GG:AC Official Tier List Thread

[Hellmonkey]

Many thanks to POScrub for doing something Hellmonkey won't.

He probably does it better than me anyways.

[render]

POScrub's translations are excellent, and doubtlessly take a non-trivial amount of his personal time. Please stop complaining that "(insert character) isn't done yet!". Thanks for the hard work, POScrub! :D

[Mr. Mamation]

thanks a lot for the updates POscrub

[Greed]

LOLOL I love these guys' opinion of Chipp.

They pretty much rank him from C to E-... generally on the very lowest of all the tier lists.

Sob. Except for this one guy who ranks Chipp as B, but his S-tier is Baiken and his E-tier is Venom..and some guy who classes Chipp as A and Axel as S. o.o.

Anyways, without further ado:

Chipp Zanuff

• Average Damage D: Has huge air time with triple jumping, but not much damage despite that. CH from 6HS is the best combo starter.
• Max Damage D: Use tension freely to lengthen out your gatlings. Possibly the best wakeup priority, but no follow-up.
• Pokes A: Hard to read, with high mobility, he's got moves that are hard to judge and react to, a far-reaching dust, and alpha/gamma blades are incredible for mid-distance.
• Pressure/Lockdown A: Take advantage of his speed and variety of pokes.
• Mixup B: Make use of his pokes and invisibility to mix up with 6K and j.HS and you'll eventually get through.
• Okizeme B+: If you time your j. HS right just overhead, it's difficult to cope with the crossups.
• Against Ground A: Well-judged j. HS and j. D. Can destroy turtling players with jumping crossovers. Shuriken.
• Against Air B: Beta blade, 6p, and well-judged 6HS give high return.
• Breaking out of Pressure B: Use invisibility, Beta blade FRC, and triple jump to create distance.
• Defense E--: Dies very quickly. Don't relax until your opponent's HP is 0.
• In neutral situations A: Use his unmatched mobility, great pokes, and pressure to win without taking any damage. ...actually, if you don't do that, you lose.
• Overall Rank: C-
• Good matchup(s): There are no opponents with a 6:4 matchup in Chipp's favor.
• Bad matchups: Slayer, Potemkin, Jam. Anyone who deals high damage.

...I don't know if I agree with the lack of good matchups o.o

Millia and Dizzy at the least are just rape-fests.

[Tiamat]

I would like to revise the Anji one because it's old and also because it has too many references to slash, should be more focused on how he is here and now as a character [ANJI] [Tiamat] Pro * good anti-pressure/okizeme options with autoguards and 236H's invincible frames, allows him to escape some unblockables on wakeup that almost no one others can, among other things * he has a versatile variety of autoguard special attacks. P for anti air, K has lower body invincibility and good horizontal range, D force break not that useful but has sick priority, and an overdrive as well * good okizeme pressure, possible unblockables with Shitsu force break * good corner pressure * very good normals in general both on the ground and in the air * one of the best air throws in the game * air mobility is great due to an amazing super jump and the ability to use jD to brake jumps to make air movements more unpredictable Con * needs 25% meter minimum to do decent damage most of the time, damage not spectacular by any means * often has to give up significant damage to maintain knockdown in combos * overly reliant on corner for pressure and combos *mix up options generally low reward without satisfying another condition. his overheads either need shitsu or a RC to allow for combos and his throw is weak * autoguarding moves are fewer and less useful despite having a much more versatile set of special moves from autoguard * 5S does not raise guard meter on block at all, not spectacular at raising guard * midscreen pressure is rather weak * generally weak spacing game, trouble getting in against several characters * cannot make you dizzy to save his life * guard meter easily jacked up * horrible DAA, usually trades with the next hit of their blockstring so you will often take damage for using this even if it hits * backdash sucks, horrible recovery and not many invulnerable frames * zero (?) advantageous matchups, some matchups are heavily against him If you would edit the first post by replacing the old list with this one I'd appreciate it.

[Darkhonor90]

LOLOL I love these guys' opinion of Chipp.

They pretty much rank him from C to E-... generally on the very lowest of all the tier lists.

