Rhiya Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 why are you trying to make DL figure anything out someone posted about mirror matches being 6-4, that enough should tell you something Besides you being completely oblivious to the last 20 pages?
Klaige Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 Did we not just confirm that these charts are not based on statistics? Also there is no inflammatory notion in my post, so cool your jets. My friday comedy quota is officially reached.
KayEff Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 naw mayn, it's cool yo, you dun hafta be all aggressive and shit, we just discussin'
Remiri Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 (edited) Glad I could be of service. But srsly no one is sitting there running 100 matches for these opinion-based charts, so claiming that a .5 value makes it more accurate sounds like contrived bullshit to me. EDIT: also the basis of my post was in response to the matchup chart being based on rounds, so that being erroneous sorta puts my previous points in a moot status. Edited November 5, 2010 by Remiri
Spirit Juice Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 Hey guys here's a diagram of a REAL JAPANESE TIER LIST straight from ARCADIA but I guess they're retards cus they didn't calculate all the 6-4, 7-3, and even 5-5 mirror matches. In all seriousness, I don't see the point in this thread anymore. It's been proven in this thread that the community can't handle a thread like a match up chart thread. In other words, people are going to argue over stupid, small details, and people cannot grasp the concept that, in general, match up charts influence tier lists. This will be the last BB match up chart thread DL will see. Thanks for the charts you made, worldjem, and thanks to those that helped make the St1ckbug chart that was 100% correct but wasn't really. Unfortunately, DL cannot handle something like a match up chart; it's just a little too complex for our brains. In the future, we may have a tier list thread similar to the GG one we had forever ago, but we won't have one until the dust settles a bit (Arcadia should be releasing one soon, I'd imagine, since SBO is now over). I'm going to leave the thread open for a bit more so people can have some closing discussions, but this does not mean LOL FREE TROLLING TIME. Trolling and stupid posts will result in infractions.
ZONG_one Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 until the dust settles a bit I see what you did tharrr.
Klaige Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 Glad I could be of service. But srsly no one is sitting there running 100 matches for these opinion-based charts, so claiming that a .5 value makes it more accurate sounds like contrived bullshit to me. EDIT: also the basis of my post was in response to the matchup chart being based on rounds, so that being erroneous sorta puts my previous points in a moot status. So timing something in whole seconds as opposed to tenths of a second is more accurate? Measuring by whole cups instead of halfs, thirds, or fourths is more accurate? You do realize that what you just said is like failing early middle school math right? How hard is the concept of, numbers with a decimal are going to be more precise than rounded numbers? Stay 5th grade dustloop.
Spirit Juice Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 I see what you did tharrr. It wasn't intentional when I first started typing it. When I finished the sentence, I kinda lol'd to myself at the unintentional pun and left it in.
Remiri Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 (edited) So timing something in whole seconds as opposed to tenths of a second is more accurate? Measuring by whole cups instead of halfs, thirds, or fourths is more accurate? You do realize that what you just said is like failing early middle school math right? How hard is the concept of, numbers with a decimal are going to be more precise than rounded numbers? Stay 5th grade dustloop. You seem to be having trouble discerning the difference between opinion and data-gathering. The above quote can be taken seriously if the matchup chart was based on actual gathered data for 100 matches between each character. If this is not the case, then unfortunately your patronizing attitude leads you nowhere. EDIT: you may also wish to explore the difference between accuracy and precision prior to insulting someones intelligence so directly. Edited November 5, 2010 by Remiri
Klaige Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 You seem to be having trouble discerning the difference between opinion and data-gathering. The above quote can be taken seriously if the matchup chart was based on actual gathered data for 100 matches between each character. If this is not the case, then unfortunately your patronizing attitude leads you nowhere. And you don't seem to get math still. It doesn't matter if that number is based entirely off opinion (and they aren't you couldn't do it that way, there has to be some actual evidence, you know, like the goddamn matchup being played!). Or based entirely off a sample size of gathered data (100 matches played between 2 equally skilled players). A chart with .5 numbers is ALWAYS going to be closer to accurate than one without. What if all they did was double the idea of it being 10 matches to 20. Holy shit what if the opinon was that one character won about 15 matches and the other won 5 out of those 20? How the chart is made is irrelevant, a fucking number with a decimal point is ALWAYS more accurate than one with out.
Spirit Juice Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 You seem to be having trouble discerning the difference between opinion and data-gathering. The above quote can be taken seriously if the matchup chart was based on actual gathered data for 100 matches between each character. If this is not the case, then unfortunately your patronizing attitude leads you nowhere. No, you're failing to grasp how ratios work and how they apply to match up charts. What Klaige is saying is how match up charts are supposed to work in theory, not in practice. No one actually sat down and played 100 matches between each character, not to mention there is all kinds of wrong with how that would influence the chart anyways.
Klaige Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 Here's a matchup chart for you: Math vs. Dustloop 10.0 - 0.0 Accounts for possible 0.0 margin of error.
ZONG_one Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 Godlike Spark quote, lol. I swear he'll only say stuff like that in person, since he's a fucking machine online.
A.X.I.S. Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 I feel infinite sadness. this perfectly fine american thread was ruined by a bunch of theory fighting netplayers. worse still, I still never got any info on tao vs tager.
Marisa Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 Including a hard mirror in the matchup chart just seems wrong, that's like dropping characters tier levels because they're difficult to learn. It's unrelated when you consider that the player is going to learn the matchup, just like the player learns their character.
OmniSScythe Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 (edited) I feel infinite sadness. this perfectly fine american thread was ruined by a bunch of theory fighting netplayers. Feel even worse, it actually went 50 pages without any X vs X discussion at all. Just coin flips and mirrors. Edited November 5, 2010 by OmniSScythe zong putting me on blast
Sesshyru Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 hi i'm 12 and what is this? Wtf didn't I tell you to get outa here? Why did you steal MissedFRC's avatar, Location and PSN? Screw you slim.
Remiri Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 And you don't seem to get math still. It doesn't matter if that number is based entirely off opinion (and they aren't you couldn't do it that way, there has to be some actual evidence, you know, like the goddamn matchup being played!). Or based entirely off a sample size of gathered data (100 matches played between 2 equally skilled players). A chart with .5 numbers is ALWAYS going to be closer to accurate than one without. What if all they did was double the idea of it being 10 matches to 20. Holy shit what if the opinon was that one character won about 15 matches and the other won 5 out of those 20? How the chart is made is irrelevant, a fucking number with a decimal point is ALWAYS more accurate than one with out. Would have responded quicker but I had to make a sale :p You seem to think I don't understand math, this is false. My statement is based on attempting to use the process of gathering data, and then subsequently assigning either a percentage or a ratio to that data. This does not work when the majority of the decision is not on solid data. A number with a decimal is more PRECISE, not accurate. For example, I am thinking of a number out of 100. This number is 50. Two people guess the number. One person guesses 49, the other guesses 48.5. The person who said 48.5 was giving a more precise response, but it was less accurate than the 1st. Precision: Mathematics . the degree to which the correctness of a quantity is expressed. Accuracy: Mathematics . the degree of correctness of a quantity, expression, etc.
A.X.I.S. Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 Klaige and Remiri for gods sakes this thread is made to discuss match ups and why they are what they are. NOT MATH! stop going on statisticmagiggers and stay on subject. I swear dustloop has A.D.D -_-
Remiri Posted November 5, 2010 Posted November 5, 2010 Is there honestly something more captivating about the bbcs matchups that CAN be discussed here? This thread is showing its age, nothing left to do but bicker about stupid shit.
Recommended Posts