents, but at the end of the day, you would need to treat 22C as an AA to explain that gimmick. There's no other way around.

[floatwater]

So an impractical gimmick. it doesn't seem useful imo

[-Kid]

> anti air grab

Did Ragna get a new 22C or something.

22C?

obviously j.B+C lol

[Kuraudo_V6]

Why am I imagining Ragna going "Fuck this." and just grabbing someone in the air by the head, slamming them down and punching them in the gut proper?

... Atomic Collider without the Atomic part and more derp. lol

[heavymetalmixer]

It's kinda wieird to know that 22C is a command grab, given that it never becomes "pink" (unlike others like Tager's "Driver"), so is it reallly a command grab?, or an strike grab like Bullet's?

[Lucalibur]

Its an unblockable strike grab, I would think.

[Amadeus46Art]

Pretty sure it's just "proximity unblockable" instead of any sort of grab or strike. Has a low hitbox to get people who are that low to the ground.

Tong if you really can't see the difference between "can only hit people who are in a technically "airborne" state but has a super-low hitbox" and "anti-air" please listen to other people instead of arguing with them.

Edited May 30, 2013 by Amadeous

[MashThat5A]

No one ever listens

[Tong]

Tong if you really can't see the difference between "can only hit people who are in a technically "airborne" state but has a super-low hitbox" and "anti-air" please listen to other people instead of arguing with them.

I'm just trying to say that it could behave as such under specific conditions, everyone will agree with that.

But just because we're not on the same page here, they disregard my thoughts on the matter as false and misleading.

[Amadeus46Art]

Okay look, I think you're confused about what anti-air means. Anti-air means that it'll beat out attacks or opponents approaching from the air. Usually these moves have head invulnerability. Stuff like Inferno Divider, Atomic Collider, these are anti-airs.

Now you tell me, when I IAD at you and use a strong jump-in or crossup like Hazama jB, is your reaction to 6A or 22C? Hint: whichever one you use is your anti-air.

You're right that 22C can only hit "airborne" opponents, but it's not an "anti-air", so don't call it one. Say it can only hit opponents that are in a knocked down state or still in the air but low to the ground.

[Tong]

Not every anti air must have head invul to function as one. There are many cases in the game, Jin's 2A can be used to low profile some air attacks, many 5B/5C have good speed/hitboxes to work as great air unblockables, 5A's, specially Hazama's, are often good when it comes to countering IAD and cross-up attacks.

They all may be specific, but so 22C is.

And since 22C requires special conditions for activation, its use is very limited outside combos and gimmicky situations (like the one shown in the video).

[Amadeus46Art]

How do you manage to completely miss the point every time you post? Sit down, think about what those moves you listed as anti-airs actually DO, and then try to use 22C in those same situations, and realize that 22C is NOT AN ANTI-AIR.

Giving you an infraction for continually posting without thinking. Next time actually think about what you're saying before you say it.

[TheBossGiga]

I'm just trying to say that it could behave as such under specific conditions, everyone will agree with that.

But just because we're not on the same page here, they disregard my thoughts on the matter as false and misleading.

I first thought you were trolling, but..

=(...

[Yggjrasil]

I will make it my life mission to make 22C into an anti-air. Just you watch! Please guide me Kaqn-sama, on my impossible quest!

[Skye]

Not every anti air must have head invul to function as one. There are many cases in the game, Jin's 2A can be used to low profile some air attacks, many 5B/5C have good speed/hitboxes to work as great air unblockables, 5A's, specially Hazama's, are often good when it comes to countering IAD and cross-up attacks.

They all may be specific, but so 22C is.

And since 22C requires special conditions for activation, its use is very limited outside combos and gimmicky situations (like the one shown in the video).

Bro pls, just because a move hits someone in the air does not make it an anti-air. The main property of using any move as an AA is to hit your opponent out of the air in neutral or from a defensive position.

*for what it's worth I'm counting resets as neutral in this case just for the sake of simplicity*

Hitting them while they are in hitstun means your are not using x move as an AA, even if it could effectively function as one.

The difference here is that 22c is meant to function ONLY during hitstun, it is not meant to be used as an anti air, even in some contrived or severely situational circumstance (combo movie resets) it can be used as one.

A move's subjective properties go by the rule, not the exception.

[wilde_jagd88]

dear God, what have i started? Tong, i appreciate the attempt, but mashthat5a answered the question rather unequivocally. I like Amadeous' answer best, regarding 22c in the aforementioned situation as a "proximity unblockable". I asked, not because i was unsure how 22c functions normally, but how it functions as presented in the video. i have NEVER seen anyone procure a 22c starter.

[MashThat5A]

dear God, what have i started? Tong, i appreciate the attempt, but mashthat5a answered the question rather unequivocally. I like Amadeous' answer best, regarding 22c in the aforementioned situation as a "proximity unblockable". I asked, not because i was unsure how 22c functions normally, but how it functions as presented in the video. i have NEVER seen anyone procure a 22c starter.

Welcome to asking a question in the Ragna forums.

Mod me pls

[mAc Chaos]

Not every anti air must have head invul to function as one. There are many cases in the game, Jin's 2A can be used to low profile some air attacks, many 5B/5C have good speed/hitboxes to work as great air unblockables, 5A's, specially Hazama's, are often good when it comes to countering IAD and cross-up attacks.

They all may be specific, but so 22C is.

And since 22C requires special conditions for activation, its use is very limited outside combos and gimmicky situations (like the one shown in the video).

22C is like Gadget Finger. Is Gadget Finger an anti air.

[Amadeus46Art]

Welcome to asking a question in the Ragna forums.

Mod me pls

go back to your tao boards

oh fuck right I don't even play this game