Sob. Except for this one guy who ranks Chipp as B, but his S-tier is Baiken and his E-tier is Venom..and some guy who classes Chipp as A and Axel as S. o.o.

Anyways, without further ado:

Chipp Zanuff

• Average Damage D: Has huge air time with triple jumping, but not much damage despite that. CH from 6HS is the best combo starter.
• Max Damage D: Use tension freely to lengthen out your gatlings. Possibly the best wakeup priority, but no follow-up.
• Pokes A: Hard to read, with high mobility, he's got moves that are hard to judge and react to, a far-reaching dust, and alpha/gamma blades are incredible for mid-distance.
• Pressure/Lockdown A: Take advantage of his speed and variety of pokes.
• Mixup B: Make use of his pokes and invisibility to mix up with 6K and j.HS and you'll eventually get through.
• Okizeme B+: If you time your j. HS right just overhead, it's difficult to cope with the crossups.
• Against Ground A: Well-judged j. HS and j. D. Can destroy turtling players with jumping crossovers. Shuriken.
• Against Air B: Beta blade, 6p, and well-judged 6HS give high return.
• Breaking out of Pressure B: Use invisibility, Beta blade FRC, and triple jump to create distance.
• Defense E--: Dies very quickly. Don't relax until your opponent's HP is 0.
• In neutral situations A: Use his unmatched mobility, great pokes, and pressure to win without taking any damage. ...actually, if you don't do that, you lose.
• Overall Rank: C-
• Good matchup(s): There are no opponents with a 6:4 matchup in Chipp's favor.
• Bad matchups: Slayer, Potemkin, Jam. Anyone who deals high damage.

...I don't know if I agree with the lack of good matchups o.o

Millia and Dizzy at the least are just rape-fests.

Thats defintely wrong in the terms of damage and matchups!

Chipp can get easy 30% combo off of a simple poke into down dust>236S>HS>IAD etc etc

Off of a CH J.D he can get 60% easy.

J.HS Alpha Blade FRC combos do 50% easy.

Chipp gets good damage from almost any situation he gets a hit

IN terms of matchups i would imagine characters like Eddie,Ky,Anji,Dizzy,Johnny,Ino and a few others. Thats what I think. Anyone wanna correct me?

[CrimsonDisaster]

The problem is that while Chipp has all the tools in the world, everybody needs one "lucky" hit and it's ggpo. And "lucky" hits happen fairly often. Like, say what you want about how Chipp can dominate Eddie, but Eddie needs to make you block once and you probably just lost.

[Brent-quest]

LOLOL I love these guys' opinion of Chipp.

Chipp Zanuff

[*]Breaking out of Pressure B: Use invisibility,

lol wut? ReversaL Find Me... WHERE'D HE GO!

[POscrub]

Ky Kiske:

• Average Damage D: Worst class. Two of his best combo starters [connect often], Throw FRC and Greed Sever suffer from forced prorate, and on top of that, a lot of his moves lower the guard bar a lot on hit.
• Max Damage D: 25% meter for less than 40% damage. You can get a decent combo off of a connected 2D, and HS stun edge FRC into ground gatling does decent damage.
• Pokes A: f.S, 2S, 5H, 2D, Ky has lots of effective pokes, plus he's got lots of projectiles. However, gets only low damage off connected pokes.
• Pressure/Lockdown B+: HS Stun Edge FRC, Stun Dipper FRC, FB Lightning Sphere, while all these options are require tension, Ky is pretty efficient at using his tension, so it's not so much of an issue.
• Mixup C: Ky's overheads are a little easy to block on reaction, so crossup/noncrossup 50/50 mixed with Throw forms the basis of Ky's mixups. Dust has decent startup and good reach.
• Okizeme B+: Stun Rays controls a lot of valuable real estate. From there, you can either mixup or go for pressure/lockdown as you please.
• Against ground B: Hitting with the tip of j. HS is low risk, but also has low payoff. If you use meter, laying down an air Stun Edge FRC and coming in right behind it is pretty effective.
• Anti air S: Up there competing with Faust and Axl for best AA in the game. Many different AA options, all with their own weaknesses, but all having a specific use. Ky can generate knockdowns pretty easily off his AA's, which counts in his favour.
• Breaking out of pressure B: 2P is quick and effective for mashing out pressure. Vapour Thrust is pretty easy to dodge with low profile moves, but Rising Javelin FRC helps to mitigate the risk somewhat.
• Defense B: Normal defensive modifier, but thanks to his weird hitbox, can be difficult to combo
• In general A: Plenty of safe effective attacks and options, but the returns are also low.
• Overall rank B: Mid to upper mid tier. very stable character, but is quite reliant on having tension.
• Good matchups: Anji, Johnny, Bridget, Dizzy
• Bad matchups: Baiken, Venom

