Luminos564

That design looks...alright I suppose. I am not instantly in love with it, but that might change once I see it in motion.

Wow, you have got to be kidding me. That looks pathetically easy. Take-Mikazuchi actually needed some semblance of effort (depending on who you wanted to use) and so much health it felt like you're just chipping away at a mountain with a pickax. This wailing hothead doesn't even get a health bar for how fast he goes down. I guess he's as much a disappointment in a fight as he is within the story. Well alright, he made a pretty good entrance (nothing says "Hello" like swallowing someone whole). Too bad the pay-off isn't as good as the build-up.

Whoo boy, you have no idea just how false it is. There really ought to be a law against stupid, blatant misinformation like this: So let's break it down, piece by piece. For fun and profit Lizzie! -Only the and [sB] version give her Awakening and blue health. [A] does not. -LOL no. It'd be good if this were true. All it does is give her [A] version with blue health basically. -Randomizer only inflicts Negative Penalty and it will not cause Fatal Counter unless they're under Fear or use a move with Fatal Counter recovery on the move. -[sB] Randomizer, like the other versions only inflicts Negative Penalty when they land. The only difference is that you can combo easier from the [sB] version before they fall. -No. Diarahan only restores health and nothing more. [A] heals little, can be held but is vulnerable and [sB] is projectile invulnerable and can be held. It doesn't do anything else. -Pfffft hahaha oh how I frakkin' WISH this was the case. It'd make Lizzie all the more dangerous for the opponent. But nope, no damage or Invigorate buffs in Awakenining. Only moves with different properties. -No they cannot. They'd be incredibly useful pseudo rekkas (hope I am using this right) then. You could do fun shit like Maziodyne>Maragydyne>Mabufudyne or any combination of the 3. -Pure bullcrap not even worth discussing. -Utter nonsense. It'd be good if they couldn't tech it but they sadly can and always will be able to unless they're mashing wildly or under Fear. Thus we can only deduce that this guy pretending to be Ken Amada is either drunk off his ass or trolling (probably the latter).

Yeah I think I am one of the most vocal ones when it comes to letting people know just which of Lizzie's moves serve absolutely no purpose. SB Mind Charge has always been one of them (along with [D] Ghastly Wail, Mamudoon/SB Mamudoon, normal Mabufudyne). It is rather upsetting at times when 4 moves are useless and others range from "OK" to "I hope you don't whiff here". That sounds like fun and much easier to deal with than say that Challenge 30 in P4A. I still haven't gotten it despite completing all 29 challenges prior to it. It's a shame Randomizer is such an awkward move...wait, hold that thought: what are your thoughts on it Elochai? Is the charge motion difficult to get accustomed to and pull off?

What Elochai said. Added think about it this way: if SB Mind Charge really DID Awaken her at the current health (no decreasing or blue health) we would already have seen players use it. Seriously, that'd actually be very good for her. You lose all of 25 SP since SB Mind Charge takes 75, but when you Awaken you get 50 back so not a large loss and you gain access to arguably better tools. But since I've seen 0 players ever pull it out should tell you that it does not function that way.

Son of a...that's just cruel. Sounds like you're now basically forced to use either the [A] Maziodyne with horrible recovery and hitbox or use 25 SP for the [sB] version since is sounding far too unsafe to throw out randomly. ASW what is the matter with you? What do you have against Lizzie? Whenever I read stuff like this, I wonder what kind of sick joke this is. If you of all people are saying this, what does that mean for people like me who are probably nowhere near that level? Please tell me there's at least something that's good because it is sounding more and more like most of Lizzie's pros are far outweighed by the laundry list of cons.

Wait what? Is this for Awakening only or does that apply to pre-Awakening as well? I seem to recall that 236B can be held in pre-Awakening as it can still fire the regular (P4A)-sized blast but I'd appreciate confirmation. Still that would explain why everyone either tends to use Maziodyne [A] or [sB] primarily in Awakening. Also thanks to you and Elochai. If nothing else, you guys get to explore the character yourselves instead of relying on videos.

There was a stream yesterday evening that showcased it so yeah, I'd say it's in for online at the very least.

Oh no worries. A couple horrible beatings at the hands of the Narukarmy, Brosuke Taskforce, Mitsuru Assassins and Teddie Saboteurs will ensure you remember why you wanted to leave in the first place . I'm keeping a close eye on everything Lizzie related from this point forward. I dunno whether to leave because I know only pain awaits if I stick around or stay and endure it because Lizzie is honestly the only character I care about. Hopefully the coming vids and info will help me decide.

No worries, we can hopefully behave in the meantime (not that Lizzie's playerbase has troublemakers but details). Enjoy the Con. Oh so that's why nobody really loops AWK. Magarudyne. Even in Mahamaon combos where the damage doesn't matter since the move itself will kill them outright with added 20K, they don't really tend to use it more than twice. Probably because of AWK. Maziodyne.

