Guilty Gear 2: Overture released

[Blackgenma]

OK! I asked my friend Raul to type up a Sin guide! here it is.

Sin Basics guide

Sin is an extremely simple character to learn seeing as he does not have many combo options. He has very effective long rage poking style that will deal loads of damage with very few attacks. His tribe arsenal consist of all basic unit types, and three elites.

His swordsman (Melee unit) has average attack and defense. It is meant to be an all-around unit with no exceeding capabilities. Gauntlet Body (Armored unit) is a very sturdy unit with exceeding offense and defense stats. It has a launcher that is effective on units, but techable by masters. Springblock (Mobile unit), though it is a weak unit, excels in it's specialty. It has the ability to weaken armored units' defense with it's Steel Antler skill, making this unit a deadly force against all armored units in the game. Wise Man (Magic unit) is considerably weak in both attack and defense power, but does the job as a support unit. It is able to heal and supplement the offense and magical defense stats of your units. Twin Trigger (Ranged unit) is a very good support unit. It is quite lacking in defense, but it makes that up with offense and range. It has a three consecutive shot skill that offer quite a bit of protection. These units are deadly to masters in groups, but can be taken out with ease. Convict Hammer, Quadro Bailiff, and Heaven's libra (Armored, Ranged, and Support unit) are Sin's elites.

Convict Hammer has an aura that will increase the attack of all nearby units and can also use dispel, so enemy buffs and minions will not be a factor in a battle involving Mr. Convict. The amount of health that this unit has is very high. When it all stacks up, this unit is very dangerous and is definitely a force to be reckoned with. Quadro Bailiff is Sin's elite ranged unit. Though considerably weak, it offers a big advantage with ranged attacks. It has some set-up time in which it readies itself for attacks. It is very easy to predict his attacks since he gives you warnings, along with very long 'stare' times. Overall, it is a decent unit with decent stats. Sin's magic unit, Heaven's Libra is one of his most useful units. It has an ability to place canes that lower enemy defenses dramatically. Anything caught within the cane's magic field will not be considered a threat to any of your units. It literally turns anything and everything into GARBAGE defense-wise; this including enemy masters. It also has the ability to raise ally attack speeds. It is a great unit in any scenario with good stats. This is definitely the first elite you would want in the fray.

When it comes down to the melting pot, sin is an easy master with good units. They do not suffer any serious flaws and are pretty effective. Sin can accomplish his objectives in a very flexible way. The effectiveness of his strategies depends on the skill level of the player, but that can be said about all characters. He can be played as an offensive character, or defense. Sin's skills are extremely useful on any situation. Patecatl Stain restores the life of any allies it passes through. The amount of health that is restored is no joke (you almost give your unit(s) a complete heal, assuming they are your basic units). This makes this skill extremely useful for assuring your mana does not go to waste. Phantom Barrel takes the life of nearby units and turns it into a powerful projectile. Though strong and useful, I don't find myself using it very often. Exciter is an attack buff that turns sing into a killing machine. This is a must bring to every battle, seeing how it makes sin turn into a broom, and the enemy units into dust. Sin plows right through them in a matter of seconds. As for Humming Sword, it is a mobile minion with a high stun rate. From the limited testing I've done with it, and what little I saw a skilled player do with it, it has some uses. It stuns enemies, including masters, and pokes for decent damage, so it can be an effective back up for Sin. It can also capture ghost quickly.

Master Vs. Master can go either way for Sin. His abilities give him a deadly advantage at a distance. The effectiveness of his pokes can be devastating as he can link them with easy to time combos. They do not require extensive skill and/or timing to pull off and can do up to 300+ damage per combo. Sin's major flaw is his close range attacks. If an opponent happens to be right next to him he is easy bait. An example of this would be a Sol standing next to sin. Sol's Locked-on x attack (his kick) will go through all of Sin's close range options, so maintaining your distance a must at all times.

END OF GUIDE

TA DAH! hope you enjoyed!

I have brought it back from the abyss....

