[CT] Iron Tager vs. Jin

[A.X.I.S.]

hahahahahahha, thanks iokain. Unfortunately, you have to spin that shit fast enough to brake you out of the ice before you can 720. Incredibly hard to do if the Jin doesnt mess up. Wish i had it on replay though, lol

i could rotate that but if i do i'd have to buy a new xbox controller after continued use.

[Raiderwarlord99]

Is there any block strings that jin has that I can IB and get a 360 through. I fight 2 jin's on a regular basis. 1 of them I can get away with a little bit of BS because of his lack of knowledge of the match and the other as played me enough to pretty much stop all me offensive attempts. It seems all I do now is his there in instant block for meter all day so I can attempt to punish his random attempts to pressure me with his drives or get lucky with a random throw. I know not all the stuff he does to me isn't safe I just want to know if u guys look for certain things to punish. AND PLEASE DON'T SAY ICE CAR I THINK EVERYBODY AND THERE MOMMA CAN PUNISH THAT ON REACTION NOW!

[A.X.I.S.]

Is there any block strings that jin has that I can IB and get a 360 through. I fight 2 jin's on a regular basis. 1 of them I can get away with a little bit of BS because of his lack of knowledge of the match and the other as played me enough to pretty much stop all me offensive attempts. It seems all I do now is his there in instant block for meter all day so I can attempt to punish his random attempts to pressure me with his drives or get lucky with a random throw. I know not all the stuff he does to me isn't safe I just want to know if u guys look for certain things to punish.

AND PLEASE DON'T SAY ICE CAR I THINK EVERYBODY AND THERE MOMMA CAN PUNISH THAT ON REACTION NOW!

6D easy punish, frost bite can be sledged. any rush attempt from long range can be 5D'd.

random backdash 360 can be done..such a shame i dont use it much so i dont know which moves to backdash.

lets see those are the moves i look for when fighting jin.

[Tiamat]

the only Tager at SBO lost first round to a Jin

[Raiderwarlord99]

6D easy punish, frost bite can be sledged. any rush attempt from long range can be 5D'd.

random backdash 360 can be done..such a shame i dont use it much so i dont know which moves to backdash.

lets see those are the moves i look for when fighting jin.

I'm well aware of sledging through any of his drives but my problem is that they won't use them outside of combo's so 90% of the time thats usually out. I figured out I can IB 5C and as long as they don't DP me I can get a throw off but if they start getting to predictable with that I can just start bait and punishing that but that doesn't happen to often.

It just seems that when I'm against jin I'm being defensive 80% of the time, offensive 5% and playing around in neutral 15%. I at least want that defensive percentage to go down some. I tend to freak out a bit when I start flashing blue.

[A.X.I.S.]

I'm well aware of sledging through any of his drives but my problem is that they won't use them outside of combo's so 90% of the time thats usually out. I figured out I can IB 5C and as long as they don't DP me I can get a throw off but if they start getting to predictable with that I can just start bait and punishing that but that doesn't happen to often.

It just seems that when I'm against jin I'm being defensive 80% of the time, offensive 5% and playing around in neutral 15%. I at least want that defensive percentage to go down some. I tend to freak out a bit when I start flashing blue.

i know how you feel man, i use the blue as a wake up call to use barrier.

this fight will test your endurance, you will be defensive, hell in my opinion in every fight as a tager, you will be defensive at least 40% of the time, just wait for that moment, barrier the some strings and if you can 5D his ass, i swear once a magnet is on, then they get mad scared, they will try to back off, just keep your pace, throw a magnet..and for gods sake dont eat ice cars.

earlier i fought a good jin, he kept me from roll recovering and i was off on the tager busters, and he put me in a bad spot but i figured something out...DD's. if you think a jin is too happy, DD the bitch that gives them a new outlook on life.

well thats how i did it..and yes for that fight i was being defensive 80% of the time, its like destiny you know.

