Errol

Well, it's all range specific stuff. For some reason I thought Rachel might have significant difficulty punishing it with IAD. On tsubaki, there is a range where: 1. 5a,5c are not in reach. 2. if you forward jump, you get hit by the orb almost instantly. 3. if you 5b you trade (there is extra time to put out a hitbox because the orb doesn't go active ON YOU.. but you can sure as hell put your hurtbox into the orb immediately if you want...) 4. If you 7 IAD you get over it. But you don't fall ON Mu and you don't have any crossup hitboxes, so I think you just have pressure and not a punish. 5. 236a eats tsubaki DP 6. 236a is plus. like way plus because the first hit pushes you back a bit, giving a couple more frames between the next hit, and so on. 236a is -7 when it gets all 5 hits on you in 5 frames I think. You can't just IB the last hit to be good. But you might be able to IB most of the hits, to make it consume all 5 hits faster? This mighta been off 5b or 5c and not 2b. I was using 2b as a guess of the range more than saying 'hey, this is good off 2b'. So, I dunno. I'm not sure, IB'ing might be a reasonable answer to throw off stuff above, prevent them from getting the range they need for it to work, etc... This is all stuff I researched with Tsubaki.. but I did figure a lot of this should be relevant to Rachel too...

In other words you have time to punish a + on block 236a if you have a far reaching hitbox that doesn't extend your hurtbox. But right, this is getting back to what I thought I found the first time I looked at it. It's really hard to punish, generally the best you can do is dodge it - a pretty sucky situation but of course better than getting reset for free. all midscreen, of course... I don't know how the math works, is it like, if it hits in the first 4 active frames it is minus, and if it's after that it's like +30 or something? when it pushes you it extends the frame bonus... so does IB'ing the orb possibly help a crazy amount? things to test in training mode.....

I'm not even sure what we are talking about at this point. arrows of heaven is like 23f startup, so there isn't a 17f gap. with tsubaki I don't think I was able to even punish with 5b without trading.

taokaka?

that makes you an exboxer

where are you nemesis, I'm on here to play you

are you an exboxer?

why are you blocking a 28f overhead when you throw me out of my 26f overhead?

i considered replying to this.

GGs. was my card showing makoto for sometime? I'm playing both now, I didn't feel like playing Makoto. if you were more random I'd play makoto. and goddamnit mucky..

another interesting thing. 5b in EX has nerfed CH time or something. you can't do CH 5b>cc> 5c in EX, but that should be possible in CP. In CP 5b CH has the same hitstun as 5c CH. Maybe 5b air hit CHs are easier in CP too? nothing new but still makes me scratch my head that 5a>2b doesn't combo. I use that blockstring a decent amount on Makoto.. I actually I use raw 2bs a good amount on Makoto also. It actually also bugs me that if I'm not pressing 5b instantly a 5a>5b won't combo either. It actually happens a fair amount to me..

i could use this too..

Yeah, this is what I was talking about. You can get *AWAY* from it, but if Mu has a much stronger neutral than you that's not good either.. I mean it's better than getting pressure reset. As I recall, it's possible (But really hard, probably too hard) to punish it by jumping over it and landing on her face, or something similar. But should not be possible for Rachel I doubt. so just the other tidbits I can remember. If she does some braindead string and you IB all of it, you will be close enough to IB 5a her, if she does 236a. But I felt this was also not really practical. don't really expect a mu player to do that, and it's way too risky besides. TBH I don't really know exactly the ranges at which it is minus on block. obviously, at point blank it's minus, and at long range it's way plus. but isn't it also plus from something shorter like 2b?

you people are going to be mashing 4d so hard that noone will CH 2d with something more than a jab. and a jab ch doesn't matter. i mean, not that I'm saying it is legit...

so it's a slightly safer version of iad out of the corner?

they got rid of all the HBF moves, which makes it so everyone has to play Noel's guessing game.. At least 2d is slow enough that if you 2a you can probably block it. and you can safe jump I guess. and the throw on wakeup thing.. and 5a>2a..

thank god tsubaki's 6a is HBF so I don't have to worry about getting drived out of mixup attempts.... only 2a'd or thrown... lol....

Mucky doesn't wait for lag spikes to come. He takes things into his own hands.

yeah, this is pretty good. though you now risk getting 2a'd, or thrown. with 5as that hit crouchers you can also just mash the hell out of 5a till you get a hit. ha.

the unfortunate thing about the noel matchup is that in most ways (In this particular matchup and this particular matchup only) she's just a better version of Makoto. All her pokes beat all your pokes, etc. Usually not so clear cut but I think it is here. totally playable though.

if you 5cc you're probably going to be taking a rest, but it's somewhat true against any character. lunatic will beat 2d and brake throw will beat 4d. there are other options too, AV isn't particularly dangerous, it's only dangerous if you are predictable with it. you can't use shooting star to try to call out her stuff like other reversals though. similarly 5cc>2c will beat 4d and 5cc>6b will beat 2d.

you can grab 2d. granted not in the middle of pressure.

you're not calling me out for dodging are you, that can't be.

i only post from work, I don't play BB from work usually

not talking about tk 236a at all. just grounded 236a. 236a is what I think right. sparkly orb. there's not zero way around it but it's hard, a lot harder than you would expect for something that can fully reset pressure. anyway.