[Ayumu Gardevoir]

uh... good point. I DO have all of them in my computer, and I'm not so lazy that I can't go back about 20 pages to update the Sol guide (yeah, I updated it again recently, I'm obsessed with him.) when I update the Sin guide during or after the weekend, I will make a brand new topic with all of the guides. I will also toss in the combo inputs for for combo videos, and I'll put up all of the combo inputs for that one nico video combo vid where the player does the 404 damage, 16 combo with Sol, so you can see how the player does combos this everyone instead of just having the Sol combos up.

should I write up a general gameplay basics guide? or is that over-kill?....maybe it's over-kill. I'll consider it if it's asked for, and the chances of that actually being requested for by at least 5 different people is slime to none. it's settled than, if 5 people ask for a general basic stratagy guide, than I'll write one up. but I wonder if it's even needed at this point? oh well, it will be aimed at those who are having trouble getting into the game like blade.

A general basics guide isn't a bad thing, but I would hold it off until you make your own topic for it. Making this guide would be a big help for some people just getting used to the game.

woah, it's hard to be serious ._.

[Blackgenma]

A general basics guide isn't a bad thing, but I would hold it off until you make your own topic for it. Making this guide would be a big help for some people just getting used to the game.

woah, it's hard to be serious ._.

thats one. one person said they would like to see it. four more. I need four more than I'll write it up in the overture basic help topic I'm gonna make (tentative title, I just made it up now).

it is good to be serious at times. people who are always clowning around 24/7 get annoying, and tend to have some insecurities. there's a time to laugh and B.S. and theres a time when it's not appropriate. people who are serious 24/7 aren't fun to be around either though, they need to chill out.

FOUR MORE!

[NeoVid]

Really, what we've got now is worth compiling and posting on Gamefaqs. Once it's compiled, it'll be easier to tell what needs to be added.

[Blackgenma]

Really, what we've got now is worth compiling and posting on Gamefaqs. Once it's compiled, it'll be easier to tell what needs to be added.

well, I'v said it before, what I don't have is the skills with notepad to make something that would fit the guidelines of the Gamefaqs FAQ contribution. if I have to do it myself, it's going to take a while, because I would need to look up how to do it, and I actually have a life, so that gets in the way sometimes too. not to mention it's a crapload of effort just writing these things, so on top of that, I have to make it presentable in notepad? no thanks, not anytime soon in the near future. if someone else wants to take these guides and fix it up and put it on a faq, than be my guest, just give me credit.

now, if what you mean by posting putting this up in gamefaqs is that you want me to grab these badboys and post them in the gamefaqs boards as a sticky....well I guess I can do that, but that's second to what I want to do here on dustloop. Gamefaqs boards are pretty unwieldy, with a limit of characters per post and no ability to edit them after the fact, I'm not crazy about the Idea, but unlike the creation of a FAQ, it's doable in the near future. there are also jerk offs at gamefaqs, and if I felt comfortable posting these things there, I would have done so already (and obviously, I have yet t do so), but I'm not totally against the Idea.

as for needing to compile this stuff in order to see what needs to be added....no, I know everything that has been posted here in this thread pretty much. ask me if something has already been covered in this thread, and I'll tell you if it has been posted or not. I know what I put down, and I save all my guides, as well as anything significant about character strategy or general strategy that someone else mentions. so if you think I need to make a comprehensive guide about basic general strategy aimed at people having a hard time getting into the game, say so.

I would do advanced stuff, but I'm not good enough of a player, and besides, advanced stuff is simply getting a feel for the game and trying different and new strategies out once your comfortable with the game anyway. at least thats what it looks like to me when I see the good videos from nico video. regardless, the basics are more important than anything. I just want to see some demand for a basic general guide, so I'm not wasting my time.

so yeah, four more people request a GG2 basics guide and I'll make write one up. there should be a part for servant strategy and master strategy.

[Blade]

It's just a text dump, but, hey, it's a useful one.

http://www.mimeblade.oddigytitanium.com/Guilty_Gear/Guilty_Gear_Quote_Project/GG2_Overture_Guides_by_Black_Gehenna+Neovid.txt

[Blackgenma]

It's just a text dump, but, hey, it's a useful one.

http://www.mimeblade.oddigytitanium.com/Guilty_Gear/Guilty_Gear_Quote_Project/GG2_Overture_Guides_by_Black_Gehenna+Neovid.txt

hey, that's pretty cool. did you compile that? you made it recently, because the Sol guide is up to date. what can we use this text dump for though.....