[Scarpia]

I played a jin yesterday who would ice car with follow up out of combo. We all know this is punishable on block by 360a sometimes b. Thing is, he would immediately follow up with a grab after the icecar+f. I was trying to do normal grab to punish, not 360a/b. If jin grans immediately after a blocked ice car +F can tager get his grab or 360 off first or will it always be a grab+counter grab situation.

[Drges]

You can land the 360B before he finishes recovering from the second slash of the ice car.

[HZMN]

You can land the 360B before he finishes recovering from the second slash of the ice car.

Use 360A, way safer and better for the ice car situation. Mainly due to the fact the ice car on block with push him back just far enough where 360B misses. The only thing I think the 360B works on is IB the ice car. Barrier blocking it? Forget it, one of the few times I recommend not to Barrier block an obvious move.

[Maho]

360A needs the IB on the second hit of the icecar to make it guaranteed, icecar is -9 on normal block and 360A has 11f startup, 360 B will sometimes need the IB for Tager to stay in range, but if the icecar has been done close, it can be done without. Also Scarpia, better don't use normal throw as a punisher, your opponent might get out of it if he buffers a throw break during the recovery.

[RedTao]

Jin's crossup j.D is really getting on my nerves. Is there anything I can do about it? Or do I just have to learn to block it correctly, eat another string as he lands, and whine more? God I hate this matchup. Playing against Nu and Ara is frustrating too, but they're practically a different game and it's always easy to see what led to the loss. When I face off against Jin, though, it feels like I'm just getting outplayed. The dude has a massive toolbox and nonstop rushdown. Every time I find a tiny gap, like the B sledge opportunity between his 5C and 5D, it works a couple of times but he'll always adjust to fill it with something else and I can't keep up. RAGGGH! Science, where are you?! I need your power!

[A.X.I.S.]

Jin's crossup j.D is really getting on my nerves. Is there anything I can do about it? Or do I just have to learn to block it correctly, eat another string as he lands, and whine more?

God I hate this matchup. Playing against Nu and Ara is frustrating too, but they're practically a different game and it's always easy to see what led to the loss. When I face off against Jin, though, it feels like I'm just getting outplayed. The dude has a massive toolbox and nonstop rushdown.

Every time I find a tiny gap, like the B sledge opportunity between his 5C and 5D, it works a couple of times but he'll always adjust to fill it with something else and I can't keep up. RAGGGH! Science, where are you?! I need your power!

damn i just fought a good ass jin today too.

i'll give you a bit to help you out...im not going on a long rant like i did in the ragna v tager thread, i tested it and won against 4 out of 5 ragna's.

if you see jin jump at you dont block, always barrier..chances are he's gonna try to j.c you for damage touch the ground and 5b>combo loop...beware of it..if you do deal with crossups then learn to block/barrier it.

jin does have a good tool box but its mostly from his drive, so you can A sledge it or wait it out...the jin i fought used 5D>dash cancel to keep pressure on me, i just barrier the mess.

don't feel so down jin is swift i'd say size of a mouse, strength of a train.

don't seek all the sledge opportunities especially a B sledge, everyone will try to force a sledge and if he isn't doing a frost bite move then don't try it, i don't care if he's in the air...your a tager patience is everything...it takes time for science to work don't you know chemistry? my boy.

lucky for you im doing research on this as we speak. i'll post my observations at a later time.

[ocdscale]

Jin's crossup j.D is really getting on my nerves. Is there anything I can do about it? Or do I just have to learn to block it correctly, eat another string as he lands, and whine more?

Every time I find a tiny gap, like the B sledge opportunity between his 5C and 5D, it works a couple of times but he'll always adjust to fill it with something else and I can't keep up. RAGGGH! Science, where are you?! I need your power!

I'm a mediocre player, so take this with a grain of salt.

Problem is that whether or not j.D crosses up is entirely dependent on spacing and it can be extremely ambiguous at times. Also if Jin notices that you are getting wise to the crossup j.D he can appear to crossup then j.236D (three ice swords) that pushes him back and requires that you block it normally, meaning you eat long freeze if you were expecting crossup.

