[Xrd] Tier Discussion

[HeWhoRocksAlot]

Let's talk tiers and compare some of the past notable GGXrd tier list from this year:

Guilty Gear Xrd -SIGN-
-Ver. 1.01-

Arcadia's GGXrd tier list
S Zato-1, Faust
A Ky, Sol, Chipp, Millia, May
B All other characters
C Potemkin

Nemo's GGXrd tier list
Everyone can see that they're strong: Zato, Faust
Still pretty strong: Sol, Ky, Millia, May
Average: Axl, Chipp, I-No, Bedman
What a shame: Slayer, Venom
Goodbye: Potemkin

-Ver. 1.02-

Ogawa's GGXrd tier list
S Zato, Chipp, Faust
A Ky, Sol, Millia, May, Ramlethal(projected)
B Everyone else

Machaboo’s GGXrd tier list
S Zato, Sol, Faust, Millia
A Chipp, Ky, May, Axl
B I-No, Slayer, Bedman, Ramlethal
C Venom
D Potemkin

-Ver. 1.03-

JT’s GGXrd tier list
S Sol, Faust, Zato
A Ramlethal, Chipp, Ky
B I-No, Axl, Slayer, Millia, May, Venom
C Bedman, Potemkin

FAB’s GGXrd tier list
S Zato, Faust, Sol
A Millia, Ramlethal, Chipp
B Ky, May, Axl, I-No
C Venom, Slayer, Bedman
D Potemkin

-Ver. 1.04-

Kiisha’s GGXrd tier list
S Sol, Zato, Faust, Ramlethal
S- Chipp, Millia
A Ky, May, Axl, Slayer
B Bedman, I-No, Venom
C Potemkin

Woshige's GGXrd tier list (*Note: He mention that he has not had much experience against Zato-1 and Axl Low )
S Faust, Millia, Chipp Zanuff, Ramlethal, Zato-One
A Sol, Ky
B I-No, Slayer, Venom, Potemkin, Bedman, May
C Axl-Low

Ogawa's GGXrd tier list
S Millia, Zato, Faust, Ramlethal
A I-No, Sol=Ky, Chipp=Venom
B Everyone else

Efute's GGXrd tier list
S Faust, Millia, Ram,
A Chipp, Sol, Zato, Ky
B Bedman, Ino, May, Venom, Slayer, Axl, Pot

-Console Ver. 1.04-

Ogawa's GGXrd tier list
S Zato > Millia
A+ Ramlethal > Elphelt > Faust
A I-no=Venom=Sol=Ky
B+ Rest

Sharon's GGXrd tier list
S Milia, Zato, Ramlethal, Faust, Elphelt
A Sol, I-No, Venom, Sin, Ky, Chipp
B Other (May and Bedman)
C Slayer, Axl, Potemkin
? Leo

Woshige's GGXrd tier list
S Zato, Millia, Faust, Ramlethal, Elphelt
A Sol, Ky, Chipp, I-No
B May, Venom, Bedman, Sin, Axl, Leo, Potemkin, Slayer

-Ver. 1.10 / Console Ver. 1.05-

Ogawa's GGXrd tier list
S Sol, Milia, Zato, Axl, Faust, Sin, Elphelt
A Ky, May, Chipp, I-No, Bedman, Leo
B Venom, Slayer, Ramlethal
C Potemkin

Sharon's GGXrd tier list
S Sol, Millia, Zato, Axl, Faust, Sin, Elphelt, I-No
A Ky, May, Chipp, Slayer, Bedman, Leo, Venom
B Ramlethal
C Potemkin

FAB's GGXrd tier list
S+ Zato, Millia
S Elphelt, Faust, Axl
A Sol, Ky, Chipp, Sin
B I-No, May, Venom, Leo, Bedman, Slayer, Ramlethal
C Potemkin

Koichi's GGXrd tier list
S Zato-1, Faust, Sol
A+ Milia
A Ky, Elphelt, Bedman, Sin
B Chipp, Leo, Axl, Venom
C+ I-No, Slayer, Potemkin
C May, Ramlethal