[Blade]

If you're asking, you might as well make it a FAQ or something. I just grabbed posts and cobbled it together. You can do quick name searches [iN CAPS] to find specific sections if you need to. Let me know when you want an updated copy or something and I'll upload it as a backup. Might be worth putting up on GG.ru while you're at it.

[Blackgenma]

ok, so we are getting some organizing going around here. I might just shut up about the request thing and write up a general strategy section any way regardless of demand. I need more time though, I need to at least finish up on Sin's master abilities, and I want to see if I can edit my guides with whatever neovid posted regarding servants. for example, I have servant information on raven, who is a downloadable character, but not for Valentine, who you have available right away. it should be the other way around. So I'll scrap up what I can and shoot a request to update or reorganize that text dump as soon as I fix up the Sin and valentine guide after the weekend.

[Blackgenma]

I redid the valentine and Raven Guides, so it's better suited for a compilation. I used neovid's vizuel unit guide and edited it where I felt it was necessary. here, I'll post both of them.

Valentine Basics Guide

Valentine is a difficult master to play as; she excels at mid range combat, as she has a variety of effective projectiles, and as powerful servants to back her up and act as a shield to protect her. She is however, pretty bad at close range, and although she can fend for herself close up, she isn’t as dangerous as other masters in the game, this is also evident with her 460 health, and her generally low damage output. She’s great at killing servants, and has powerful crowd control, but with her shortcomings as a master, she’s a potentially easy kill. Her servants are very strong, and are the primary muscle of the character, unlike a Sol.

The Valentines tribe is around the second strongest in the game after Paradigm's, but works nothing like any of the others. Having only one of the low-level standard unit types, they have to make heavy use of support troops to have any chance against most armies. It can be summed up that this tribe’s has unbalanced servant types, but the individual abilities of each servant are excellent. This tribe is reliant on its elite servants more than the majority of the tribes, and the order in which the servants are contracted is very important. Raven shares this tribe.

Candy is the tribe’s excellent melee unit, having more special abilities than any other in the game, all of them useful, and increasing their survivability, making them one of the better defensive units. These are the only low class basic servant that this tribe has, so your going to need to supplement the with the proper amount of support units early. The lower their health is, the more damage they do. These units have the highest attack damage amongst the standard melee units, and move across the map rather quickly for a melee. They are also extremely aggressive, making them annoying to fight in droves.

Gateau Skin is the tribe’s range unit. There’s really nothing that special about Gateaus, it does have a special attack that will strike any nearby enemies one recovery from a fall, which does nice damage. Not very impressive compared to, say, Twin Triggers, but as ranged units can tear up melees, you'll need these guys right away to get yourself the advantage in troops early in the game. They are available from the start, no need to contract them.

Professor Blancmange is the magic unit of the tribe; you'll need to unlock these guys right away against most opponents, as they're your only counter to armors, which will smash your army otherwise. This alone means you'll make very heavy use of these guys most of the time. Their ability to slow enemies really wrecks armors, as they likely won't reach the professors before being torn up by magic attacks... if you have enough professors to do the job. Their slow spell can be a big help when facing masters.

Charlotte is the tribes elite armor unit, and the only armor unit in the tribe. This is a reliable unit, being annoying to kill, faster than most armors, and even though nowhere near as deadly as Bonebiter, still an enormous pain to fight against in a group. Getting rid of Charlotte usually requires the enemy Master taking care of it in person... and with Charlotte's low cost, it will be back soon even if they do. Charlotte has low damage out put for armor, and regains a minute amount of health when it hits an enemy. It’s wide swing attacks cannot be interrupted. When it is alone, don’t be surprised if the enemy master takes it out rather quickly, it can be easy to handle alone, even DR. paradigm can destroy this guy one on one no problem if the opponent if familiar with handling these.

