Lucalibur

I believe all the answers got answered in the posts above, but I might as well give my two cents anyway. I think you should get the Phalanx stocks you need and not any more, maybe punish some of his bullshit with it once or twice to scare the player. The mental effect of knowing anything you do can suddenly get punished for 1K and practically losing all momentum can easily get people to do stupid mistakes. Don't go out of your way to gain stocks, and don't use them all, but DO remind the Jin player you CAN use that tool to punish his bullshit from anywhere on the screen. Without his projectiles, Jin's neutral effectiveness drops sharply. As it was mentioned, you need to be more patient than Jin here. That is really the only way you gonna get anything done here. Make good use of your tools, specially your limited Phalanx stocks. I think this move is probably one of our most important ones in this matchup.

No real way to get pass that, I'm afraid. I just toss out a Gustaf after he lands(if I'm close enough), but that is dangerous if he decides to just 5C or whatever after it(despite the landing recovery). If you ate an ice sword, you can keep the Phalanx stock in order to scare the Jin away from using such moves, and if he does continue then fire the thing and either go into BHS for over 3K or get close and pressure him. Considering a lot of Jin's moves are projectiles, it should not be VERY hard to gain a Phalanx stock.

Would a delayed DP\Backdash beat that, though?

The timing is a bitch, I think. It's pretty hard to get it down consistently because you have to delay the J.C to a point where you're almost touching the ground, but you still get the J.C in. Do the 6A after the throw the fastest you can and just try delaying the J.C at different times until you get it right.

Alright then, thanks for checking. I was not really planning on using J.2D over J.D, just curiosity on my part. Only situation I can find myself going for J.2D instead is if I want to keep both weak points for a BHS unblockable and I already got an upper one applied. Just go for usual route but replace all J.Ds for J.2Ds and end with the usual rekkas into 3D mid-screen or J.2D in corner is what I had in mind.

2A is great for pressure because of the frame advantage and available options off it. Even though it's a bad starter, it still goes into 3C meterless for 1K and knockdown, so you can't really complain. Other than that, 2B is another decent move despite the massive frame advantage nerf it got in CP, because it still frames trap nicely. Don't know about the second one, but I would take you're safe enough to resume pressure on normal block. If you got a good knockdown, you can safe jump J.B\J.2C to beat rolls. Otherwise, 2B beats forward rolls and no teching. Backrollers can be forced into pressure nevertheless by 214Aing after 2B, and if they try to jump away they will usually get caught on the jump startup frames. In the corner 2B beats everything but the usual DPs. Knockdown. While high altitude J.2C into Agito gives a very basic form of knockdown, it still gives that. J.C gives nothing but damage(outside of the corner), and Haku -really- wants that knockdown over, say, extra 50 damage since his new BnBs prorate so harshly by the end of the day. You can do Agito off your first jump and get much better oki by still keeping the ability to air dash or do a meaty safe jump J.B. Air dash J.B>OD>J.B>Stuff is actually a pretty legit route people seem to get caught by it more often than they should.

Great stuff. I know I was not the one that asked but nevertheless I appreciate visual input of the things that can be done off a J.D rapid. Do they work off a J.2D as well? Doubt it since J.2D has has a significantly lower hitbox, but just making sure.

But ain't the difference only of 5\10 frames at best? Man, that combo must really be pushing the limits of the new system.

Not a Tsubaki player, but... I've had similar problems with other characters. Way hitstun works is that it drops further with each threshold. It might a combined aspect of height and it breaking a threshold by only a few frames. Ragna has a similar problem where he can't do J.C>Belia Edge in some corner combos if he is not directly in front of them, because the extra 5\10 frames required to launch the enemy into the corner by straight punch fuck the timer up. This is a really stupid combo system tbh and I would much rather have the proration = hitstun decay system back, but alas. Best tip I've got is that you should do your best not to delay anything unless it will keep the enemy lower to the ground so that they reach it after 22D.

Instrumental version pls

6B is super awkward in general. It seems to be good only against crossups and you can't follow it up consistently without CH. It's an ok combo filler in valiant combos off a decent starter, at least. Oh, and about the OD second hit whiff I mentioned earlier? I was messing around with a friend and I ended up hitting her Mu out of the new crossup move she has with it, but the second hit ended up whiffing. Seems like this can end up happening more often than just if you try to make it happen.

Alright, I don't know if this has been stated or confirmed or anything, but it IS possible under unrealistic circumstances for Scud Punishment's second hit to whiff despite the first attack hitting. If that happens, there is no stagger, nor any weakpoints applied. I was messing around training mode by doing 6A>Delayed 5B in the corner against Ragna, and Scud's second hit didn't connect because Ragna ended up behind Azrael. Again, unrealistic, but felt like pointing out.

I really hate the new Dead Spike personally. I feel like the changes were overall more of a nerf than buff. It's not even consistent now and rarely it will outright whiff if they're too close. Then again I don't like most of the changes from what I got to experience so far, so maybe that is just me being butthurt.

Just practice. It can be hard at first because the timing is a bit weird sometimes(He can't go into the follow up right away after entering the stance, it takes a few frames for that), but it's really a matter of practicing and become comfortable with it.

