Loli Bacon

I dunno if this has already been posted but: j.2D > 5B > 5D > tk.236B > j.236C |> 66 > 5B > 4B > Itsuu A > 6kote > 236A > 236B > 643214A > [R]5D > 6C > 3C > 632146C DMG:4057

I dunno. I think there's a clear difference between Kokonoe and MBAA PS2 Archetype=Earth.,

Double post: sorry. It's not a matter of what we gain, it's simply a matter of why. There are plenty of instances in which banning something gives us a lot more in return in other fighting games but why haven't we before? Again, banning top tier characters in other games would show us a healthier scene for competition but if we truly cared about that or character variety, we'd have done it already

Sigh.... (P|X) = (P|A)^2 + 2((P|A)*(P|B))*(P|A) So (P|X) = (.2)^2 + 2((.2)*(.8))*(.2) = .104 = 10.4% chance for an 8-2 matchup to win the set. How is that impossible to win?

I never said it wasn't a different game. But tournament and casual levels are completely different as well. Casual Melty and you see shit like H-Kohamech and she'll win, but higher level play you'll see more GOOD characters. Should we ban C-Sei, C-Roa and Ryougi just because it would increase character variety? I know H-Sei wouldn't look too terrible if C-Sei were gone. "Practically impossible to win"? We did the math on this already; 10-20% chance when at an EVEN skill level isn't "nearly impossible"; stop exaggerating. Yes, it's hard, but that still doesn't invalidate a character. Be better than your opponent. Casuals don't matter. If they're casual, they'll just be going to tournaments to lose money anyway. Does it matter if they lose to Litchi or Kokonoe? People of all skill levels will still populate the brackets if she isn't banned, there might just be less players overall. If someone truly likes the game, they'll still play it. If it's a matter of bringing in more of a crowd so that more money is tossed in for the TOs and the winners, then this is a matter of business rather than competition, and that shouldn't be a reason to ban a character at all. If it's a matter of having interesting grand finals so we have more viewers, why do we care?

This is exactly what I mean. Thank you very much Maho.

This horse has been beaten to death, but I still want one more whack at it. 1) Just because a single character in top tier has an amazing matchup against your character doesn't make your character unviable. It makes you unwilling to deal with a single character, or unwilling to learn an alt to cover your holes. 7-3 is not unwinnable. 8-2 is not unwinnable. These are bad matchups, yes, but they sure as hell can be won. Outplay your opponent. Be 4x better than them or pick a better character. 2) Banning single moves with Kokonoe won't fix the problem, but perhaps something else within this realm can be thought up. 3) We as a community have never banned characters simply to increase character variety at a tournament level. There's a difference between tournament and casuals and if somebody is upset that they can't win a tournament with their low tier waifu, you had best pick a better character, step it up, or go back to just playing casuals. We have never banned a character simply to draw in more of a crowd. Have any of the top players stated they would drop the game if she isn't banned? Why do we care about casuals? That's all.

That's great! Thank you! That's all I needed; a place to start. =P You're the best.

I play SC! =D I'm bad, though.

"Gay pictures of Ted" is redundant; just say 'pictures of Ted".

So I'm thinking of picking this chick up again because I love her design. Can anyone help me by making a list of the essential combos I should learn? Which 10-15 combos are the most common/important for her? Thanks! =D

I can help you with the matchup if you guys want. I don't know what Nu's options are, but I can tell you where my largest gaps exist. 1) 2C, while + on block, is the end of my pressure string unless there is a graviton BEHIND me or already behind the Nu. I have 3 options here if I want to continue pressure - 6D > 236D to force you to block and reset the string (+24 on block, but 36f startup; beats delayed jumps or backdashes), delayed 3C to catch jumps and 6D punish attempts (true end to blockstring), 5C stagger to catch punish attempts (higher payout than 3C). If there is a graviton behind me, 2C is +2-3 (can't be bothered to check) and so I can simply do xxx > 2C > 2A > stuff > 2C to make you want to fidget. 2) This didn't come up much in our match, but if you let me get away with a graviton in a blockstring, that opens you up to a whole new level of absurdity. If you're afraid of activate, that's PERFECT for me; you're going to have to KNOW the graviton is coming and punish me for it, otherwise I get unreactable 50/50s in the blockstring. But remember, it's 36f of startup, that's more than enough to punish me. 3) Any thing after 3C is unsafe. From what I read (again, I didn't test this) is that the second hit of 3C is mid, so you can block that standing to IB it. That would make me -3 which would be the end of my pressure. Usually, to prevent this from happening, I'll do 3C(1) > 6D > 236D (no one has caught on to this yet; it's not good) which is hella punishable. Since 3C doesn't pull you back in on the first hit, you could probably do 5D to punish it (not the best, but at least you're out). 4) If I do 236D > 22C on block, I'm punishable. Mash me out. I think I'm still negative if you get hit while on the ground, but this would require testing. PSN sometime? =P 5) 6B is -2 on block, which means it's -4 on IB. Startup of 22A is something along the lines of 16f, so point blank, you can 5A me between that so I don't get that blockstring. If I'm farther away, it becomes risky but we could think of an option. At max distance, you can just IB > Backdash but point blank I can punish with 3C (at least I can with most other characters. Again, testing.) Hope this was helpful. I think you might want to be in Lambda mode since if I put out a graviton you can't really use D moves. Instead, try to Act Parser me to punish my zoning attempts. Might work out.