Mille-feuille is an elite mobile, and the tribe’s only mobile unit, Mille is the most costly unit you get, and is very worth it. Once you have him unlocked, your Master should carry Mille at all times, immediately tossing him into any fight you run across. His summoning of really nasty mobile minions is invaluable, as if it uses his summon near any dead servants, his minions will be able to teleport and cause long stuns, as well as staying even if you pick Mille back up. As a bodyguard elite, Mille might only be matched by Heaven's Libra.

Eclair: Your elite ranged might be the least useful of your elites, but is the hardest-to-kill ranged servant in the game. Eclair fires basic shots fairly slowly, but they have an extreme range and great tracking. Also, its high HP is complemented by a defensive retreat it uses on occasion when forced into melee range. When ordered to head to a Ghost, it fires shots that reach from an insane distance to the Ghost, but it uses that skill rarely enough that you shouldn't count on capping anything by surprise. This thing absolutely destroys magic units by the way, can kill Heaven’s Libra before it even thinks of putting down it’s staff.

Miss Tiramisu is a Elite Magic. Can be a very annoying unit in the game to fight against, as her basic attack is a huge ball of energy that can't be stopped by anything, and she has the unique ability to keep units from being able to attack at all with a curse. Unfortunately, she doesn't always use this on the enemy Master when she has the chance. Her basic attack makes her devastating to armors, and that alone is likely to make her a necessity not long into a match.

Master Abilities

Valentine has 460 health, Is the only character who can double jump, and her air dash goes further than anyone else’s. Her start up for her blast drive is the slowest in the game. I’ll cover her personal skills first

Brownie is her Minion. It’s an armor unit that follows Valentine and gets in the way of attackers. They will counter attack what hits them. They’re Very helpful for valentine.

Zest is an attack where her balloon blows up, takes a good amount of tension. I've seen this used at the end of 8x loops and combos. It’s also good for old fashion crowd control.

Bye Bye is a teleport skill that takes you to your masterghost; you can escape a fight easier that way. It’s a cheap skill, handy for getting away if you feel the need I suppose, since her blast drive start up is so slow.

Valentine fighting style is composed of very close range melee attacks with some quick and varied projectiles. She works best by playing defensively, unlike Sol; she should spread her units out slowly and stay with them as a lead. Her melees back her up very well, and she can sit back and blast away with her projectiles until the enemy manages to come close, where she can attack with her melee strikes.

The standard (L) x, x, x, combo isn't bad, but the first strike has very short range. On the third hit, she will jump, so you can MC it and hit them with a 8x for more damage. I'm unsure whether you can enter the 8x loop with the combo though.

(L) 4x doesn't have the range that the (L) x second strike has, but it goes into her launcher, where you can strike the enemy a few times, and finish off with the 8x loop, hit the opponent with 8x, and the second valentine touches the floor, jump again and repeat as much as possible. This is her biggest source of damage. she can also finish some of these combos from this attack with zest. An example.

(L) 4x, x, x, 8x (zest)

(L) x, x, x, MC, 4x, x, x, 8x, (land) (left step) 4x, x, *x, x, 8x, (zest)

(L) 6 x is where she spins Lucifer. a good move to do on servants, as you can charge the move by hitting x rapidly, which will hurt anyone the swing will hit. Stop pressing x and aim, valentine will unleash a heavy strike that can't be blocked. Not bad for masters thanks to it's range, but if the block and side step, make sure you MC the move to be safe.

(L) 2x is to stop side stepping mostly, but can be used as a roundabout way to attack. Try sidestepping to either direction and use this. if you hit twice in a row, you will dizzy the opponent. I' suggest using the L trigger if you are going to use it from a side step, and once you hit, MC and do it again to stun.

Her 8x on the ground is heavy hitting and good for attacking servants. I'm not too sure about attacking masters though, there’s not much you can follow up with it. Good for knocking them back. Here’s a combo utilizing this move.

(L) 8x, MC, 8y

short and sweet.

Her hard attack sweeps and breaks guard. It’s great for crowd control and for mixing it up against masters. You can combo from this move as well with a jump x.

Her aerial x combo is very good, extremely reliable, and can go into 8x loops.

