Mike Z Posted January 30, 2010 Posted January 30, 2010 Moves that Fatal Counter add extra hitstun to all hits of the followup combo. Regular Counter Hit doesn't do that.
PhoenixBR Posted January 31, 2010 Posted January 31, 2010 Does anyone have a general idea when I can use the charged version of 214D-C in a combo (aside from fatal counter)? I don't know when people can tech before it and when can't. Also do counter hits generally allow more lenient combos? I just don't really understand, I came from GuiltyGear where counter hits would only modify the properties of that hit. You can always use it in your BnBs after 3C, as far as I'm concerned. It has to be fast though.
Wolf Pup TK Posted February 1, 2010 Posted February 1, 2010 Has anyone found any good uses for 236D? I feel like it might be possible to use a j.6D on CH, but my execution isn't tight enough to confirm that.
lunaris Posted February 1, 2010 Posted February 1, 2010 Has anyone found any good uses for 236D? I feel like it might be possible to use a j.6D on CH, but my execution isn't tight enough to confirm that. in the hazama complete guide section i saw someone/some people saying it was unsafe on block but i have no idea how this is the case. it's fairly easy to space out the attack(in terms of time) so that it's not easy to instant block, and it seems completely safe on normal block(maybe not if you're right next to them), especially at longer ranges. i have been thinking about trying it as an anti-jab/mash/etc. in blockstrings, especially in the corner. on midscreen CH, you can RC it(confirmable if you see them do something before you execute 236d) into any combo you can do from 4bc. 3k+, or 4.2k+ using 100% if memory serves. on corner CH 236d has an easily confirmable wallbounce which allows you to do combos nearly identical to what you would do after 3c>214d~c in the corner. i believe they also do better damage than those combos, on average. if you're close enough, you can combo straight into 236236d, which makes a good finisher for people who save burst for the last round since you can do 236d(CH)>236236d>236236d>jyakou. i'd say 6c/3c may tend to be better options, but i think 236d outranges 3c, and 6c can be punished hard if predicted. of course, there's always the option of not doing any of these things.
kazukifafner Posted February 1, 2010 Posted February 1, 2010 Just a quick question: Is there any good application of D~B, or is it pretty much useless?
Almadiel Posted February 1, 2010 Posted February 1, 2010 I use the B followup pretty often when the chain whiffs to avoid being countered. Not as fast as D, and you have to be careful about timing and spacing to avoid anti-air, but it gets you out of the way nicely, and its important to not always run away in the same direction that your chain is pointing.
ghaleon109 Posted February 1, 2010 Posted February 1, 2010 Every once and awhile 5D~B, 4/6D will work... They'll see you aproaching go for the AA and you'll get a CH chain off in the middle of the "B" follow up. Doesn't work all the time but it's fun to mix in to see if you can get a hit from it.
Almadiel Posted February 1, 2010 Posted February 1, 2010 Yeah, and worst case you can cancel D~B into a fast jDD, j8DD or even j2DD for a fast fall if you know you are about to eat an anti-air, just be sure to watch your ouroboros stock. Oh and a misc observation: His j214B has a surprisingly tall hitbox, it seems to actually be fairly effective when your opponent is above you in the air. It also seems to hit earlier at the top of the kick's arc, so it comes out fairly quick when used this way, quicker that many characters' downward hitting air normals. Might not be a totally useless move after all, though certainly situational.
testament101 Posted February 2, 2010 Posted February 2, 2010 about j.214B, I've had limited success using it on oki as a tk. It's like a one time thing though, they'll never fall for it again and there's probably way more better things that you can do on oki than that.
kazukifafner Posted February 2, 2010 Posted February 2, 2010 Oh and a misc observation: His j214B has a surprisingly tall hitbox, it seems to actually be fairly effective when your opponent is above you in the air. It also seems to hit earlier at the top of the kick's arc, so it comes out fairly quick when used this way, quicker that many characters' downward hitting air normals. Might not be a totally useless move after all, though certainly situational. I still don't see myself using it too often outside of ending combos. It just seems like there would be better options (though, the unpredictability might throw some opponents off, if anything). about j.214B, I've had limited success using it on oki as a tk. It's like a one time thing though, they'll never fall for it again and there's probably way more better things that you can do on oki than that. Well, for my main oki game, I'm currently using 2B (anticipating rolls towards me) and 5D (anticipating rolls away from me). From my experience (which, granted, isn't very much), it works better and isn't reliant on CH.