Dogura's GGXrd tier list
S Elphelt, Zato-1, Bedman
A+ Chipp, Sin, Milia
A Ky, Sol, Slayer, I-No, Faust
B May, Axl, Venom
C Ramlethal, Leo
D Potemkin

Nage's GGXrd tier list
Hard to use but the strongest character: Millia, Zato-1
Considerably strong: Elphelt, Faust, Sol
Sufficiently strong: Ky, May, Axl, Chipp, Sin, Bedman, I-No, Venom
Characters that have destructive power off of one attack: Leo, Ramlethal, Slayer, Potemkin

Guilty Gear Xrd -REVELATOR-
-Ver. 1.02-

FAB's GGXrdR tier list
S+ Zato-1, Millia
S Elphelt, Faust, Axl, Sol
A Ky, Chipp, Sin, Johnny
B Jack-O, Leo, I-No, May, Bedman
C Venom, Slayer, Ramlethal
D Potemkin

-Ver. 1.03-

eSportsRunner's GGXrdR Tier List
S Johnny

A Sol, Ky, Millia, Zato, Chipp, Bedman, Sin, Elphelt, Jack-O

B May, Potemkin, Faust, Axl, Venom, Slayer, I-No, Ramlethal, Leo

C Jam

 

As a general disclaimer:
Tiers are not the end all of skill.
The person playing the character and their ability with that character generally plays a greater role than tiers alone.

Tiers list are worth examining so we can better learn what makes strong characters strong and safe characters safe. All pro players already know that player skill is far more important than character strength.
Since differences do exist, tier list are made to understand them.

The game is still young, so the Xrd tier is constantly changing and will most likely change over all.

None of that "tiers list are B.S." stuff in here.

[D.R.F.]

Well shit beat me to it lol. Also just as a basis to my standing on the relative strengths of the characters woshige's list is probably where I stand on the subject. (And even then Its kinda meh because of his lack of exp. On Zato and Axl)

[king of heart]

This thread should wait until December.

Even thou I don't want to be rude but I will keep hearing many immature opinions due the very low level compared to japan.

[BladeOfJustice7]

^With that said,

 

I still think Sol is slightly better than Ky. Everything else in the tier lists makes sense to me.

[Anne]

This thread should wait until December.

Even thou I don't want to be rude but I will keep hearing many immature opinions due the very low level compared to japan.

The opinions already exist in the general thread anyways, you can never, ever escape opinions no matter where you go. If opinions get wild and people say silly shit, you can correct them.

[Henaki]

One other thing to consider: Tier lists measure character power differences at the highest level of skill.

 

This means that at lower levels of play, skill barriers and caps are extremely important toward power. For example, Potemkin and Ky are relatively straightforward, easy to grasp characters with few situations in which they require lots of nuance. Someone like Zato not only has to know how to do what he wants to do (difficult inputs), he also has to make more complex decisions because he has more variables to consider at any one given time. This means that characters like Potemkin and Ky will be much better at lower levels of play as a lesser skilled player can do a higher % of things FAB or Ain could do, as opposed to the same level of player picking up Zato, they would be able to do a smaller % of things Ogawa can do.

 

This is commonly why bad players complain about stuff like fireballs and grapplers. qualities of characters that possess lower skill caps. So if you play a bunch of Pots online and get wrecked or whatever, the Potemkin players could be as good as you, perhaps even worse players, and still win because of this.

 

Anyway my general impressions of the game are: any character can win, really. You might not want to pick the bottom tier, but we live in AMERICA land of the FREE so I'll probably end up getting top 4 a lot by playing like a fucking moron like I did with Tager back in the day. So don't worry too much about your character's power unless you plan on winning evo or something I guess.

[Shrapnel]

Poor Potemkin constantly crawling in the bottom rank. On the other hand sort of happy to see not only Venom will be playable but also assumed to be quite strong.

[D.R.F.]

I wouldn't say constantly. As much as it irks me to watch him struggle he is still a very competent character and more players are starting to get the hang of him, not just FAB and Consome. It is a big uphill battle for him though... I personally think Axl is worse.

[Yukikaze]

No matchup chart?

[DeadlyCreampuff]

No matchup chart?