She has 4 projectiles, y which is weak and straight, 2y, which are two shots from the left and right, good for mix up and hiding behind a ghost. 8y is a heavy and strong projectile with start up time, great for servants and r short running masters, or for sneak attacks. Don’t spit this one out randomly; you can be punished for it. All of Valentine’s projectiles can be jumped over, so keep that in mind.

Her air Y is a series of shots with splash damage. Great for servant crowd control, and not bad to whip out on masters every once and a while you see them get careless. Even if you miss the shot initially, she will slowly follow her target.

That’s all, she's a tricky but reliable character, her units are very annoying, and help her out greatly. Though she weaker than the majority of the masters, she’s not as weak as Paradigm, who has almost no combos. Just beware of her shortcomings and cover your vulnerabilities. Her servants are good but their types are unbalanced, so be sure to know what you are doing with them, she relies on them more than Raven, as she is not as good at close range fighting as he is.

End of Guide

you will notice I changed a lot of the wording and what the guide said regarding her servants. since it's a basic guide, I didn't want to give any overly specific instructions on how to use the tribe, besides, I wan't sure if what was changed was very was effective anyway. the changes I made were based off what have seen and what I have experienced, so please don't get offended that I messed with your guide neovid.

I'll put up the updated Raven's guide next post to avoid clutter.I mostly just reorganized some wording, and as a bonus, I put in a very effective bread and butter combo hat I use a lot.

[Blackgenma]

Raven Basics Guide

Raven is a downloadable character available for purchase for 400 Microsoft points. He offers a different style of master combat, and shares the same units as valentine, but has different personal skills, and fights vastly different. Since he has Valentine’s servants, I will only cover his master abilities. For his servants, check out the valentine guide.

First I’ll start with his personal skills, he has 4 of them, 2 for masters, one for attacking servants, and a minion.

His not there skill is a teleportation that teleports behind the locked on target, if you press x while doing it, you will do a unblock-able 6x kick. It can be dodged a verity of ways, so use it to punish for the best results. If it hits, free air combo for you.

The next skill is a slowdown spell. It will slowdown the movement dramatically on the target that is locked on. It takes a while to use and can be interrupted easily, but it has long range, so do it at a distance. The opponent can still run away if you’re too far, and if you fight another Raven and he pulls this on you, your better off running if you can, a dispel will clear it up though.

Slow fields are the next Skill, and it's primarily for wiping out servants. They make servants slow, and have the same status effect as Raven's magic elite. You can control the way raven throws the two needles with a direction and the l trigger. L trigger and hold back so Raven can throw them split apart, for large crowds. This is a helpful skill to help take servants.

Raven's minion, the little Bird, is a weak minion, but, thanks to Suzaku's translation skills, I have found out that it steals tension form enemy masters. How annoying, that's just like raven to do something like that to you. I need to test how effective the thing is, but its purpose is to steal tension from enemy masters and serves as a distraction for servants,. It's a mobile type minion, but it does such little damage and dies so quickly, I don't think it matters what type of unit this thing is.

Now for Raven’s fighting style. Raven has a distinct style in master combat, and doesn't have too much flexibility on how he should be played in that regard, but he has answers for most situations he's in. When playing Raven, he has very short range, and thus most not approach the opponents carelessly, or he will get snuffed.

So the best way to attack is to punish and counter attack, and when in close range, smack the some (L) x, x and usually finish with a 4x without Modern Cancel (MC). His (L) 4x and 6x can be used to stop side steps, the (L) 6x will launch the opponent, can hit grounded enemies, but cannot be combo'd into from (L) x, x on masters without MC, or they will block. I think you can possibly pull an air combo off from (L) 6x with a MC. when you see an opportunity, like to punish a whiffed attack, move in with a (L) 8x, into x, x standard combo. DO NOT spam 8x, it is not safe on block, once blocked, the opponent can side step and punish. His (L) 2x is a launcher that has some invincibility, but has VERY short range, use it as a planned counter if you can, than jump into a air combo, no MC needed. His (L) 8x in the air is decent for punishing and moving in, and can be MC into his standard (L) 8x, x, x combo. Raven's power attack ((F) 8x) is decent for crowd control, and breaks guard.

Standard combo for Raven I use.

