Farpenoodle Posted January 16, 2010 Posted January 16, 2010 From what I can tell. Drive is nearly useless against Taokaka if you throw it out of nowhere. You need to anticipate what her blockstrings are and figure out where you can place 2D/4D and 5A to hit her out of them. For example after j2D (I think?) if she mashes 2A you can use 2D to net yourself a combo. Noel's counter assault is naturally also pretty useful here. I still haven't figured the matchup out yet though and it's one of those that gives me the most trouble right now.
Tae Seong Kim Posted January 17, 2010 Posted January 17, 2010 What was beating it? I wouldn't be surprised if it's like 5D, when it takes a second before it becomes full body invincible. Did I mention that I once had 5D trade with Ragna's DP? lol I remember once I did a random 3C on Hazama and he did his flashkick super, and I beat it My friend Spark and I was testing it, and he would hit me out of it with Hakumen's 5A and 2A. We did this a bunch of times to make sure we weren't accidentally doing Bloom Trigger. We even saw the beginning start up of the move. It also traded a couple of times when Spark delayed his 5A and 2A. Now in CT it should never trade like that because Noel is still invulnerable when the Flash Kick becomes active (Start up is 8 frames, Invulnerable from frames 1 - 11).
mooyang90 Posted January 17, 2010 Author Posted January 17, 2010 Meh, a tiny loss I guess, I haven't really tried doing 623D outside of a hit-confirmed D combo. I only really do 623 D after I land a d. 6C on a crouching opponent, or for opponents who air-teched outta my drive juggle (you'll be surprised how well this works! Especially when you have them juggled in the corner and their panicking and mashing tech to get out. People forget this has anti-air properties lol) To answer the Tao match-up, it's basically the same as it was in CT. The only thing that has changed is Tao's damage, which is just ridiculous now. Luckily though, I haven't ever seen a Tao do a full 6k taunt loop on Noel. Use 2D wisely if you see them mashing that 2A. Don't be scared to try and land some 5D CH's. Keep focused on blocking her pressure. She basically has that one slow overhead that you gotta watch out for. Another thing in Noel's favor is Tao's reduced throw range and lack of a real oki game, so that's a plus. It's an even match-up IMHO, just don't try and outpoke with 5A and shit and you should be fine (Tao's normals has ours beat hands-down). You should be strictly fishing for that juicy 2D/5D CH combo. Remember, 2 combos and Tao is dead. And don't do 6C, it whiffs on Tao crouching =(
mooyang90 Posted January 17, 2010 Author Posted January 17, 2010 Updated her movelist and made the combo section more organized.
Tae Seong Kim Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 I'm gonna be stopping by my friend place on Wednesday to have a combo practice session on CS. Anything you guy had in mind to test or record?
Mizzet Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 I suggest 5d/2d 6a 6c 5c sjc9 j.d (land) 5a 5d 6a 6c 214a (land) 632146d on tager/haku/bang/taokaka. It'll be good to get that on video, leave out the distortion at the end and it does the exact same damage (3400) as the standard 5d/2d 6a 6c 214a ++ everyone uses, so it can stand on it's own. And it has the added option to combo into fenrir at the end on those characters. More importantly, it illustrates very clearly how you can extend drive combos on standing opponents by means of sjc9 j.d after (drive) 5c, which is universal and works on everyone - i don't think the jp players have picked up on this. Case in point, you go for drive mixup and land d.6b, you can't combo into 214a as they are crouching so most people just followup with 6a 6c 236d or 623d 66c, when you can do 6a 6c 5c sjc9 j.d 5a 5d 6a 6c 236d for more damage and heat.
mooyang90 Posted January 20, 2010 Author Posted January 20, 2010 I suggest 5d/2d 6a 6c 5c sjc9 j.d (land) 5a 5d 6a 6c 214a (land) 632146d on tager/haku/bang/taokaka. It'll be good to get that on video, leave out the distortion at the end and it does the exact same damage (3400) as the standard 5d/2d 6a 6c 214a ++ everyone uses, so it can stand on it's own. And it has the added option to combo into fenrir at the end on those characters. More importantly, it illustrates very clearly how you can extend drive combos on standing opponents by means of sjc9 j.d after (drive) 5c, which is universal and works on everyone - i don't think the jp players have picked up on this. Case in point, you go for drive mixup and land d.6b, you can't combo into 214a as they are crouching so most people just followup with 6a 6c 236d or 623d 66c, when you can do 6a 6c 5c sjc9 j.d 5a 5d 6a 6c 236d for more damage and heat. Testing this out first thing I hit AI tmmr. If this is true then Noel's abare just got a big upgrade...
