zaeris Posted February 20, 2010 Posted February 20, 2010 Are these counterhit? I guess I never noticed since I always attempted the most damaging combos for Nu. I'd rather put that 50 Heat into a Rapid Cancel or a Counter Assault. its always been a combo and alot of people use it for unburstable damage both in ct and cs, the combo is slightly hard if you want to imagine a perfect cancel on the earliest frame from 5dd and since you would want to input cancel on the second hit of 5DD it somewhat requires you to to it anyway or hit confirm your attacks. You only CA if you're bad ^^, jk aside unburstable combo are used to prevent/avoid bursting in combo. the wrost thing that happens in matches if when people burst sending you flying and allowing them to get the momentum on you.
Firekid2 Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 So, question. I've been messing around with Nu in hopes of maining Lambda when CS comes out, and I was wondering how difficult the conversion from Nu to Lambda is. Sorry if this has been discussed before.
EndOfDreamz Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 to learn lambda you minds well learn lambda , Nu is different from lambda , wont really do you much good , well IMO it wont
kriaser Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 Learning Nu will help with the basics of Lambda, but since there's a lot of changes, you may as well only play Nu to learn beginner BnB. After that, everything has changed. From normal move properties, to range of her swords, to combos being entirely different.
zaeris Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 Learning Nu will help with the basics of Lambda, but since there's a lot of changes, you may as well only play Nu to learn beginner BnB. After that, everything has changed. From normal move properties, to range of her swords, to combos being entirely different. I strongly disagree with needing to learn Nu has many jump cancel has been remove you not going to do anything similar, her basic BnB is 5dd 236b ^^ or stuff into 236b, mind you its sucks hard damage. Any damage comes from the mind games and mix up in getting your opponent to fall for act C (236c). With regards to that you primary goal is to work around hiting them with 236c and rc combo. Other strats are AA damage, she's a harder to use character now as her damaging combo are more situation and a great deal of mind games is needed in setting it up. EDIT1: In fact not playing nu will scrub away alot of bad habbits e.g. AA with 2c... its what will get you killed lots playing as lamdba.
kriaser Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 I strongly disagree with needing to learn Nu has many jump cancel has been remove you not going to do anything similar, her basic BnB is 5dd 236b ^^ or stuff into 236b, mind you its sucks hard damage. Any damage comes from the mind games and mix up in getting your opponent to fall for act C (236c). With regards to that you primary goal is to work around hiting them with 236c and rc combo. Other strats are AA damage, she's a harder to use character now as her damaging combo are more situation and a great deal of mind games is needed in setting it up. EDIT1: In fact not playing nu will scrub away alot of bad habbits e.g. AA with 2c... its what will get you killed lots playing as lamdba. Yeah I kind of meant all that by saying "Stop before going into the intermediate stuff". I morely was just trying to get across that you should pick up Nu just to get a feel for how D swrods work, how her Distortions work (they were only slightly changed, so no real effect there), and how her movement generally works, of course not using Nu's Act Parcer. Since these things haven't changed much, it'd be better to know them going into Lambda than not. BnB hasn't entirely changed, since 5DD > 236B is basically equal to saying 5DD > 236D for Nu. It's just a different button press. Her ground based melee strings and learning TK sabers is still all the same, so learning those are useful too. After all those basic things, Lambda is completely different. Why would you NOT want to have some good knowledge on all this?
CrescentSaber Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 I agree with kriaser. I've just been using Nu to get ready for Lambda. Basically practicing the BnB drive combos and use of TK sabers and such. Since I like Lambda's playstyle much better anyway, Nu is just for me to get used to doing some of her stuff.
zaeris Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 I agree with kriaser. I've just been using Nu to get ready for Lambda. Basically practicing the BnB drive combos and use of TK sabers and such. Since I like Lambda's playstyle much better anyway, Nu is just for me to get used to doing some of her stuff. As long as it doesn't lead to bad habits. One or two things i find hard to scrub away is using 2c to AA and also the hit box and start up or 2dd and 6dd is slow and poor but if your only practicing input for Tk crescent saber its not a bad idea.