(L) 8x, x, x, 4x, MC, 8x, x, x, 6x.

All of Raven's special moves are needle-like projectiles. Y is a anti air, and launching projectile with decent range, it has some (short) startup time, but interestingly enough, even is Raven is interrupted mid way of starting animation, the attack will still come out, unlike his (L) 8y. if you MC the y special, you can follow up with an air combo. It can be side stepped.

(L) 8y is a standard projectile, has startup time and recovery time. When the projectile actually comes out, it's pretty fast, and does a little over 100 damage when it comes out, and has good range. Use it to poke and punish when you see an opportunity, like sneaking up on an unsuspecting master. You can actually MC into another (L) 8y, so if your close enough, and you have the tension to spare, smack the opponent with another one. On an odd note, if you are as close as can be when you shoot this projectile, the projectile will miss the opponent, not that you should ever be that close when you shoot the thing. it can be interrupted and punished if jumped over, and it isn’t hard to side step if seen coming.

The third special move he has is his (L) 4y and 6y, three needles attacking his left and right respectfully. They are primarily to punish side steps it can also offer up some limited and weak crowd control. It can be MC into other (L) 4x and 6x no problem.

His mid air y special attack is a projectile that shifts its aim to its target. It can be used to punish, and to end air combos. Like the other projectiles, it can be MC into another air Y, so if they are in the air, hit the opponent with two (or three?) of these for extra damage.

Raven's overdrive has short range, and cannot kill a opponent with full health (does about 400 damage). It hits all around him, and hit's opponents above him. If you want to catch some one with this, hit them with a (L) 2x before hand, and combo into it.

There we have it folks. Raven is a character with a strong master and reliable servants. His fighting style is close ranged, and is good at pressuring and punishing, but his options are not the most diverse and he’s bad at crowd control. Overall, he is one of the easiest characters to play and perhaps one of the simplest. He's worth the 400 Microsoft points in my opinion, because he’s pretty fun and effective to play.

END GUIDE

now it's better suited to being put in a compilation. I'll make that new topic when I redo sin's master abilities section and I write up a beginners' general basics guide for people who are having trouble getting into the game. it will act as an intro. once I'm done with that, I will bother blade to make a text dump of all of the guides in the new topic and he can submit it to the guiltygear.ru or something.

[fatewalker]

Guilty Gear 2: Overture complete Guide huh? is there a translation or a transcript for that book? or have you read and remember what the book says regarding match ups? I'd be interested in reading the guide, but it's only in Japanese right? did someone post what the guide said earlier in this thread? I mean, this thread is so massive, so I want to know if it's in here before I bother digging.

all I know about match up is that Sol tribe does well against Valentine's and Izuna's tribe.

Edit: and that he does bad against Sin's, and HORRIBLY against Paradigm's.

there's alot of Q's there.... i don't know of any transcript. i have read it and own the book. i'm in the process of making a servent guid now.

[Aedesyr]

Nice Raven guide. now just tellme how to counter him(as a master) and i'll be happy. Anyways, i have a question I own theEU version of the game, wich unfortunely doesn't have the dlcs. But since i wanna try raven(and the holy knight fortress)do you think that buying them on the american channel with a fake account would make them work on my main EU account as well?

[Blackgenma]