You can try jabbing Jin out of the air if you know he's going for IAD j.D or crossup shenanigans, but you'll be eating a counterhit if he's going for j.B.

Backdash 360 is probably your best weapon against typical Jin rushdown. All Jin's major pokes have a decent whiff time, Jin's rushdown is dependent on jump/dash canceling those pokes but he can't do that if you backdash.

[RedTao]

Backdash 360 is probably your best weapon against typical Jin rushdown. All Jin's major pokes have a decent whiff time, Jin's rushdown is dependent on jump/dash canceling those pokes but he can't do that if you backdash.

Figured this was probably the case... But taking my thumb off of block for even a split second is terrifying:gonk:

Thanks for the help guys! Will work harder.

[kensk]

Backdash 360 is probably your best weapon against typical Jin rushdown. All Jin's major pokes have a decent whiff time, Jin's rushdown is dependent on jump/dash canceling those pokes but he can't do that if you backdash.

stand b, 2a spam and 6C almost guarantee you eating a 1/7th life combo (that result in a knockdown) every time you backdash in a ground string. dont rely on it heavily at all. its actually an ok anti-air, though.

if you need to make jin stop being predictable in your face, IB 360A/720. you should try to IB jins strings a lot anyway because its actually relatively easy and the reward for it is really high.

when jin does shit like instant jB, THATS a good time to backdash, he doesnt have a lot of options that will hit your backdash (none of his air attacks hit very horizontally or are active for too long, jD might hit on rare occassion he has to use ex fireball, pretty much). from there you can 2A as he lands, or just wait it out again, and avoid some of his pressure (so you dont take as much guard bar). you will need this precious guard bar or barrier gauge throughout most of the match.

a good thing to look for is if jin ends a string in jD, his options become a branch of unsafe. either wait (gives you initiative), dash cancel (hes not at frame advantage), or cancel into fireball (free sledge if you're looking for it) or ice car (unsafe unless he RCs and gets a free mixup). stand b is probably the second best time to guess in a string, if you IB either of the hits, 720, or you're making him jump/backdash/dp, which limits a lot of his choices.

[A.X.I.S.]

this might be stupid to ask but, how do i keep jin from getting started? i mean i dont want him to start the rush down becomes too much hassle to bother with, is there anything i can do to shut the the victory ice machine down before it warms up.

[Coren]

this might be stupid to ask but, how do i keep jin from getting started? i mean i dont want him to start the rush down becomes too much hassle to bother with, is there anything i can do to shut the the victory ice machine down before it warms up.

Murder

Learn to predict the Jin player, find his habits. If he likes to IAD in at a certain range start throwing out atomic colliders at that range; He'll either stop doing that so freely, or you'll get free combos. If he likes to backdash away and put out a 236C/D to cover a rush in, learn to anticipate that and save a spark for it.

You need to deny him some of his options.

[BANGER]

Hoho, you post here too eh. Just who do you main anyway? lol Anyway, IAD happy Jins (what I used to be) can easily be countered by a backdash + buffered 360 (or 720), or a plain grab. You can try to gamble with an Atomic Collider but at some instances, I've countered Tagers who Atomic Collider with a 5C at a-bit-less-than IAD distances. I'm guessing at this point this is just a mind game ceiling.

[A.X.I.S.]

Murder

Learn to predict the Jin player, find his habits. If he likes to IAD in at a certain range start throwing out atomic colliders at that range; He'll either stop doing that so freely, or you'll get free combos. If he likes to backdash away and put out a 236C/D to cover a rush in, learn to anticipate that and save a spark for it.

You need to deny him some of his options.

hmm i'll try it, normally jins 5B>5C>J.B>j.C loop gets me and if i dont IB the J.C when he decides to land gets me right back into it..

jin isnt really hard for me, i just hate it when they get confident.

[Mike Z]

If you have problems with crossup j.D, you can 2C it for free CH awesome, no matter which side. You can also 2C CH if he does the 3 ice swords, which will result in you not getting frozen and still being able to combo him. Or you can jump up and airthrow.