tuka Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 I think the conversion we had at the Nu discussion is better suited here, so: And isn't Lambda WAY more rushdown than Nu? Pulsr and even Minori had probably a 50/50 mix with those two. I think it's more that Lambda is lacking in the zoning field, so people are forced to get more aggressive in melee. With tackle moves and saw blade changes, it's hard to do mix ups at a range since it's pretty predictable now. Not to mention the lack of jump cancellable 5D and 4D. But if you're good with melee and aren't sword trigger happy, Lambda is going to play out just fine. Lambda can't play 100% zoning like Nu did, since taking jump cancel out of some move is like cutting her legs off, so a bit of melee is necessary. Her problem always was bad priority on normals (Nu could poke all day with her godlike 2C, which is shit now), rushing down someone randomly without putting him in some kind of blockstun first is a bad idea. Luckily Lambda has her new safe-on-block moves that also gets her really close to the opponent, so some melee pressure could be applied. I play against Bang A LOT and believe me she doesn't have even one single move with better priority than his, so the only way to beat this now S-tier guy is pure zoning. As long as you can put a character in CS under sword pressure, and Lambda while having a really harder time still can, you should be alright most of the time.
Xie Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 After skimming the thread a little, I've renamed the thread to better fit with the forum format/layout.
kriaser Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 As long as it doesn't lead to bad habits. One or two things i find hard to scrub away is using 2c to AA and also the hit box and start up or 2dd and 6dd is slow and poor but if your only practicing input for Tk crescent saber its not a bad idea. 2C was a bad AA anyway. You should of broken that habit long ago and used 6A more often. 2C won't beat out Haku or Bang jumping attacks, and it won't beat Litchi in a lot of situations. 6A on the other hand gives you head invincibility, although it's harder to time. On another note, I think 2C clashes with Tager's elbow drop but 6A beats it outright. In other words, 2C was a bad AA. Bad. It was only good because people didn't know how to effectively attack against Nu for a long while.
A.X.I.S. Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 2C was a bad AA anyway. You should of broken that habit long ago and used 6A more often. 2C won't beat out Haku or Bang jumping attacks, and it won't beat Litchi in a lot of situations. 6A on the other hand gives you head invincibility, although it's harder to time. On another note, I think 2C clashes with Tager's elbow drop but 6A beats it outright. In other words, 2C was a bad AA. Bad. It was only good because people didn't know how to effectively attack against Nu for a long while. 2C doesnt trade with elbow it outright beats it, only way elbow can beat 2C is if you mess up the timing...not hard to time IMO. another thing tager's J.B can and will clash with 2C and if you mess the timing clash with 6A.
tuka Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 Bad? 2C is BY FAAAAR Nu's best move, as a poke, as an anti-air, as everything. It's arguably one of the best moves in CT. Not only does it have mad priority (it beats most jump-ins in the game and clashes with the rest) but on counter hit it leads to ridiculous combos ranging from 5K to 7K meterless! How could you in any kind of way call it bad, is beyond me
kriaser Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 It's bad because it made people reliant. Overly reliant. When a mass majority of the Nu population do wake up 2C or are easily baited in doing a 2C to whiff, it makes it BAD imo. The move is great if used right, but when your entire game plan starts to revolve around D and C, you're missing half the tools the character has to use. It's a personal preference to me since I play against Haku a lot. I avoid using 2C as an AA because Haku and Bang beat it out with so many of their moves. Also, 2C as a poke? Sounds like a bad idea unless you're referring to 2C > act parcer/jump cancel/tk saber. I'd rather 5C mash over someone at a range during their wake up instead of try to poke them with a 2C.
tuka Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 It's bad because it made people reliant. Overly reliant. When a mass majority of the Nu population do wake up 2C or are easily baited in doing a 2C to whiff, it makes it BAD imo. The move is great if used right, but when your entire game plan starts to revolve around D and C, you're missing half the tools the character has to use. No...that just means they're bad players. And missing half the tools? Nu's entire game plan DOES revolve around C and D, do you have any good reason to use anything else when those two are so amazingly good? It's almost a year since CT is out and people still won't admit she's a two-button broken character? I'm saying that as a Nu player, she's ass broken along with Rachel and Arakune. Also, 2C as a poke? Sounds like a bad idea unless you're referring to 2C > act parcer/jump cancel/tk saber. I'd rather 5C mash over someone at a range during their wake up instead of try to poke them with a 2C. Well yeah, you just kinda described what a poke is. And I didn't say it should be used on opponents during wake up, she has better things to do.
mAc Chaos Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 2C is great, in my opinion. It beats practically everything, that's why so many people spam it. It CAN be beat, but the Nu player just has to hit 2C, while the other player has to distance and time their attack JUST right or it gets stuffed. I DO love the feeling of crushing it though. 6A on the other hand just goes through everything... I think what Keir was focusing on was the reliability of the move. It reminds me of Hakumen and Ragna's 6A. I'm noticing a pattern here for anti-airs.