3C>CT is more consistent due to its properties I think, although grounded CT would definitely have some potential. Sadly, 5C's pushback is too huge.

Mid-screen OD combo at 100% HP requiring optimization. 6A>6B>5C>OD>Dash 3C>2D~C>5D~A>2D~A>6D~A>5B>3C>6D~C>2D~B>Possibly orb oki? Does 3871 and gives 27 meter. If 50 meter is available by 6D~C, can go into super ender instead for about 4700 damage or so. Can be done off 5C\2C as well if close enough, but didn't test the results. Same for 2B starter as well, but then you gonna have to go into 2B>3C>OD instead of 5C>OD. Also, here is an RC combo off a random ground hit 5C that also requires optimization(might work off air hit too? Haven't tested 2D~B's properties properly yet). 5C>2D~B(1)>RC>2D~A>6D~A>5BB>5C>6D~C>2D~C>5D~A>Possibly orb oki? Does 4312 damage and gives back 18 meter by the end. Tried to do off 6A but the 5D~A has them tech in the air. Finding combos is work, and I doubt these are even optimized in any way, but alas, week 1 stuff. If these were already posted then sorry.

I got 3496 off 6B>5D(2)>OD>5C>2D>Dc>5C>5D>214A>5B>5C>jc>J.C>jc>J.C>J.214C>5D(2)>22C>623D ender However, I got 3960 off the same by using 6B>5D(1)>OD instead, which also allowed me to use 5C>5D(2) after J.214C at the end of the combo rather than have to go straight into 5D.

J.B's hitbox is great for mixups, but it's just way too small for neutral IMO. His neutral game really feels like shit right now, what makes me sad because when I first tried him out I expected his neutral to at least be decent with the range of those Cs. Guess this guy is really momentum heavy at the end of the day, and sadly he is bad at getting momentum. J.C's landing recovery needs to go away, because that would help A LOT.

True, true. Kagura is a rather new character who clearly exceeds in mixups, so he I believe he makes much better use of the orb oki than Makoto does, which is saying something since orb oki is such a good tool for Makoto.

After having a few more matches using this guy, I feel the need to ask if it's just me who is finding his neutral game extremely awkward. Maybe I'm not using his projectile enough, or maybe I just suck at this. I know part of the fault is J.C's terrible hitbox for its speed and landing recovery, though. That being said, I just don't know what I should be doing. It's like every time I use him I just hope to god I hit with a random C. By all means, the stagger and 1K damage is great, but I can't find any neutral utility for any of his moves other than 5C, 2C, 6C(anti-air), J.C(I need to stop using this), and orb. I would really like some help with knowing what I'm suppose to be doing in neutral. His defensive games is also a bit awkward to me due to the charged DP. I have to stop charging if it I want to block an overhead. Obviously you could say I should just DP instead, but it sadly ain't that simple in practice, because blocking an overhead on reaction is just so much easier than DPing out of it. There is also the fact his normals are either too slow or short ranged, so I can't even mash out of poor pressure properly(Not that mashing is a good strategy, but sometimes you gotta rape the 2A). I don't know, maybe it's just me. We're still in week 1 after all. I'm probably just being stupid, but I would like to know what I should be doing with this guy.

It seems to be. No offense to the Makoto playerbase, but the fact those specials are almost identical in that usage makes it rather hilarious to hear a Makoto player being annoyed by it.

Haha, that worked! Thanks a lot.

Alright, so I have been trying to do one of the combos listed on the combo thread: 6A > 6B > 3C > 2D~C > 5D~A > dash 5B > 6B > 5C > 4[]6B (projectile hit) > 6C > 2D~A > 6D~A > 5D~28D (4791 DM) But I can't get the 5D~A into dash cancelled 5B to work. I always end up on the other side, just going below the enemy. I can still follow up but with a different, much less damaging combo and I don't really like that. Any tips for not getting 5B to crossup when really close to the corner?

A good friend of mine plays Izayoi and we had a few matches yesterday, and while we are both not that good(yet), I feel like I got a decent idea of some things you can do in this matchup. Sonic Sabers can be superarmored right through by 6D~C if you're expecting one. I don't think it counters hit unless you do it before it even comes out(which means you're predicting rather than reacting), but it still discourages them from using it a lot. Don't stay in the air. I know J.C has a decent hitbox around Kagura, but it simply does no good when Izayoi has some of the best anti-airs in the game. That being said, she can't exactly go around in the air for free either if you know what you're doing. 6C punishes bad jump ins hard. It's hard to properly space out in this matchup sometimes, because of 5C's and 2C's strictly horizontal hitboxes and Izayoi's decent air game. They're fairly safe if blocked at maximum range however, and can be hit confirmed into 2D~B off practically any distance. Don't know how safe it is, but it gives a very valuable knockdown on hit. Other than that, I don't know much, and even there some of what I said could be wrong. I haven't tested tossing orbs at Izayoi yet, but it might help stopping sonic sabers as well and just controlling space in general.

Yeah, it took me a while to get used to all of the timings, and I'm still not getting everything right consistently. I'm having the most trouble with 5B>2C and 5A>5B(surprisingly). As far rekkas in the corner go, it also took me a while to get used to delaying the final hit just enough to follow up with 5B. Weird shit.