Your asking the wrong guy here. I would have no Idea. but as long as you don't lose anything, why not? countering raven is not that hard. if the raven player goofs up, he's toast. raven has limited ways of approaching you when he's on the offensive, he is best played defensively until his opponent attacks and leaves an opening to counter, which he is VERY good at doing. so first thing against raven is not to be careless and charge at him, because he will most likely take advantage of this and rock you. His (L) 8x (when he dives forward at you) is not safe on block, side step as soon as you block it and he will be left open for an ass whooping. His (L) 8x in the air is the same (he lunges at you from the air), when he dives at you and you block it, side step right away. you can escape right after he attacks you with his (L) x, x, (where he pokes you 2 times for each x the player presses.) once the player attacks with all four hits, you can escape, but he may be able to catch you with his subsequent attack. for most cases, try sidestepping to your left after his (L) x, x. when you feel he might attack with his (L) 6x, side step the opposite direction. keep an eye out for his projectiles, they are nasty, but if shot at the wrong moment (where you predict it), you can jump over them, air dash and punish. he has one anti air projectile, but it has limited uses, so don't expect the opponent to use it often. his long range and anti air projectile can be sidestepped, but beware that he has a set of projectiles to stop sidesteps as well, which can be jumped over. buy a dispel. it will make dealing with his slow spell 10x easier. also gets rid f his slow fields, turns your servants into sitting ducks, easy to kill. not there is a unblockable teleport skill that teleports ranve behind his opponent, where he can do an unblockable attack and get a free air combo. you can dodge it simply by steping forward, or jumping and airdashing when you see him disapear. if your playing sol, do gun flame when he disappears, he will get hit by the gun flame's hit box that strikes anything behind sol. if your trying to run away from him, he might try to catch you with the not there skill, uasually resulting in you crashing into him. the best way to escape is running the opposite direction, even if it leads you to where you don't want to go, for example, you run towards your master ghost in an attempt to escape from raven, raven uses not there to catch you and you bump into him. turn around and run the other direction, which will lead to his masterghost, and take the long way to your masterghost. it is the only guarantee that you will escape from him when he uses the not there skill, because if raven recovers from the bump quickly, he has a lot of tools to stop you from getting pass him, but that isn't the case if you run the opposite direction from him. hope that helps.

[Blade]

If you guys write a guide for this, here's what I would like to see. Master Guides Master Combos Master Matchups (Strengths and Weaknesses based on Master VS Master or Master VS Servant) Tribe Guides (use and how to deal with each Servant) Tribe Strengths and Weaknesses based on VS Servant Scenarios or VS Master Scenarios. Battlefield and Terrain Guides (tips on the lay of the land and how to deal with the Ghosts, Mana Acquisition, Item use, Enhancement Guides (relates to Servant-specifics maybe). You could break these into separate guides, just worth sorting.

[NeoVid]

Keep in mind that I'm the least qualified person here to do an informative guide. It's just that I have to, since this thread is about the only place to find out much about the game, and I'd like to get something up on Gamefaqs someday.

Also, right after I finally registered on Nico and then found out that searching for things in English doesn't work, this got linked on the BB: CS thread: http://www.mmcafe.com/nico.html

[ZhaneBX]

Got this game today, and damn it's totally awesome! I'm just angry that this EU release came so late, and the only thing that's worse is the marketing here I had to order it from the UK because i didn't find it near me. But back to GG2. Played till Campaign Mission 17 so far, a couple of free missions and took some time in training. Still need to unlock Ky, but from what i've seen in the short mission where you play him, he could be my main This Thread is the best you can find about this game. Thanks for the nice guides and infos here. And even if you think, you're not that qualified, everything is this thread (nah, didn't read all 120 pages now XD) is very informative and well written, keep it up and help people like me I would like to help too, but i still totally suck at this game and just spam some basic combo's vs CPU (And no DLC in sight here at the moment, all we have is the Trailer....)

[Blackgenma]

If you guys write a guide for this, here's what I would like to see.

Master Guides

Master Combos

Master Matchups (Strengths and Weaknesses based on Master VS Master or Master VS Servant)

Tribe Guides (use and how to deal with each Servant)

Tribe Strengths and Weaknesses based on VS Servant Scenarios or VS Master Scenarios.

Battlefield and Terrain Guides (tips on the lay of the land and how to deal with the Ghosts, Mana Acquisition, Item use, Enhancement Guides (relates to Servant-specifics maybe).

You could break these into separate guides, just worth sorting.

whut? thats alot your asking for there. I will consider these topics when doing the general basics guide. the last one on the list seems kind of sketchy though, what were you refering to im that last comment "relates to Servant-specifics maybe"?

oh, played the demo for brutal legends, great cutscens, really funny. man, GG2 had some boring cutscens.

ok, here is the new section of the Sin master abilites of his basics guide. I will put the guide together in full later.

Sin master Abilities.

