Rishtopher

The scene with Makoto I find intriguing. Why would he need to speak with Makoto? I thought Tsubaki would be the one to see him. Carl is obvious, and I guess Tager is there on Kokonoe's behalf. I want Christmas to come so I can play this :D

^Hate to admit it but that's a really accurate analysis. Honestly, even I'm tempted to switch now. He's like everything I wanted in Carl, but a different character. If I don't switch to Relius, I'll still sub Carl. I think it's that Relius looks more fun to play and you have to work way less hard to get the same (if not more) damage. Plus his unblockables look way easier to setup too. One thing that I also really like is that you can combo into Relius' astral easily. Carl's is completely unblockable, but with his health, you can get easily killed unless you have a good lead. Also it doesn't work on people who can pretty much fly (Rachel, Hazama, Valk). At this point, I almost feel dumb if I don't switch... Well, I'm gonna wait til Carl's new gimmicks happen I guess.

Ok, SUPER intrigued as to why he would do that. Can't wait for story mode :D

OH I completely misunderstood you then, sorry! Oddly, that's never happened to me before. Usually, I do this setup on everyone except Tager since if I'm even a split second late, I get 720'd. I just opt for quick pokes and vivace crossups. When I try it against the CPU, I sometimes get DP'd, mostly only Ragna does it but it always catches me offguard with their too-perfect timing.

I never grab during RoM. They can tech grab and block while waiting til you get close for CA if needed. It's actually worse if they don't tech, then you kinda mess up your setup since you can't pick them up without RoM getting in the way. RoM>6B>6C>[6C] works great for me. They always tech RIGHT when the unblockable hits and it leads to decent damage. I never used 6C outside of that setup though, so I don't miss it. Only 5C matters, I'm gonna have to think a bit more when throwing it out there since there's not gonna be any advantage if I trade blows now.

But I mean, to me it only means that we can do what pretty much every other character could do. While I guess you could say it's a buff, I can't help but feel that it's kinda dumb that we're getting it now. I guess what I mean is I have this feeling of "too little, too late" about it? Still, you explained why it's useful so that's good enough for me. I wasn't aware of the 5C stagger being gone D: I get so many CHs on that! I'd forgotten about 6C actually =\ I'm wondering if RoM is isn't as good now since we can use 6C for the unblockable now? I've seen many chances to use it, but the fact that no one's trying gives me the impression that it isn't worth it.

Hahaha, definitely saw Relius in a different light when I saw it too xD With the game's title, I'm almost worried that if we ever get a BB anime it won't the kind I'd be hyped for lol

I don't really see any practical use for a wavedash at the moment, but hopefully someone figures a good use for it. I don't know if you can cancel it into specials though, though that would be cool, I'm all for better range on vivace. About Cantabile, to me it just looks like he dropped the combo cuz he seemed like he was really close to me =\ One thing I'm wondering now is that if you summon Ada as you cantabile, is she summoned in front of you all the time? I just noticed that in the Carl vs Valk vid. Maybe it was that one time though, I guess I'll doublecheck later. Ada's meter has seemed to get a buff overall, but I don't think there are details on the specs yet. She has more armor and moves cost less it looks like. I think the regen is going to be the only problem here. Plus with all the vids I've seen don't have Carl turning off Ada, so maybe the timing is stricter on combos? I only have her on when I need her.

lol, everyone saw the joke coming but the image is what makes it awesome. Without it, I don't even get a chuckle.

Hmmm, that makes it significantly less hype than I thought :\

I thank you greatly for making my day. I just spit my drink all over my monitor, but it was worth it xD

Ok, I just watched the Carl vs Valk vid and after 2]D[, Valk pretty much flies away, it takes almost 3 hops to catch him >__> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=hyJFgj6okR4#t=46s I THINK you might still be able to use it on a crossup but you're going to have to be pretty fast and already have the right amount of spacing when you start so that you can catch your opponent =\ EDIT: Man, I should learn to watch everything all the way through before I start saying anything >__> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=hyJFgj6okR4#t=146s In the same vid, he uses 2]D[ and he's able to easily catch Valk with B vivace. I know it's not a crossup at all, but I'm thinking that if you have Ada spaced really close in CON, you can use A vivace for a crossup for example and then B vivace back and still make it with maybe a hop as well. So like, I think it'll still work, but you'll need to be really fast to catch your opponent. I don't think it isn't doable.

