Ragna Critique and Self-Improvement Thread

[FlyingVe]

It's important to note that in CT (non-TK) GH cannot always be followed up with anything.IN fact just doing GH on the ground cannot be followed up at all. The most common situations where you could land 5B>6A is of a back throw, 6C, or a CH AA ID hit. In some other cases you must settle for GH>5B>D.ID. Also, 5D(DC)>6A is somewhat character specific. While you can mash it out against most of the cast, with some characters (carl, rachel)it can only be landed when you begin the combo with 5C or 5D (not 5b or 5a) and on others (Jin, Tao) the timing is simply stricter on the 6A.

[Kain]

Speaking of CH ID. If you can manage to CH with only the 2nd hit of D.ID (hit them with it at max range), then you can do 5B>6A>j.C>j.D>JC>j.C>j.D>623D>236C>214C for 3-4k damage. It's just situational damage though, since I can't think of a time where anyone was actually CHing off the 2nd hit of ID consistently.

[JETROCKETSKATES]

You must be underestimating its hitbox or speed then.

5D(DC)>6A is easy to do, since you can literally mash it out with no problems.

GH>5B>6A is hard, but the hard part is really landing a properly delayed GH>5B. 6A and everything after that is easy.

I'm fine with 5D (DC) > 6A, it just seems that with 5B > 5C > 5D (DC) > 6A, the uppercut hits right when they tech out.

Obviously, it's a mistake I'm making, but it seems like if I press it any earlier, it doesn't come out. I'm trying to hit it RIGHT at the end of the dash, but it usually goes through them teching out.

Is it possible I'm just waiting to long to Dash Cancel, and I should start entering it in on the first hit of 5D, so it comes out the second the second hit is over?

Thanks for all the help, by the way. It's very much appreciated.

[A.X.I.S.]

wont work on first hit of 5D... hell for me i just say screw it and do ID after 6A hits. or GH.

[JETROCKETSKATES]

wont work on first hit of 5D...

hell for me i just say screw it and do ID after 6A hits. or GH.

I know it won't. But if I start to enter the 66 command on the first hit, will the dash then come out immediately upon the second hit's impact? This is based on the possibility that there is a margin for error in the DC, and it can still come out after the ideal point to combo into 6A.

[Spirit Juice]

I believe 6A's hitbox in CS has been improved, hence 5D DC 6A being easier in CS than CT.

[A.X.I.S.]

I know it won't. But if I start to enter the 66 command on the first hit, will the dash then come out immediately upon the second hit's impact? This is based on the possibility that there is a margin for error in the DC, and it can still come out after the ideal point to combo into 6A.

normally if you try to do that you will cancel right after...try buffering right before the second hit.

[JETROCKETSKATES]

I believe 6A's hitbox in CS has been improved, hence 5D DC 6A being easier in CS than CT.

Awesome. Hopefully, Arcsys gives us a release date soon. I have to say, I'm pretty damned psyched.

normally if you try to do that you will cancel right after...try buffering right before the second hit.

Pretty much what I was describing, minus me fumbling around with my words.

[Amadeus46Art]

I've been playing my Scrubgna in CT for a while now wihtout getting too much advice, but I'm wondering if there's someway to improve on this: CH 214A > 5B, 3C > 22C, 5B, 5C 214A 214D Does about 4k damage and it's pretty much the best I can do right now. I'm still trying to get down my double jump cancels.

[Zero000]

Uh. Can't remember CT that much, if you're mid screen, i guess you go for the dual 22c pickups so something like CH 214A > 5B, 3C > 22C, 5B, DID, fast 236 C, late 236 C, 22c (optional 5b) Go for oki instead Forgot how much damage it would do, but it should definitely do more since the 800 damage doesn't prorate in the corner, yeah, you're better off spending some meter on that or just do the combo you're doing before

[-Ladon-]

I've been playing my Scrubgna in CT for a while now wihtout getting too much advice, but I'm wondering if there's someway to improve on this:

CH 214A > 5B, 3C > 22C, 5B, 5C 214A 214D

Does about 4k damage and it's pretty much the best I can do right now. I'm still trying to get down my double jump cancels.

CH 214A-6C-GH-KA(delay)-5B-6A-air loop

can't remember proration values for CT, but that should net ~4.7-4.9k

if that's too hard do

CH 214A-6C-dash cancel-6A-air loop

[PhoenonX]

Hello everyone, I'm somewhat new to the forum, though I've been lurking for quite a while, heh.

I guess since I finally decided to join I thought I would try to see what everyones opinion of my Ragna is, and any tips on how to improve with him would be very helpful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_IHo4QI2x4

That's one of my more recent matches as of late.

[FlyingVe]

Hello everyone, I'm somewhat new to the forum, though I've been lurking for quite a while, heh.

I guess since I finally decided to join I thought I would try to see what everyones opinion of my Ragna is, and any tips on how to improve with him would be very helpful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_IHo4QI2x4

That's one of my more recent matches as of late.

Nothing looked that bad actually.

If I had to give one piece of advice it would be work on move selection. When you've already got a combo there'e no reason to risk 5C>6C. It won't combo unless they are crouching (or CH 5C) and there's just no reason to risk the damage when you can do HF or 5D. Also, 6C as a poke is fun, but in most situations 2B or 3C are faster. Lastly, the D version of ID doesn't have F1 invincibility, so you really shouldn't use it to DP people, just in combos.