WUT Posted February 2, 2010 Posted February 2, 2010 Tk j.214b for oki? For what purpose? It's not a high, so i would assume you're using it as a throw bait or to stuff pokes. Still, I would imagine using something like 6c, or just a meaty normal would accomplish the same thing with less effort/risk. And j.214b having a higher vertical hitbox early in it's animation would lend toward it being a decent aa...if hazama wasn't already rolling in aa options (5a, 214d-> b, 2c, jakou). Probably a situational air-to-air at best if you're intent on using it outside of combos.
lunaris Posted February 2, 2010 Posted February 2, 2010 i see no reason to use j.214a as oki given what i just posted about 236d. i guess it has one advantage in that on midscreen CH it yields meterless damage, but it is unsafe on block at most spacings and probably always unsafe on instant block. as to j.214a as an anti-air: if i understand you correctly, if they decide to block, hitting them with the top of the kick simply adds more to their already considerable frame advantage. it's risky at best and i don't think it would counter anything that hazama's other anti air counters wouldn't(and for far less risk). i've tried to think of some uses for it myself but all i can come up with is either a meterless shoryu punisher(depending on its proration) or an air-to-ground attack vs characters who don't have many good means of punishing it at its max range(arakune?).
kazukifafner Posted February 5, 2010 Posted February 5, 2010 I hope I don't sound stupid for posting this, but I think I'm finally working out the multiple D~A combos. Outside of the FC air combos, you can usually get two to combo on the ground from a distance (and sometimes even j6D~A > 5D~A if you are close enough to the ground when you use j6D), but I've noticed that you can usually chain more if you are at the edge of the "close/far" line. I was fighting Tager when I used 5D to counter his 2D. He was fairly close to me, but far enough to be considered "far" in terms of the chains. I was then able to use 5D~A four times in a row. I don't know if this is possible with the other characters yet.
g.Bauer Posted February 5, 2010 Posted February 5, 2010 I seriously can't do 66 > C with hazama... It's always 66 > 6C. I feel my combos are getting screwed because of it. 3C > 214D~C > 66 > C arrrrghhhh Any tips for a scrub? =/
Klaige Posted February 5, 2010 Posted February 5, 2010 I seriously can't do 66 > C with hazama... It's always 66 > 6C. I feel my combos are getting screwed because of it. 3C > 214D~C > 66 > C arrrrghhhh Any tips for a scrub? =/ I had a big problem with this too at first. When you do your dash make sure you let the stick go back to neutral before you press C. If you try to press it too early you will basically buffer a dash cancel of 6C instead of C. Basically you have more time to hit C than you think, so try delaying it a bit more and it should be a 5C instead of a 6C. I have notoriously bad execution and got it down fairly quickly, it's just a quirky input, but once you get it, it's pretty easy.
fossil Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 So what have you guys been doing in terms of resets? I know I've seen Zakiyama go from j.C x N > land reset into 623D. I have also begun to use this when the opponent is in the corner ... > 3C > 214D~C > 5C > 2C > 4D~A > dash forward ( puts me into corner ) reset into 623D > 2B > 5C > 2C > etc.
ghaleon109 Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 Not really a reset... But after a Jakou you can jump straight up and j.6D. If they tech roll it'll catch them in a floating position and you can pull yourself in with D then follow up with 5C, 2C, 4D~ect
Darksoul173 Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 What are some combo options after mid-screen236236B [6D~A]xN 623D? I know about the 632146C but what are some other options (I know about that Zakiyama combo with the jump 6D~D... but i can't get the timing for it)
Dangle Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 What are some combo options after mid-screen236236B [6D~A]xN 623D? I know about the 632146D but what are some other options (I know about that Zakiyama combo with the jump 6D~D... but i can't get the timing for it) depending on how close you are to the corner and how much heat you have, if dash 2B, 5C... isn't viable you can dash 3C 236236B, if i'm not close enough i usually just go for the 214D~C combo instead of 6D~AxN
Darksoul173 Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 depending on how close you are to the corner and how much heat you have, if dash 2B, 5C... isn't viable you can dash 3C 236236B, if i'm not close enough i usually just go for the 214D~C combo instead of 6D~AxN Isn't the damage potential better from 6D~AxN? i mean with full meter you can go from 6000+ and i saw Zakiyama doing around the 5900
ghaleon109 Posted February 8, 2010 Posted February 8, 2010 Timing is very strict on the 6D~A follow up, and you have to have another 50% meter once the dashing 3C hits or else you won't be able to follow up with anything else. It is nice though because they can't burst during the 6D~A's... well they can.. but it would be stupid.. The 214D~C follow up is much easier although I'm not sure on the damage compaired to the other follow up. (without using another 50% meter) You can also get stopped via a burst easier doing this follow up...
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