[Greed]

Chipp gets good damage from almost any situation he gets a hit

IN terms of matchups i would imagine characters like Eddie,Ky,Anji,Dizzy,Johnny,Ino and a few others. Thats what I think. Anyone wanna correct me?

Yeah, but the timing's so tight that the player has to really, really be able to react fast enough to pull a combo out of his ass when a poke actually connects, or you end up with ending up with a 20 dmg poke =(. Happens all too often when you're a scrub like me.

I-no's a good matchup for Chipp, the others are pretty even, sadly.

lol wut? ReversaL Find Me... WHERE'D HE GO!

I know, I lol'd when I read that too :D. I *think* he means going into Find Me before they start their pressure string

[AtTheGates]

Thats defintely wrong in the terms of damage and matchups!

Chipp can get easy 30% combo off of a simple poke into down dust>236S>HS>IAD etc etc

Off of a CH J.D he can get 60% easy.

J.HS Alpha Blade FRC combos do 50% easy.

Chipp gets good damage from almost any situation he gets a hit

IN terms of matchups i would imagine characters like Eddie,Ky,Anji,Dizzy,Johnny,Ino and a few others. Thats what I think. Anyone wanna correct me?

about damage: chipp has bad abare. it's a fact. you have certain situations where you can deal nice damage, but they have to be planned, unlike many other chars (slayer: oh i just hit nevermind lets do an air combo LOL)

matchups:

do you mean good or bad matchups?

dizzy is probably the best matchup for chipp, she has no chance. i-no should have a hard time because of movement & 6p. i don't know shit about the anji matchup but i never thought about it being particularly good or bad. johnny sucks for chipp, but that's just my oppinion - 5k will fuck you up badly, & johnny can hop under jumpins, then 5k.

[AKA]

You mean like your "Wicked Witch of the West" setup? Yeah that's right, I haven't forgotten about that pimp shit.

Wow, where'd you get THAT time machine? Can I have one too?

[reaVer]

Like, say what you want about how Chipp can dominate Eddie, but Eddie needs to make you block once and you probably just lost.

Then you have severe defense issues...

[Hellmonkey]

Baiken:

• Average damage C: General combo does about 30% of the opponents life. More importantly than the damage, her combos give her knockdowns and momentum in the match.
• Max damage D: Her best damage she actually gets is off standing dust, which does up to 50% of the opponents life. This is fairly low maximum damage for AC.
• Pokes B: 2S, j.S, and tatami are abnormally good pokes, but generally she doesn't get much off of them.
• Escaping Pressure S: She is strongest in this by a large margin. She has many options to escape with her guard cancels.
• Mixup options B-: TK youzansen is very hard to react to, but she has to spend 50% for it. Youzansen FRC is strong but very difficult, either one is good at keeping pressure on.
• Pressure/Lockdown B-: From midscreen it is impossible. Using tatami FRC has many problems. In the corner, though, her pressure is quite good.
• Okizeme B: The changes to j.D make it much better in Okizeme than before. Starting from the corner her Oki is very strong.
• Against ground S: j.S, tatami FRC, j.HS all have great priority against ground. Similar to ABA's, her moves are strong against characters on the ground.
• Against air A+: An early S is good but there isn't usually much you can do with it. 6P is simply good.
• Defense E+: 5 guts but has one of the worst 3 defense modifiers.
• General situations S: With the addition of Ouren covering 70% of the screen and her other counter options, she can turn the match easily if the player can read the opponent well.
• Overall Rank S (lol)
• Good matchups: Generally she is good against characters that can't deal a ton of damage.
• Bad matchups: Potemkin, Sol, Slayer

Generally she is good against characters that can't deal a ton of damage.

