SolxBaiken Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 Alright our next match up thread, I'm looking for any tips and strategies against Noel, not only do I plan on subbing her but she also comes up frequently with new and seasoned players. Let me start by asking for good counter measures to her Drive [Chain Revolver] vs
kid viper Posted May 4, 2009 Posted May 4, 2009 use A or C DP anytime a noel tries more than 1 chain revolver move on you. Be careful with jumping in because noel's 6C is fast enough to counter hit you while her 6A has the invincibility to stuff you out which in both cases will lead to a C-loop combo.
TheSlyMoogle Posted May 6, 2009 Posted May 6, 2009 First learn exactly what each of her drive moves does. It seems like everytime I play our noel player there is a new drive move I didn't know about. Like Kid Viper said you can do the dps to punish her when she does more than one drive, but if you can react and see them coming you can IB and get a punish with a normal like 2a or 5b, which is risky compared to the Dps but you can get some nice combos for punishing those shitty drives. It just takes a lot of play and knowing what each drive move does. Most of them have some sort of invincibility for a while. Once you get into a position of pressure keep it on against her because she has few ways to punish you for pressuring her. Another interesting fact about noel: Her crouching hit box is stupid small, so if you happen to catch noel from an IAD combo, make sure to not throw 5b when you land and skip straight to 5c. 5b will pretty much whiff every time. Also when Noel pressures 3c as long as you instant block it you get a free crouching punish as well. MMM tasty damage.
SolxBaiken Posted May 8, 2009 Author Posted May 8, 2009 Sorry for the late reply but thanks for the awesome tips guys! At the moment her Drive is the only thing bothering me but there are sure to be more questions soon! Esspecially in late June :P
ajinkris Posted May 8, 2009 Posted May 8, 2009 Um, if she does drive on you while you're blocking, can't you just wait the drive out then punish her reload recovery?
kid viper Posted May 8, 2009 Posted May 8, 2009 the drive itself has a hi low mixup with 2 overheads and 1 sweep. with a dp that is guaranteed to punish if noel does more than 1 move in chain revolver state, why bother trying to wait it out and risk getting hit
ajinkris Posted May 8, 2009 Posted May 8, 2009 For sure if you're comfortable with your DP timing between Chain Revolver attacks, go for it. I was directing the question more at people who don't know what Noel's drive moves are capable of - just block and wait for her to finish her drive attacks (can only go up to 5) and punish her reload animation. For those who don't know, her Chain Revolver overheads are 6B (axe kick) and 2D (arcs in the air, guns flaming). Anyways, other questions: which pokes are prized in this matchup?
shtkn Posted May 8, 2009 Posted May 8, 2009 you can't always wait for the end of the D spam though... most of her Drive stuff is special cancelable (so she can go into that crappy projectile or that hop grab). I think IB srk is the best option in general. As always, wolf head beats stuff at max range. She's got good moves vs you in teh air though... her j.B generally beats you if she's below you, and her j.C generally beats you if you're below her
kid viper Posted May 9, 2009 Posted May 9, 2009 noel's 5a > most shit. seriously though, noel's 5a is dumb good. 5f startup with +3 on recovery and hits crouching opponents? dumb =_= noel's 6c is also something to watch out for. if you're planning on jumping in, you'll more than likely get stuffed out by this because of the 5f startup or 6a cause of the invincibility frames
InfiniteAmmo Posted July 13, 2009 Posted July 13, 2009 With Jin 5C, then 6C, then 623B punish all her ground spamming Ds. As good as she is, she only has limited range...in my opinion.
Killey Posted July 13, 2009 Posted July 13, 2009 What's the match up statistics? Is it 6-4 Jin's favor? Here's all the info I can dig up in regards to Noel's game and some stuff that gets you punished when facing Noel. As mentioned her 6A and 6C are incredibly fast and can stuff your j.B's on reaction which will lead into 6C loop to BnB's for big damage. I got punished a lot because I got predictable with my j.B's and ate a 6A/6C BnB. j.B in general seems really unsafe to do in this match up even for zoning/lock down purposes as she's got 2 anti-airs (6A and 6C) into BnB's and 2 air-to-air moves (j.C and J.B) that will beat it into a simple combo. Her 5A is incredbily fast (5f as mentioned) and is very safe for her to do. It will beat out everything Jin has up close as I think the fatest move has a 7f startup. 5A can be hit confirmed into 6A into her BnB so not something you want to get nailed with. Noel's distance game is incredibly weak and she has no way of zoning you from a far. She doesn't have many good pokes and her Optic Barrel special is pretty easy to avoid but be warned that it can be hit confirmed into her BnB. Jin should have the advantage in the poking game but it really doesn't feel that way to me when Noel can properly distance herself and find ways to counter the pokes altogether. 