To be fair, this was a given and should have been seen coming a mile away. He was all but guaranteed to redeem himself. I do not like it either but what's done is done. Also here's this for a laugh: http://www.siliconera.com/2014/08/27/teddie-warns-fans-spoil-persona-4-arena-ultimaxs-story-else/ Sorry ATLUS, the collective Internet beat you to the punch.

I think I miswrote when I described SB Mamudoon. It basically just places the seal in front where Lizzie is standing, slightly above the "floor". It's still good though in that regard since it still fires horizontally and it has a pretty damn good hitbox. But as you already know, the recovery is terrible enough that even if you super cancel from AWK. SB Mabufudyne, the opponent has enough time to break out and punch you in the face for using it. That's ultimately the move's biggest flaw. If it's recovery was good that we could do something like: FC Air throw>5B>5C>Mind Charge A>2C>AWK SB Mabufudyne>Mamudoon>combo filler>Death *As a bonus, since it is a horizontal hit, it could cover a lot more area at once and potentially be the go-to instant death attack at midscreen. Well in theory anyway. The move itself has good properties like how it activates much faster than Mahamaon and lasts longer than it too. But the recovery prevents it from being utilized in such a manner. I think they can loop but not in the same manner. Truthfully, when Awakened, I have trouble figuring out which Magarudyne version is being used. I always assumed the SB version holds the opponent in place and is that big tornado animation. But then I see them use a non-SB version and it does the same (though not as long-lasting).

Really? Paste bin links apparently won't open for me but this would make things a little better. I think I'm gonna wait it out for a bit now. It is really hard to discern what is fact and lie at the moment (unless an image and context are provided).

Finally saw the Margaret segment. I dunno, does anyone here think she might be more than just "good"? I am afraid I cannot make the judgement. But I will say that the ground pound reminds me of Potemkin's Slide Head in functionality. She also got some crazy movement options for covering distances as well it seems. Definitely excited for her at least. As for Adachi, maybe it's just me but doesn't it look like his status ailments disappear very quick? Perhaps I am so used to Lizzie and her many ways of inflicting Fear, but Adachi's looked like it barely covered half the duration she can inflict. Thoughts?

EDIT: Nevermind, false alarms. For now at least. However, I am not surprised Hi-no-Kagutsuchi is involved. If you followed the Izanagi and Izanami story, you know that after giving birth to him, Izanami was burned to death by Kagutsuchi. In retaliation, Izanagi killed him which means Yu is likely the one who canonically takes him out.

Drat I'm at work. I hope someone is taking notes/uploads it later.

Unless of course you're dying to see gameplay like Challenges, Golden Arena, Score Attack or Network streams. In which case I guess...Twitch? Still, I'd imagine it'd be hard to avoid it regardless of the site. I've already spoiled myself rotten in the last 3 hours so the above is basically all I care about at this point in time.

SPOILER WARNINGS

That's not Shadow Lizzie. That's just Lizzie when you break one of her unwritten rules and she proceeds to Megidolaon you to kingdom come. By the way, the early digital pre-orders happen on the 26th yes? How far ahead in hours is Japan again?

Ah you're right. Bioshock Infinite had that too. Question: if the characters are unused does that mean the person who made the tier list had no data on them? I was surprised enough to see Shadow Yu not placed anywhere considering he was all the rage some months ago.

Ah I see. Actually, all this talk of Mahamaon makes me wish that Mamudoon's recovery wasn't so damn terrible. It's activation time is shorter and lasts longer so it'd be useful as an alternative if you find your opponent would get their Burst back during a Mahamaon combo. It's not like Mamudoon's height is a problem either since all you'd need to do is make sure to launch them with 2C, Mabufudyne, Magarudyne and etc. And although more costly, SB Mamudoon places itself on the ground in front of Lizzie which eliminates the height restriction altogether.

I like this far more than the default, even if all they did was change everyone's expression to be more sadistic. Although. how would you even get your hands on that? Most curious.

Amazing. Thank you Tong.

Yeah looking back, I don't know what I was thinking. Probably a combination of long working days, late evenings and feeling under the weather. Sorry. But we shiv and burn or however that saying goes so hopefully I don't make claims like this in the future. Though I trust most people here know better when they see some obvious mistakes. Don't take my word for this, but I do not think Mahamaon has proration at all. The only time I saw its damage reduced was when the opponent hit Awakening but it still deals more than 13K on its own which is still more than any Normal Type (normally it is like 24K from Mahamaon and 20K from Mamudoon, even though you're likely never to combo into the latter). Rather, I'd argue that we need to do Mahamaon as early as possible because of its long activation time. It makes sense I think. If it activated instantaneously like Naoto's Hamaon, I could see it getting its damage severely cut down.