^ I lol'd because he calls her S and most characters have ways of doing tons of damage in this game

Also, POScrub I don't think "in neutral situations" is a very good translation for 立ち回り. Especially since Baiken's counters are being mentioned for her in that category, I think that "general situations" or something similar would be more accurate.

I also shamelessly stole most of your formatting and wording, made my life a little easier. You forgot to add some of the letter ranks for some of Potemkin's parts.

[GreasyGyro718]

All of this is just that one persons opinion though, right? The SRK tier list (I'm guessing) is a combination and an average of professional Japanese players tier lists. Just wanna know if this one is actually "official".

[Hellmonkey]

No, this is one person's attempt to take the ideas from previous threads which discussed these rankings and put them togheter. Chances are he just took the most recent/most agreed upon rankings for each seperate character.

[CrimsonDisaster]

Then you have severe defense issues...

I'm such a scrub, I can't block unblockables, even though I block like 95% of all non-unblockable Eddie mixups! I'm such a scrub that I can't do anything but sit back and block while stuck in perpetual blockstun! I'm such a scrub that dizzy combos actually dizzy me! Man I have severe defense issues!

Oh wait I forgot, you're psychic so you apparently also block unblockables every time and also apparently you receive less blockstun and take less damage. Sometimes I forget that you have severe "I don't know wtf I'm talking about because I never play anybody who actually plays their characters correctly" issues.

[render]

goddamnit, there are no official tier lists. EVERY tier list is based on speculation and conjectures. Props to teh xlators.

[Hellmonkey]

I'm such a scrub, I can't block unblockables, even though I block like 95% of all non-unblockable Eddie mixups! I'm such a scrub that I can't do anything but sit back and block while stuck in perpetual blockstun! I'm such a scrub that dizzy combos actually dizzy me! Man I have severe defense issues!

Oh wait I forgot, you're psychic so you apparently also block unblockables every time and also apparently you receive less blockstun and take less damage. Sometimes I forget that you have severe "I don't know wtf I'm talking about because I never play anybody who actually plays their characters correctly" issues.

You realize that most of Eddie's better block strings require you at some point to be stuck in both hits of [k] without anything in between, and that it is escapable right? Saying that Eddie making Chipp block usually leads to Chipp's death would only apply to a Chipp that has no idea of how to escape pressure. Chipp has an SRK, a long backdash (sometimes more important than a fast one), quick moves to beat out or at least trade with little eddie, and should he get into the air plenty of options to escape. It would be accurate to say that Chipp will probably die if he gets hit on the ground into a confirmable combo when he doesn't have a burst and Eddie has tension.. that's about it. Chipp actually has a fairly easy time dealing with Eddie because he has movement options to deal with little Eddie from just about anywhere on the screen. That match is heavily in Chipp's favor until he gets hit.

goddamnit, there are no official tier lists. EVERY tier list is based on speculation and conjectures.

Props to teh xlators.

nuh-uh, mine is right!

[reaVer]

I'm such a scrub, I can't block unblockables, even though I block like 95% of all non-unblockable Eddie mixups! I'm such a scrub that I can't do anything but sit back and block while stuck in perpetual blockstun! I'm such a scrub that dizzy combos actually dizzy me! Man I have severe defense issues!

Oh wait I forgot, you're psychic so you apparently also block unblockables every time and also apparently you receive less blockstun and take less damage. Sometimes I forget that you have severe "I don't know wtf I'm talking about because I never play anybody who actually plays their characters correctly" issues.

I think you casually insulted quite a few here at dustloop with that last statement:o

Yeah, unblockables are actually very easy to block: just jump and guard. What's so hard about that? Hmm? Alternatively you could reversal uppercut or with some characters OD depending on which one he's using. And yeah, I indeed do catch less blockstun, impact guarding ftw or slashback ftw! And taking less damage, well, I do play OS you know...