kriaser Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 She's very playable as a 2 button character, or hell, even a 1 button character if you're confident in your sword spamming. That's not my point. Or the discussion. It's just my preference in a playstyle. I won't use 2C as a poke unless I used like 6A or or 2B first. I'd rather stick to the faster jabs for hit confirming/mix up options than outright goings for meaty attacks. I say 2C is a bad AA, and that's all I said. I don't like how it works as an AA and how it can be beat out in a variety of ways. In my opinion it's better to be using 6A due to the faster recovery time in the situation of your whiff, whereas 2C would likely get punished. Also, in the sense that 2C has been nerfed, you may as well stop using it excessively so that you can break the habit when CS comes around. But hey, that's my two cents.
zaeris Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 No...that just means they're bad players. And missing half the tools? Nu's entire game plan DOES revolve around C and D, do you have any good reason to use anything else when those two are so amazingly good? It's almost a year since CT is out and people still won't admit she's a two-button broken character? I'm saying that as a Nu player, she's ass broken along with Rachel and Arakune. Well yeah, you just kinda described what a poke is. And I didn't say it should be used on opponents during wake up, she has better things to do. You should note that A and B have their property. For example, Act B under the right spacing your 5a can beat peoples attempt to button and punish their attacks on block. people with poor and slow normals you can just keep poking them with 5a/2a after a block 236b. and please dont use 2c on wake up... I've had people beating on wake up since its very reactable and slow... can't wait for frame data to show me how slow it is. Before people forget this is a lamdba discussion thread and not a past reminiscent of nu, since most of nu strats do not work in bb cs and yet at the same time it is not easy mixing people up with limited options.
toanenadiz Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 Is the ghetto pressure that Lambda can generate any different than Nu's? I haven't read anything that makes it seem like Lambda's A and B moves are much different that Nu's. Edit: I just realized ghetto pressure was a term a friend came up with so you might not know it. It is using fast A and B attacks in succession to try and get a hit.
kriaser Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 The only major changes were 2C and 5C move properties (regarding normals). Using jabs has always been a solid tactic for hit confirming. You can still 2A > 2B > 2C >tk saber, for instance. I don't think any of her ground melee strings have been changed.
pulsr Posted February 24, 2010 Posted February 24, 2010 3c was changed as well and that was the most vital move she had in the bang matchup, and surpriseeeeee it is her worse matchup. Anyways regarding her normals, In CT 2c was pretty much a catch all and did everything pretty decently it anti aired it was fast enough to make the person paranoid of getting hit by it and all that good stuff. But now in CS, you'll come to realize she doesn't have that "go to" move anymore. At a certain level of play, You'll realize when and how you have to use all of her normals. The only normal that really doesn't see too much use IMHO is her j.a. Ground strings you should be using are: Pretty much anything into 6b 5c x n (well on hit at least) on block you really want to keep it tight and work around her 5b since it gives you the most freedom to move around with (chain wise) FYI V13 was probably the most fair out of the top 3, Arakune had an incredibly amount of crap to shut down all of the characters. Rachel... could kill you from a block string... three pole guard break setup? GG.
Xie Posted February 25, 2010 Posted February 25, 2010 FYI V13 was probably the most fair out of the top 3, Arakune had an incredibly amount of crap to shut down all of the characters. Rachel... could kill you from a block string... three pole guard break setup? GG. Was before punish combos did 6k imo.
tuka Posted February 25, 2010 Posted February 25, 2010 2C was Nu's "Panic Move", chances are that no matter where you pull it will be as simple as 2C = win. And calling Nu fair... Being one of the 3 gods automatically denounces that, even if you look at it from the point of only those three, she rapes Arakune's ass and has an even match (IIRC) with Rachel. Her only bad match-up was with Taokaka, and that was only 0.5 to her favor. Lambda's okay though, she's as mid-tier as it gets and her only horrible match-up is with Bang (sweet sweet irony :P).
ZONG_one Posted February 25, 2010 Posted February 25, 2010 Lambda's okay though, she's as mid-tier as it gets.. I'm not sure about this. Mid-tier, yes. But she's high mid, IMO. I mean, everyone has 4k combos and such.. but hers are easily accessible, and she has the best guard crush in the game. I'm loving her as a sub atm.
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