Skye Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I've gotten blown up CS1 Ragna style trying to 5a Noel's 2d, by you, actually. 4d has a backwards profile which makes it hard to low on reaction, it's more of a Yomi thing, and Arakune doesn't really have a low that long reaching (even though you are talking about Mu), 2d will only get me Fataled up close by 4d if anything, 13f start up isn't really reliable, contrary to popular consensus.
LunaKage Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I've gotten blown up CS1 Ragna style trying to 5a Noel's 2d, by you, actually. 4d has a backwards profile which makes it hard to low on reaction, it's more of a Yomi thing, and Arakune doesn't really have a low that long reaching (even though you are talking about Mu), 2d will only get me Fataled up close by 4d if anything, 13f start up isn't really reliable, contrary to popular consensus. I was actually talking more for Mu, Argent Zero showed me that j.6x blows up Noel's drives by TKing it.
Aginor Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 Unfortunately, it is because of the risk reward. Your opponent hits you for 3k, if you land a hit on them you get 5k. I sure don't like playing like that but it's valid in cs2. I actually think the best way to deal with drives is just to make her whiff and do a whiff punish unless you're mu then you can just 2c everything. I'd rather not guess and just go for something guaranteed. Doing a 5a against 2d and 2b against 4d the risk reward isn't worth it. If you screw up the timing then noel gets to do a lot of damage on you while you only get a 5a or 2b which nets you about 3-4k at max with super if you're lucky. But I like how you make it sound that Noel's drives aren't a threat lolll. They matter if you don't have one move that can answer both of them. Whatever....sup guise.
Skye Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 If Noel can win by pushing d with a strong player base like Japan, then it worth considering that her drive is THAT good.
LunaKage Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 If Noel can win by pushing d with a strong player base like Japan, then it worth considering that her drive is THAT good. I usually see Noel win in Japan by raping with her pressure, and a crossup 2D every now and again, I think I've seen a successful reversal drive like 10 times total coming from JP vids.
FlyingVe Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I've been saying it for a long time, but Noel needs a different drive...
LunaKage Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I've been saying it for a long time, but Noel needs a different drive... I can agree with this... ;w;
FlyingVe Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I can agree with this... ;w; Actually, I've given some thought to this, and I think her CA is really neat and defining, what if her drive was more mobility and evasion oriented instead of lol-invul into auto combo. You could keep alot of the same footsies using partial invul moves, but lose the bad design and boring that goes along with her current drive. It would also make it easier to balance damage and reward learning things rather than D.
LunaKage Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 Actually, I've given some thought to this, and I think her CA is really neat and defining, what if her drive was more mobility and evasion oriented instead of lol-invul into auto combo. You could keep alot of the same footsies using partial invul moves, but lose the bad design and boring that goes along with her current drive. It would also make it easier to balance damage and reward learning things rather than D. I'd be cool with it, my only complaint would be that she would do next to no damage, her drives and drive followups are crucial to her combos, even if the starter is not a drive. So I guess if they buffed her specials in certain ways, like allowing RB to combo on normal hit, and thus have it be a standard combo linker, maybe have her air moves do better damage. I could deal with no attack drives. Perhaps keep j.D because the move is awesome. But if that happened, what would her CA be? like her normal drives would be limited dodges but her CA would be a perfect dodge?
FlyingVe Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 (edited) Maybe, obviously they'd have to buff some other things to give her real combos. Maybe give her a way to go into a air string and make j236C knock down ID heel drop style. Also, you could have jD just move Noel into position quickly then cross-up with a normal. My only thought is that this is kinda similar to asteroid vision. But dodging mid combo could be used to extend combo's and make the whole Gun-Kata think look alot cooler. But I'm just being silly here really. Edited June 15, 2011 by FlyingVe
LunaKage Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 Maybe, obviously they'd have to buff some other things to give her real combos. Maybe give her a way to go into a air string and make j236C knock down ID heel drop style. Also, you could have jD just move Noel into position quickly then cross-up with a normal. My only thought is that this is kinda similar to asteroid vision. But dodging mid combo could be used to extend combo's and mate the whole Gun-Kata think look alot cooler. But I'm just being silly here really. You're thinking j.4D, I wouldn't miss that move, I'm saying her j.D where she fires the guns downward. Like it could be her air knockdown move, if they improved the hitbox a bit, and made the recovery on landing less. Alternatively they could make it a j.2C input so it wouldn't mess with her Drives not being attacks anymore.
mAc Chaos Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 Her drive makes sense for her character, since it's supposed to be her dodging around people's attacks like the Matrix.
LunaKage Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 Her drive makes sense for her character, since it's supposed to be her dodging around people's attacks like the Matrix. Yeah but Ve's idea would be just as good for that, except you would need to follow up with a normal instead of having an auto attack. The reason I really like the idea is because I wouldn't be forced to go into panic mode every time I push the D button and it didn't hit.
FlyingVe Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 Her drive makes sense for her character, since it's supposed to be her dodging around people's attacks like the Matrix. Yeah, but it's auto combo, in a game where everybody can already combo. All it does it make Noel boring and scrubby. The reason I really like the idea is because I wouldn't be forced to go into panic mode every time I push the D button and it didn't hit. It could also add flexibility to her neutral game, dodge through lambda's swords? I like that footsie.
LunaKage Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 Yeah, but it's auto combo, in a game where everybody can already combo. All it does it make Noel boring and scrubby. It could also add flexibility to her neutral game, dodge through lambda's swords? I like that footsie. I like the second statement alot. But the first statement makes me sad, Ve you should play Noel a bit against players that know what they are doing.
FlyingVe Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I'm not talking power level at all, I could care less whether she's crap or the best. She has always been one of the most boring character to watch and play against. Even when they're a good player and Noel makes the right reads and plays well, somehow it doesn't feel as right as with the other characters, I don't really know how to describe it.
Dorian Posted June 15, 2011 Posted June 15, 2011 I'm not talking power level at all, I could care less whether she's crap or the best. She has always been one of the most boring character to watch and play against. Even when they're a good player and Noel makes the right reads and plays well, somehow it doesn't feel as right as with the other characters, I don't really know how to describe it. Yeah, especially since that's true for pretty much the cast. It's always hitconfirm into 1 combo, and I personnaly love Noel's drive =<
C0R Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 Imo it's because Noel doesn't really have the capacity to play in neutral, she either in, or she's not. But anyhow, Noel 2.0 is great. GREAT I SAY. I really hope she gets new palettes in the next installment. I just can't adore her current ones like I can Litchi's colors. Also, according to the greek alphabet, Xi14 is the new Murakumo unit >.>
C0R Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 Yeah, either Nu is reanimating as the replacement Mu, or Saya dons the Sword of the Imperator armor, either option is pleasing.
LunaKage Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 Yeah, either Nu is reanimating as the replacement Mu, or Saya dons the Sword of the Imperator armor, either option is pleasing. Yeah, I think that is likely how Saya will be portrayed. The alternative could be Noel using Mu as a super form, like during the final battle Noel faces Litchi, and in an effort to lower Noel's resolve Litchi places her panda between her breasts and taunts Noel with both assets. Noel has a BSOD and turns into Mu and kicks some ass.
C0R Posted June 16, 2011 Posted June 16, 2011 Yeah, I think that is likely how Saya will be portrayed. The alternative could be Noel using Mu as a super form, like during the final battle Noel faces Litchi, and in an effort to lower Noel's resolve Litchi places her panda between her breasts and taunts Noel with both assets. Noel has a BSOD and turns into Mu and kicks some ass. Your mind works in mysterious, and delightful ways.
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