GG:AC Official Tier List Thread

[ky0n01]

[19:40] <A> venom has some very strong anti-air

[19:40] <A> so

[19:40] <B> yes

[19:41] <A> you'll get advantages if the opponent is in the air even though venom doesn't have advantage of grand battle

[19:41] <A> but if this sentence is passive voice

[19:41] <B> So maybe they mean Venom's grand battle (pool ball zoning everywhere on the screen) wants to force them into the air so he can AA them or force them to the ground with AA.

[19:42] <A> then that means venom has to be in the air

[19:42] <B> Hm true.

[19:42] <A> coz you can't win grand battle

[19:43] <B> Odd worded sentence. ww

[19:43] <A> nn~

[19:43] <A> i don't know venom well

[19:43] <B> Yeah, me too.

[19:43] <B> So it is diffuclt to say what the author is saying.

[19:43] <A> but i often see jumping venom

[19:43] <A> so it can be both meaning

Part of a chat log between me and a Japanese friend. His English isn't the best (but very decent), so it may be difficult for him to word it in English. However, I think we got the general idea the sentence is trying to say. BTW, my friend is A and I am B, in case you get confused.

I hope this helps.

One of venom's main strategy is to bait characters to air dash/ jump. If they try to air dash towards you, you have the option to 6P or grab em(if they expect 6P from you theyll be in FD state) or a crossup.

[Spirit Juice]

One of venom's main strategy is to bait characters to air dash/ jump. If they try to air dash towards you, you have the option to 6P or grab em(if they expect 6P from you theyll be in FD state) or a crossup.

This I already know, but the subject of the conversation happened to be discussing a scenario when are balls flying everywhere (no homo) for space control. I came to that conclusion after the words "grand battle" came up. 6P AA or air throw (though 6P is much more effective and efficient since that move is practically unbeatable from the air) are common responses to air dashes already, although if there are slow moving balls flying about the screen, it gives the opponent little room to IAD or jump in at Venom. With that information, I think it's safe to assume that when there's balls controlling space of the screen, Venom has a lot of options that are heavily in his favor.

[ky0n01]

btw thx 4 translating this stuff :D

[Wirya]

@POscrub : By "defense", what did you mean? The damage modifier of the character, or the defense capability of the character (having shoryuken, good backdash, etc)? I think it'd be much better if you used the 2nd meaning. And, by the 2nd meaning, Chipp couldn't have that bad defense. He has a shoryuken, a decent backdash, etc.

[tataki]

@POscrub :

By "defense", what did you mean? The damage modifier of the character, or the defense capability of the character (having shoryuken, good backdash, etc)? I think it'd be much better if you used the 2nd meaning. And, by the 2nd meaning, Chipp couldn't have that bad defense. He has a shoryuken, a decent backdash, etc.

"getting out of pressure"

[Hellmonkey]

@POscrub :

By "defense", what did you mean? The damage modifier of the character, or the defense capability of the character (having shoryuken, good backdash, etc)? I think it'd be much better if you used the 2nd meaning. And, by the 2nd meaning, Chipp couldn't have that bad defense. He has a shoryuken, a decent backdash, etc.

It is the character's defense, read what the Baiken one said.

Note how there is also a category for breaking out of pressure.

[tataki]

B-rank for mixups even though all it states is just having a fast dust?

Does that mean that dust is the ultimate mixup:psyduck:

unlike jam's dust, RK's dust is very easy to block on reaction cuz of the animation which makes it not as good. (play vs rk and jam players and you'll see for yourself)

this guy knows what he's talking about.

[AtTheGates]

unlike jam's dust, RK's dust is very easy to block on reaction cuz of the animation which makes it not as good. (play vs rk and jam players and you'll see for yourself)

this guy knows what he's talking about.

that's debatable. jam's dust looks a lot like her 6hs now, and the pause feels kind of the same - if you condition yourself to slashback or instant block her 6hs you should have an easier time with 5d, at least i do.

[tataki]

my point was more towards robo having a unique dust animation which is very easy to react to, even though it's fast.

[Digital Watches]

my point was more towards robo having a unique dust animation which is very easy to react to, even though it's fast.

Even so, once you've played Jam enough, you KNOW what the animation looks like. It's something you can condition yourself to do. A reaction time of >17 frames when your default blocking mode is low is something that's MUCH harder to learn, and is never a guaranteed thing.

[POscrub]

In case anyone was wondering about what Spirit Juice said:

Grand battle is actually a typo, it's supposed to be Ground Battle.

Like Grand Viper vs. Ground Viper. Just to clear that up.