Get out.

You have too much faith in ASW. They won't fix her until BBCPII, which based on previous track records won't be for another year.

Well considering how everyone is reacting to her infinite blockstring, I'd say whether I played her and gave you guys matchup experience or not is moot; you'll still just eat the infinite blockstrings and lose, guaranteed.

I wanted to make people cry about my character choice, so I picked Kokonoe.

Pastabilities got me. Goddamn it. xD Honestly, I don't care if she's banned, I told Erik I was planning on playing Litchi if she was regardless, but I think it's stupid how they're going about handling it. If the string is truly an issue, just ban the string > blackhole instead of the character. EDIT: You know what? Just ban her at our ranbats, I was the only player using her anyway. I'll just actually learn Litchi now, maybe. I'd rather know now than putting in more lab work just for it to be all for naught.

I haven't insulted anyone on purpose. If anyone felt insulted, I mean, if the shoe fits. Honestly regardless of what I bring up, her "potential" is too good for anyone else to care. And while people are bitching that it's too much effort to learn the matchup, that there are 25 other characters they have to learn the matchup for, as a competitive player you should worry about the one that is more difficult for you; the matchup that is more likely to come accross. Playing Guilty Gear, I can say that I never played against a good Millia (I never played Ray; I think Ray would consider himself bad, knowing how modest he is), but I didn't focus on that matchup because she wasn't likely to appear. Playing Arcana Heart, I didn't focus on the Yoriko matchup AT ALL (still don't know it in the slightest) because I worried more about Maori, Elsa, and Weiss. Just because not every single character is viable at tournament level (even with her ban, Izayoi and Amane are still going to be trash) doesn't mean the game is no longer competitive; if you pick a terrible character, expect to have terrible matchups. If you pick a character that has a bad matchup against a top tier character, expect to learn that matchup inside and out. If you want to use facts for this argument, the fact is there is no evidence that she is unbeatable at a tournament level. There is POTENTIAL, but we aren't discussing theory with you, otherwise all of this would be moot. She is honestly being banned on the premise that "she's too strong (theoretically)". There are facts like what she CAN do, but there are also facts like what she can be punished for, what isn't safe, and what she can't do. I'm just saying with the current logic going on with this subject, I'm surprised CS1 Litchi (I can't get out of Great Wheel Oki mindlessly and she gets 6k meterless bnbs wahhhhhhh) wasn't banned immediately.

The entire community outside of top level players is also pretty babied about this sort of thing (Eddie lolol). Most top level players think she's really strong, yes, but they are indifferent about the ban. It's really the mid-level and low-level players who truly care.

This is called being competitive. If you can't be bothered to learn how to deal with a powerful character at a tournament level, you don't deserve to win against her. What you're saying is someone should be able to consistently beat somebody by chance rather than by learning the matchup? If they don't KNOW what they are doing, they are guessing, which means they should win by chance/luck. I wonder how you would have reacted to Eddie and Testament in GG: Eddie has unblockable oki and unblockable pressure strings that are meterless. For most cases, the answer to is just "deal with it", and for the options I can react to, the answer was to learn how to deal with it so I wasn't as disadvantaged as I would be had I not known the scenario. I'm all for a ban, but again, I think everyone is overreacting to some of her stuff and they get too caught up in the fear of what she can do.

No. It's called mis-information. This is synecdoche:

That's honestly everyone's reasoning. That infinite blockstring isn't infinite, you just can't normal block the entire thing. It's the same thing as Rachel's guaranteed guard crush setup in CT, and you guys didn't bitch about that. xD

:<

The new setup forces you to eat it while already blocking; that's not an option.

Because science.