Farpenoodle Posted January 20, 2010 Posted January 20, 2010 I might have to try it someday since comboing crouching characters in drive is still annoying. But long drive combos give my brain a big brain fart.
mooyang90 Posted January 21, 2010 Author Posted January 21, 2010 Speaking of landing drive mixups...and Noel pressure in general, I really hate the fact that opponents can just hold up back and barrier block to escape all of Noel's shit. Almost every other character has something to catch people trying to jump out of pressure, but Noel has shit. The only viable option is probably 6A, but we all know how much shit she eats if she whiffs it. So question, what are you guys doing to catch jumpers?
kro_ Posted January 21, 2010 Posted January 21, 2010 Airthrow or aerial jab string into a mixup when you land. Noel is actually decent at this because of her strong air-to-air priority at close range and damaging combos off airthrow. No one really excels at catching jumpers except Litchi with her 2c itsuuA.
DC Posted January 22, 2010 Posted January 22, 2010 Kro are you playing Noel along with Tsubaki? So question, what are you guys doing to catch jumpers? Does 5b not catch jumpers anymore? Not sure if we're talking about the same thing but 5b after 2c would usually catch people trying to jump away in Calamity Trigger atleast, then 5c 2c would bring them back to the ground.
kro_ Posted January 22, 2010 Posted January 22, 2010 A little bit since I played her a lot early on in CT. I usually play multiple characters when the game first comes out but put the focus on one at a time. Tsubaki and Rachel first. Maybe Noel and Hazama later.
Mizzet Posted January 22, 2010 Posted January 22, 2010 Just throwing this out here, but might it be possible to improve Noel's abare via jump cancel cancelling? For example you gattle whatever into 5c, jc and cancel the jump cancel into 5a or something, then you can go crazy from there. Would look like, say, 2b 5b 5c jcc 5a 6a ++ I don't know really, in the several prejump frames you are technically in a neutral state iirc, over at the Ragna boards they have shenanigans like 3c jcc Astral.
Senovit Posted January 22, 2010 Posted January 22, 2010 That ony works because you cancel the jump startup into an astral. Jump 5A would just be read as j.A, so you would not stay grounded. In theory you should be able to cancel the jump into any D move/Special/Distortion, but Noel doesn't really need to do any of that since most of her shit gatlings fine.
SuperKawaiiDesu Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 you can't cancel jump into ground normals this game would be so broken O_O
archling Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 The guide should be updated with sj.D instead of j.D. Super jumping ensures you don't whiff.
Mizzet Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Some misc. observations on comboing j.d (opponent bouncing on the ground) into 632146d j.d 632146d works fine but seems a little weird, it almost feels like there is a only small window in which j.d cancels into fenrir. Do it too early or late and you don't get the Distortion Drive. j.d 6b 632146d works as well, but opponent can tech out between j.d and 6b if the combo has gone on for some time (tested: after 4 reps of 22b 22c). j.d 623d 632146d seems to be the best option, works anywhere, on anyone afaik (Carl/Tager both ok), and opponent cannot tech out even after proration has gone to shit. 623d is sorta like Ragna's j.214c in that it inflicts a pretty brutal amount of hitstun. EDIT: Also, slight improvement to 22'less 3c bnb (assuming you don't go for haida loop). 3c 22bc 66c 5d 2d 623d 66c j.d 6d 5c 6b 236d [4377 ] 623d 66c is rather tricky in CS, so you can save it for when you got them cornered and you dont need to dash to land 6c.
mooyang90 Posted January 25, 2010 Author Posted January 25, 2010 3c 22bc 66c 5d 2d 623d 66c j.d 6d 5c 6b 236d [4377 ] Yea, I still don't really get how you land the 66c after the 623D on small and medium size characters. I see Japanese people do it all the time, but when I try I whiff completely. I can only do it when I RC =(
SuperKawaiiDesu Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 Yea, I still don't really get how you land the 66c after the 623D on small and medium size characters. I see Japanese people do it all the time, but when I try I whiff completely. I can only do it when I RC =( I really dont know what you guys are talking about. I never whiff this on carl :I
WayINside Posted January 27, 2010 Posted January 27, 2010 what is the notation for her instant kill? (didn't know it in CT too :P) and where can she combo it? i already saw R-1 connect it after a throw (instead of 214A) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDR89eRgptQ (last round)
Mizzet Posted January 27, 2010 Posted January 27, 2010 214214c On standing/grounded opponents, (drive) 6c combos into it, as does throw like you said. On airborne or basically opponents groundbounced after j.d, j.d astral, j.d 5c astral, and j.d 6d astral all work. The first of those three is the most proration dependant, it's a legit combo but becomes techable after a long combo, someone mashing tech will tech through the hit. Yet to be tested: airborne 6c hit into astral, j.d (bounce) 6b into astral.
WayINside Posted January 27, 2010 Posted January 27, 2010 On standing/grounded opponents, (drive) 6c combos into it, as does throw like you said. . by that u mean something like : D 6A 6C astral?
Mizzet Posted January 27, 2010 Posted January 27, 2010 Yup, if you're doing it from 6c that is the most common setup.
archling Posted January 27, 2010 Posted January 27, 2010 Yea, I still don't really get how you land the 66c after the 623D on small and medium size characters. I see Japanese people do it all the time, but when I try I whiff completely. I can only do it when I RC =( I start dashing when they drop about head height, and that works all the time for me.
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