I really hope the console version has a matchup chart like the arcade does, just compiling every match ever(though probably ignoring offline matches :3.

 

I'd also be interested if it would compile a matchup chart of all the matches of top 10 players of every character but that might be a bit too much too ask.

[Mumm-Ra]

It'd be awesome if they gave us an option like that, with filters to search the matchup charts of high risk players or something online.

[MasterXDrake]

Poor Potemkin..

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

Why do people feel sorry for Potemkin? Grapplers are mad annoying when they're good.

[Sanger Zonvolt]

Why do people feel sorry for Potemkin? Grapplers are mad annoying when they're good.

You're saying grappler players don't deserve a good character? When like 90% of them are bad.

[D.R.F.]

Pots always been a decent grappler. Just not now, where he works super hard now

[XXXDC]

I wouldn't say constantly. As much as it irks me to watch him struggle he is still a very competent character and more players are starting to get the hang of him, not just FAB and Consome. It is a big uphill battle for him though... I personally think Axl is worse.

 

Potemkin is looking way better now than before, but honestly, most of the time when you see a non FAB/Konsome Pot fighting against a good player, you know they will lose... i also think Axl, Slayer and May are weak.

 

But off course in the end my judgement is based solely on the few videos i've seen, there might be a lot more going on behind the scenes in jap arcades.

[D.R.F.]

Slayers do real well when they make the most out of his movement options. That is why I wouldn't call him weak. There are also a multitude of Mays that do fine competitively. That brings me back to why I believe Pot and Axl are not as strong (not necesarilly weak, just weaker) there are not as many successful Pots and definitely not as many successful Axls (but hey we arent over there, so we will never truely know untill Dec.)

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

Dunno where you would get the impression that May is weak.

[XXXDC]

Dunno where you would get the impression that May is weak.

And i also dunno where you would get the impression that May is strong.

[Orrax]

Claiming that May isn't weak does not automatically imply that she's strong. She can be somewhere in between as well (which is where I think she is).

Edited November 17, 2014 by Orrax

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

It's as if a character has to be S tier to not be considered weak. May is B at worst, IMO, and she gets put into A tier pretty frequently. She's definitely better than Axl, at least.

[XXXDC]

And that's not were i think she is.

Her only saving grace in Xrd is ensenga for guaranteed knockdown + slightly decent oki and set-ups thanks to beach ball and new applause mechanics. But in exchange she apparently lost her HIGH damage output + dizzy potential, and those were her bigger threats post #R. Basically feels like we're back to X days or #reload days but with less damage. Oh and i also fail to see multitude of Mays doing fine competitively.

[TITANIUM BEAST!!!]

Shrug we don't see most of the tournament footage in Japan. Just because we don't have video proof from the two or three arcades that stream to twitch and Youtube doesn't mean that the character isn't doing well competitively.

 

If anything, the lack of May footage is a general issue. There's just not enough available info to say the character is weak or strong from our perspective because you just don't get much May footage to work with. The footage that I have seen makes her look pretty decent, IMO. Her damage is still pretty good and her offensive options seem better/more varied. She may not be top tier, but she seems fine to me. Shouldn't be so quick to say a character is "weak", there's a difference between a character being weak and a strong character being among other strong characters.

[D.R.F.]

Kedako, Ruu, Efute, Asezuke(hope I didn't butcher his name), Kazuki, just to name a few. She definitely is not Ramlethal or Zato, but she is competent in her right and I see good Mays get rewarded. Damage in general has changed and you are right, she doesn't smack people across the screen stun-wise like before. In exchange for that, she has gotten more utility, and (IMHO) that helps her in the long run more.

Besides it seems everyone in this game (and GG in general) has pretty decent damage, notable exceptions in Xrd being Venom (never did a lot), Bedman (damage is on the lower side), and Millia (thank god btw).

[Stellarcircle5]

May just seems solid overall. Nothing about her seems absurd, but when you consider that most lists place her next to stronger characters like Chipp (I swear he would be S if more people used him, character is nuts) and Ky, I don't see where anyone could get the impression that she's weak. You could be doing a whole lot worse than her.