Speed job, no proofing done.

Axl Low:

• Average Damage A: Eating one of his long range pokes easily results in 30%, combos off his throw does decent damage too.
• Max Damage A+: Corner Baku combo [Axl Bomber loop] makes the lifebar drop drop drop.
• Pokes S+: Axl's pokes have longest reach in the game, and compared to certain stretchy limbed Indian, are fast and have a small hitbox
• Pressure/Lockdown C: Axl pressure is pretty decent if he corners with meter, but his pressure tends to be predictable and reliant on meter.
• Mixup C-: Well, if you average things out, his mixups aren't completely hopeless, if you count his corner stuff
• Okizeme C+: At any rate, Axl does big damage if he hits, in the corner, meaty j. S into mixup is difficult to block on reaction. [Ed. note: I don't play Axl, probably either Bomber, or land and low?]
• Against ground D: j. S has long reach but has weak priority, isn't very fast either, Axl isn't a character who should rely on jump ins much.
• Antiair S: Rivals Faust and Ky for best turtle/defensive AA in the game. Nothing beats 2S, because you get AA'd well before you even start your jump attack.
• Breaking out of Pressure B+: 2F startup Housoubako (counter) [2-16 anything you can block standing gets countered] and 4F startup Bentengari (DP) [s benten listed in mook as 5F startup, invincible above the feet, H benten is way slower]. Easy to get these attacks out, but are weak to low profile lows attacks.
• Defense C-: Lousy hitbox, Axl is pretty easy to combo
• In general S: Axl is extremely good at controlling space, his moves altogether covers about 70% of the screen.
• Overall Rank A-
• Good matchup Anji: Matchup is laughably bad for Anji.
• Bad matchup Venom: Feels even worse than Slayer.

[BagLunch]

• Max Damage A: Eating one of his long range pokes easily results in 30%, combos off his throw does decent damage too.

Should be Average Damage

[Spirit Juice]

POscrub, I went back and edited my post to note the typo. Just an FYI.

[Henaki]

lol chains arent completely invulnerable :/ you can 6p him out of j.S from weird ass places all the time. i'd still put him at S+ though (since hes still got the best pokes!)

[Vicioso]

i cant believe sol is ranked so low...

[koogy]

i cant believe sol is ranked so low...

Well, he is still a pretty good character. He's just ... average. That is his character design, you know? He doesn't have the bullshit Testament, Slayer, Eddie, or the others have.

[Brent-quest]

Your avatars never cease to impress me koogy. But yeah Sol does seem to very a lot in tiers depending on who you ask. Sure he's got VV and strong combos, but has a hard time with pretty much anybody with space control and better pokes.

[EasyModeNub]

Sol really is just kinda average when you think about it. He's not a low tier char though, definitely. He just has an answer to most situations is the nice thing about him... but he really is only mid or upper mid tier.

[Tiamat]

I think a big reason Sol is ranked so low is because there aren't any really stellar Sol players right now. Isa's main is Eddie now too I think, not to mention his questionable dragon install use and PC is still playing slash Sol or something. why is Testament #1 on the list now?

[Spirit Juice]

It's not really the fact that there are no stellar Sol players right now, but it's due to the fact that Sol's character design is flawed. In Accent Core, Sol doesn't have anything that seperates him from the higher tiered cast. His pokes are average, his mix up is average, and his average damage is slightly above average, and his highest damaging combos quickly reach their threshhold in most situations (jacking up the guard bar is pretty hard now that GF doesn't do guard meter build up). Overall he's still a very solid character, but he doesn't have anything that he excels in. Sol is just average all around, pretty much. I definitely agree with what was said about him.

[POscrub]

Henaki: Yeah, I should probably stay away from making editorial comments about characters I don't play eh? Removed. The original grades for a lot of the characters were higher (like the original template for Sol had A average and max damage, Jam originally S tier, etc.), but that resulted in too many characters having S,A, and B ranks. So to a certain extent, some of the lower grades are a result of normalization.

[Koichi>All]

I think another problem with sol besides being just average in almost everything is that he's good only at close range, so he has to take more risks to get in than most of the cast, I guess thats why he loses a lot, it's different from Ky wich is average too but is at least decent at any range so he don't need to take too much risks trying to get in, but he does less damage than sol. my god, my english sux

[Chomite]

...gunflame FRC? That covers quite a lot of distance...

[Koichi>All]

yeah, gf frc is good and the only almost safe way for sol to get in, though you don't have infinite tension

[koogy]

Sol is simply average, as Spirit Juice put it.