[Kain]

Let's see...good defense, okay combos, good offense. The problem is, you were fighting a scrub (or someone bad with Hakumen, if you prefer). A good Haku would stuff your air approaches with 6A, which is actually a deceptive AA move, and not throw out random counters and expect it to work. Like FlyingVe says, it's best to only use 6C when it's guaranteed to combo. At best, it'll catch someone off guard (but that would mean their defense is bad) and lead into a false reset, at worst they'll block the 2 hits and whatever followup you use when it doesn't work and punish you for it. If you want a low, use 2B or 3C.

[mAc Chaos]

Hmmm, you were giving up a lot of combo opportunities... when you land a hit, you should go into a combo. So you should learn a few combos that you can do off various moves in case you land one. In that video it looked more like you were just doing random moves after some landed, which didn't combo, like at :24, you land 6B, which is good, but then give that opening away by doing 6C... which also happens to land luckily, and THEN you give THAT opening away to do Gauntlet Hades... If your opponent was better at blocking, he would have countered it, or simply blocked it and then punished you when you were recovering. There are also way better options to use than what you were using off of your hits. For instance, off 6C, I'm pretty sure you can dash cancel into a 6A > air combo, doing a bunch of good damage, instead of just Gauntlet Hades. When you fight better opponents who take off huge chunks of your life, you won't get many openings, so when you finally do get one, you have to squeeze out as much damage as you can, or you'll lose because you won't be able to match them. You also seem to like doing Inferno Divider. Did you know you can catch them on their way down after ID and keep the combo going, instead of letting them land?

[PhoenonX]

Hmmm, you were giving up a lot of combo opportunities... when you land a hit, you should go into a combo. So you should learn a few combos that you can do off various moves in case you land one. In that video it looked more like you were just doing random moves after some landed, which didn't combo, like at :24, you land 6B, which is good, but then give that opening away by doing 6C... which also happens to land luckily, and THEN you give THAT opening away to do Gauntlet Hades...

If your opponent was better at blocking, he would have countered it, or simply blocked it and then punished you when you were recovering.

There are also way better options to use than what you were using off of your hits. For instance, off 6C, I'm pretty sure you can dash cancel into a 6A > air combo, doing a bunch of good damage, instead of just Gauntlet Hades. When you fight better opponents who take off huge chunks of your life, you won't get many openings, so when you finally do get one, you have to squeeze out as much damage as you can, or you'll lose because you won't be able to match them.

You also seem to like doing Inferno Divider. Did you know you can catch them on their way down after ID and keep the combo going, instead of letting them land?

I actually did know that, yes, but in that video most of the times I landed ID I was right in a corner, and the few times I wasn't my timing is a bit of.

I'm using a 360 pad...periodically, as I'm still waiting for my SF4 TE stick to come in.

Anyways, yes i was giving up a lot of combo opportunities, i just try to overcomplicate things in my head. When I do hit with 5B from a somewhat-long distance, I usually think that there's so much more I could pull off than just a simple HF or GH, therefore I instinctually go into 5C or 6C and then try to go into a GH(Delay) 5B, ID.

[PhoenonX]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHjd8FGr684

I took a bit of everyones advice and incorporated them into a few matches, here's just one of them that I think turned out very well. I still poke with 6C every now and then but I'm now nearly as bad about it as I was.

[Zero000]

Don't rely on 5c> Hell's fang since both moves are pretty punishable if the other guy knows how to instant block ragna. It's a bad habit I built and it's pretty hard to break

[FlyingVe]

It's good to see someone report back after taking advice, then I can see if I know what I'm talking about at all . That looked even better. Random stuff to improve (though you are in no way 'bad'): 1) if you connect with 6C at max range the second hit won't connect. Thankfully you have plenty of time to hit confirm and can just do HF. 2) If you are going to RC a HF the best combo to do is HF>(RC)>dash6D>(delay)jD>dash5B>3C>22C, or a slightly worse (but much easier) HF>(RC)>3C>5D>22C. If you do either in a corner you can extend to 5D>22C for the first, and (DC)6A>5D>22C for the second. 3) I don't seen enough ragna's online use this but if you get a AA CH ID (a counter hit with ONLY the second, ariel, hit of ID) after you land dash5B>6A>5D(1hit)>GH>5B> either DID or 6A>air combo These are really all about maximizing damage. But with Ragna you really need to maximize each hit as much as possible in CT. Thank god for Berial Edge in CS.

[Prototype909]

3) I don't seen enough ragna's online use this but if you get a AA CH ID (a counter hit with ONLY the second, ariel, hit of ID) after you land dash5B>6A>5D(1hit)>GH>5B> either DID 6A>air combo

.

You can also go into an air combo off a ONE HIT ID (Don't remember if it has to be CH or not)

[-Ladon-]

when he says 2nd aerial he means the one hit ID, as landing the first hit would guarantee 2 hits.

[SuperKawaiiDesu]

D version prorates much better, and you can do it with the first hit as well via RC

[-Ladon-]

D version prorates much better, and you can do it with the first hit as well via RC

assuming you're using id as a counter hit reversal D ID is not 1st frame invuln, making it very subpar to C ID

[FlyingVe]

when he says 2nd aerial he means the one hit ID, as landing the first hit would guarantee 2 hits.

Yes, I even specified that it was only the second hit, and it must be a counter hit to do the combo because the CH keeps them from teching till they hit the ground. If it's isn't a CH do the normal ID combo. You can do a combo off CH ID (first hit) but you need to rapid cancel, and that is almost impossible to hit confirm.

[SuperKawaiiDesu]

assuming you're using id as a counter hit reversal D ID is not 1st frame invuln, making it very subpar to C ID

its still very fast and takes a primer. very gimmicky though ;p