Well you explain it like that, it makes a lot more sense why it was omitted. I'm still kinda bummed about it, if nothing else, I was more hyped that the theme would be my new favourite song. Marionette Purple reigns supreme it seems. Maybe I'll like it more when I see the matchup though? I felt the same about Nightmare Fiction til I saw good Ragna vs Haz gameplay while it was playing. With Ada's armor and meter being better, I think Carl can afford to be more aggressive. I want to wait and see if the extra meter is able to get us combos with comparable (if not more) damage to one the new 3D>IAD>jA etc loops. I dunno if we're gonna be seeing 2D in CON so much anymore since it looks like you have to backdash pretty far. It's not so bad that you can't combo it though, it just looks like you need a lot of space. 4D doesn't look bad at all to me so far.

I thought setups would just go into technical discussion?

Awesome, successfully hyped to the max >:D I know it's way to early to be thinking this, but I wonder what unlimited Relius is like? I feel like he should be at the end of Carl's story mode, and vice versa.

I appreciate the theme, but like.. admittedly I'm still kinda miffed about the lack of opera in either of the themes T__T I wonder how Relius x Carl's special battle intro plays out. I can't remember who told me, but someone said it was really long. Can't wait to see :D Do you have a link so that I can hear it as clearly as Relius vs Carl's theme? EDIT: Nevermind, I just got it lol

For now, I think we're ok since the main discussion thread isn't that huge but I think it would be a good idea to have one. Especially since I want to know who's Relius I'm cheering for and I can't read their Japanese names lol

EDIT: I'm so slow Urichinan lol What do you guys think of this? I don't hear any opera...I kinda hope it's not the real theme since I was pretty hyped for it :\ @Starlight: Thanks for the heads up about the icon, I check my subscriptions through my notifications tab so I wouldn't have ever seen it lol. Who makes the balls though? I hope the Relius ball is his mask :P

Hmmm, I wonder if this is the real theme. I like it though. I almost wish that this isn't it since I don't hear any opera. I want my damn opera >:U Also, I guess I'm ok with his new shampoo combo since it isn't as long. I just don't want to see it ad infinitum like CS2 Carl's loop =\

I've seen Relius Led Ley Ragna's 5B with ease. If he can do that, doing it to a DP should be pretty easy :P

Actually, yeah I didn't consider that >__> @Mascarpone: Maybe it has to do with the fact that you can point-blank cantabile now? It might try to correct the trajectory for you so that if you 6B, you're actually going in further than you need to. Also, I thought 6B wasn't jump cancellable anymore, what would anyone need to do it? Cantabile>5C works fine now.

Judging from the technical thread, Ignis and Relius work the same way. Although you can't input a move in the same direction as Relius is attacking (eg, 6D+6C is not possible). You can input the moves at the same time as Relius is attacking though, they just have to be different directions (eg 2D+6C). Also, Ignis apparently works on press whereas Ada works on release. I don't know anything about timing, but generally, it seems like Ignis is faster so I think playing him would be closer to playing a character where D does a move as opposed to an effect (for example Ragna/Jin in contrast to Rachel or Valk). I hope that helps?

S-Seven th-thousand.. O___O Omg...must ..resist urge...to...switch mains @___@ Man, Relius is looking really awesome. I like his unblockables, he has a lot of mobility and his damage output seems pretty decent if not great. I haven't seen much use of his DDs other than Req Vinum, so I'm liking that Vol Tedo is actually useful for combo damage. Now all I need to know is how he can combo into his sex dungeon astral... Also, I've been watching the vids of Relius matches and the Hazama matchup doesn't look so bad (so far).

Well, AutonomousR has started putting up the recent Carl vids on his Youtube channel, hopefully we get to see more soon. Honestly, the changes don't affect me too much since I never used (j2C + jB) x n or 3]D[ resets that often. The Carl in those vids plays exactly like I do. I'm hoping 66>jA is still in there too :S I LOVE that Ada takes less damage, but I'm wondering how much longer it takes for her to recover? It's hard for me to compare in the video. It's gonna be murder if I let her die now though, I'm almost guaranteed a death if I let that happen. Most of what I'm looking forward to learning is if we're gonna be seeing the exact same loops again (like how we had for CS2) or if we can vary it up for the same (or a least comparable) damage. Not a fan of shampoo combos :| Tightly clutching my top hat and cape while I wait for more vids... Also, still no Relius vs Carl... I find that so odd. It should be the most hyped match up of this game what with him being on the cover and sharing his last name with another character...

Yeah, but he was already at the max range of the 2]D[ so I dunno =\ I found a good example of it here against Mu where he's a lot closer to the opponent. The bounce is kinda far but I think if you timed it right, you could B vivace the distance and catch her with 5C. Here he doesn't need to vivace, but it might be because she's pretty much in the corner. Here's a Youtube link for anyone who wants to see what JG was talking about before I already posted a YT link for that one :P