[Hellmonkey]

You can't jump out of any of the unblockables timed correctly, actually. You can, however reversal backdash or uppercut against all of them, although backdashes will simply go into the puddle if set correctly and it is practically impossible if he crosses up as he hits. You can backdash the iad unblockable to at the least take a hit and tech because you get hit in the air. You can backdash the 22D unblockable but unless you are near the edge of the hitbox of the 22D you are still going to get caught by a hit or two from it (although because you will be further you might not get hit by a second one which normally would have worked and therefore escape, or you might be too far to get the followup combo if you are too far/high especially if he doesn't expect it) If you are blocking the puddle unblockable- try to make sure you block the puddle first if it looks like he might be mistiming at all with his jump in (obviously block high first or attempt a 1F jump if the puddle is late and the air hit looks late) Chances are he won't get anything besides his jumping move if you block the puddle as he would have to instantly react to 5P/2D or something else fast into 2D to get a knockdown and he still wouldn't have eddie meter. SRK against the puddle unblockable from the front will escape 100% of the time if he is too high to get a meaty and land. If he is too low he can land, block, and punish although it might be less damage than if you took the unblockable and you can RC/FRC to prevent the punish. If he crosses you up at the right time it is almost impossible to get a reversal uppercut against it, I've never seen anyone get it. A reversal uppercut will beat the drill FRC iad unblockable, but if he doesn't do the iad depending on your srk/super you will either eat the drill or give him a free punish. I think placed correctly there are no fully invincible supers or uppercuts that will escape the 22D unblockable, everything will end up in the drill hitbox before invincibility ends. (Maybe Zappa's or HOS's are long enough?)

[reaVer]

You can jump it if you're in the guarding situation, I've seen lots of players do that(including KZO and kaqn vs Ogawa). Only when you actually ate a hit and you're lying on the ground you're stuck with shenanigans.

[Hellmonkey]

Oh, you mean after a 5HS -> 22D with [D]? Yeah, that is blockable, but depending on when he does [D], the [D] can actually land before you are able to get a jump off, so you would HAVE to block high for the [D] and immediately block low for the drill, which is fucking hard. Otherwise, if it is coming later you can IB the last 5HS hit and jump block the 22D.

[Greed]

Chipp actually has a fairly easy time dealing with Eddie because he has movement options to deal with little Eddie from just about anywhere on the screen.

There's nothing like taking out little Eddie with a shuriken to make your day a little brighter :D

Alternatively you could reversal uppercut or with some characters OD depending on which one he's using.

...like Banki Messai?

It's great because nobody sees it coming, and then all they can do is just sit there for 6 seconds in disgust and lol at the 90 damage.

[CrimsonDisaster]

If your only option is to uppercut/move with lots of full-body invul (many characters lack this) or to reversal backdash (which gets hit anyway in most situations), I'm failing to see how that makes Eddie pressure this porous, "you're only stuck if you suck at defense" kind of thing. And is it absolutely necessary to pick up those escape options to deal with Eddie at some point? Of course. Does saying "oh I saw kaqn do it against Ogawa this one time" make it any more likely to happen against an Eddie player who mixes up his timings/setups? There are very few absolutely hopeless situations in any given match, there's always some kind of option- but against a good Eddie, it's picking between bad and awful. For every time you guess correctly or execute your escape tactic, there's another time where Eddie baits it, or catches you asleep, or just blows meter to guarantee his setup. And then there's all the qualifiers like "if Eddie doesn't place/time his puddle/drill/etc. correctly" which is just a more nuanced way of saying "if Eddie screws up." What if Eddie doesn't screw up? I will say that even a really technically sound Eddie will make those kinds of mistakes every few rounds or so. But if they're only making that kind of mistake every like... 5-6 rounds or so, and you're in a tournament situation... I realize that the current top Eddies in the States are noted more for smarts or the ability to fix technical mistakes than for their ability to not make technical mistakes (which are probably more important skills in a tournament setting anyhow) but saying "I saw a video of kaqn getting out of Ogawa's setup this one time" is a whole lot different from getting out of Ogawa's setups yourself. It's also great to not mention all the other matches where kaqn got raped for getting touched once, or completely failed to escape an unblockable.