5D is a good poke if she is air dashing at you but otherwise it feels unsafe in the match as her 3C will go under it (if timed at the same time or earlier then when you do 5D) and nail you for a CH into BnB. She can air dash higher than your 5D and nail you for a CH j.B/j.C into a BnB. The stupid bitch is fast and has a lot of hi/low mix up games that makes blocking her offense tough and most of the block string can be hit confirmed into her BnB. Her 6B overhead is slow but can be chained to 5c/6c,2c,3c so you need to change your block quickly or be quick with the counter hit on her 6B. Blocking her D Spam really shouldn't be an option as you don't want her pushing the guard libra in her favor and it seems like a waste to Barrier Block it when you have counter options. Expert Noel players now have this trick (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZN9bRvw7uE) up their sleave. Basically, they can cancel the recovery on her jump drive into her regular drive moves without actually having to go through the animations of initiating her Drive. This is something you have to worry about on really high level play and will be annoying to deal with.This means blocking her j.C on the ground no longer leads to punishes as she can Jump Drive Cancel into the shoulder tackle for cross ups or drive cancel into other options (2,6 D) that can be hit confirmed into her BnB. This adds a lot more to her mix up games making her deadly when you are forced on the defensive. That being said Noel has to get in close to deal the brunt of her damage and really relies on doing set ups to land that BnB. Once again Fubuki's seem to be your friend in this match up as it's a faster Anti-Air tactic then 5D and C/D Fubuki's can punish over committed rush ins. Noel's Alpha Counter is useful as it will put her behind you and can be used to hit confirm into 6A BnB. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7a5GUQe6pI Even Buppa had a lot of difficulties handling Noel and while this match is old it shows a lot of tactics he used for Noel. He totally changed up his gameplay by the 2nd/3rd match and it saw more success. Poking with 5C->5D and in general he was trying to out zone her but Noel had a lot of means of getting in close to apply her game. The hi/low/throw mix ups are particularly tough to deal with and he got man handled by them in the final round but did make a nice come back. R-1 used Noel's Drive to counter Buppa's late burst and it nailed him the victory. Overall, it seems Buppa used IB to punish Noel's rush ins but not all of us can IB like Buppa so I'm hoping for other options. I don't know what else to do against a top notch Noel player.
cosplayerkyo Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 I see why Jin hates Noel so freaking much now... Noob question here: For Noel's chain drive, she has one finishing where she zones right behind you and hits you with her shoulder. Are you supposed to immediatly block the other way? I keep falling for that stupid move every time...
QuickFast Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 Yes. You would block in the direction you are getting hit from in that situation.
SkaterVic216 Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 With Jin you can block Noel's D combo and just punish with Jin's freeze attack. Thats what I did last against Noel and it worked ^_^
trev Posted July 16, 2009 Posted July 16, 2009 With Jin you can block Noel's D combo and just punish with Jin's freeze attack. Thats what I did last against Noel and it worked ^_^ Not particularly advisable, as previously stated that's going to move the libra against you in an unneccessary fashion. Against good Noels you may also find drive strings that are more difficult to block the entirety of. Much better to nip it in the bud with a 623.
Jissai Posted July 17, 2009 Posted July 17, 2009 I really fucking hate this match-up. I think if I worked on my IB -> 623C more I could do a bit better, but wow...The only way I see myself doing better anytime soon is just to play Noel and get familiar with her I guess?
Darkside Ky Posted July 17, 2009 Posted July 17, 2009 You have to poke>icecar combo. C>C>C>C>C>Ice Car is good.
Darcius Posted July 17, 2009 Posted July 17, 2009 You have to poke>icecar combo. C>C>C>C>C>Ice Car is good. With how good the post quality is around here these days, I almost thought this was a serious post.
ryokoalways Posted July 17, 2009 Posted July 17, 2009 I really fucking hate this match-up. I think if I worked on my IB -> 623C more I could do a bit better, but wow...The only way I see myself doing better anytime soon is just to play Noel and get familiar with her I guess? You can't really expect to put up a fight without knowing the capabilities of your opponent's character, could you? >.> And I don't suggest relying on c dp. Noel's safe pokes recover fast (and she sure as hell isn't going to use her slow stuff to engage Jin), not to mention stuff like 2c can be done at a range totally safe from c dp. You are just setting yourself up for a 5k damage combo.
Darkside Ky Posted July 17, 2009 Posted July 17, 2009 With how good the post quality is around here these days, I almost thought this was a serious post. But Coren says it's true.
Jissai Posted July 20, 2009 Posted July 20, 2009 Not sure it was mentioned or not, but even if you don't IB Noel's 3C and can react quick enough, you can land a CH 5C after her 3C is blocked.
ryokoalways Posted July 20, 2009 Posted July 20, 2009 it doesn't matter because if you hit her she will be crouching, so it's a free high damage combo.
Jissai Posted July 20, 2009 Posted July 20, 2009 Umm, how does the 5C not connect after a blocked 3C from Noel? Unless I'm missing something, not trying to sound like a smart ass. I'm far from great at this game, obviously, so I wouldn't be surprised if I'm missing something.
ryokoalways Posted July 20, 2009 Posted July 20, 2009 huh? what are you talking about? we are talking abotu noel's 3c right? it doesn't exactly have much block stun, so just block it and 5c > 6c immediately, you don't even need to hit confirm because she will be crouching so it's a guaranteed combo. That was my point. I was just adding some more stuff to what you already said.
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