Sin's is an extreamly powerful master, who is proficiant at crowd control and attacking at a distance, we'll say about mid range. he has simple to imput combos, and very high damage output, but he is slow with close range attacks, and his options are severly limited once he runs out of tension. sin has 480 health as oposed to the standard 500 health.

Sin's two signature attacks are his beak drivers, but for the sake of simplicity, we will cover the details of those moves later, right now lets focus on his normals, which, by themselves, are pretty lack luster.

(L) x, x, x, combo stops jumps and is his main bread and butter when you arent trying to blast them to hell and back with a beak driver. if all three hits connect, you can jump and follow up no problem, with little chance of the oponents teching out. here's a combo that I do all the time.

(L) x, x, x, j, x, x, (air dash) x, x, y. stupid easy to input, hard to escape, great damage.

you can combo into beak driver with (L) x, x, y.

Sin's (L) x, x, x, is slow, and can be sidesteped pretty easily, if you get a clean miss, there's pretty much nothing you can do about it, and it isn't hard to sidestep his first hit. if the first or second hit is blocked, the oponent can side step out of the combo and punish, if you dont take the proper action to attempt to stop them. you it requires that you properly predict when the oponent will try to jump out if he hits, and what direction. you can stop sidestping by attacking with a (L) 4x, or 6x mid (L) x, x, x. for example, if the oponent wants to side step to my left after blocking the first hit of my combo, I do (L) x, 4x, and blast them with a beak driver.

(L) 4x is a slow, and wide horizantal sweep with his staff, made to stop side steping. it can be jumped over and punished, and if done at too close of a range, it may be out right snuffed, thanks to relativly long start up time. ot can punish sidestping from either left or right, but if the oponents side steps to the right, he has a greater chance of blocking or interupting the move. Izuna can actually outmanuver this attack, double sidestep toyouright, and punish you for cleanly missing you with the attack. you can cancel the recovery time with a beak driver if you hit an oponent, whther they are blocking or not.

(L) 6x is short ranged and launches, and can punish side step to your right only. you cna follow up with an air combo after hitting with it. a quick close range move, but very little range.

(L) 2x is a leg sweep, and is pretty much a desperate move when some one gets in your face, although one of sin's fastest moves and cannot be sidesteped, it can be snuffed ( sol's (L) x kick is faster, and will snuff it no problem). it can also be jumped over and punished. very short range too. can be followed up with a beak driver on hit.

his aerial nomals can be interupted and inputted again by an airdash, letting you do combos like (L) j, x, x, (air dash) x, x, x. his power attack in the air is a stomp. (L) 8x.

(L) 8x is a vault kick, where he kick the enemy by vaulting himself with his staff and kicking him. he's hard to hit while doing this, and you can iimplement this in combos. longer range than any of his other normals.

his power attack is a lungin spining kick, that, as far as I heard, can be blocked, but i might be wrong about that. some one please corect me if I'm wrong. it is a great tool

Beak driver (L) y is a fast mid range poke that can be combos into another blast by hitting y again. this move is the Sin's signature move, and is what makes him so deadly. it is very fast, and can be comboed into many different ways. when you get someone with it and the block the first hit, you can take a gamble and hit y again anyway, theres a good cance if they attempt to escape the blast they will get hit, even f they block it, it will do good chipp damage. the only clean way to avoid getting hit with the subsequent blast of the beak driver is for the oponent to jump out of the attack, where he may or may not be able to punish, I really don't know if he can in the situation. this move tales little tension and can lead to high damage combos. though it is very fast, it can be sidesteped and jumped over.

you can follow up these two combos off the beak driver blast.

(L) y, y, j, (air dash) x, x, y - very easy to do, decent damage

(L) y, y, (F) 8x, (L) 8y. - easy, but decent timing required. big damage.

(F) - free mode, lock off.

jump y is "poke it like no tomorrow". put it at the end of air combos.

(L) 8x is big beak driver. it has more start up time, does more damage, and cannot be jumped over. this mover can be used to finish combos, or get quick big damage for punishing. it is easier to be punished for missing this move, and it is easier to side step.

(L) 2x is a catch counter like the one Axl low has in GGx2 AC, where if the oponent hits you with a mive when it is active, Sin will counter the move. but it does not activate imeadiatly, so you must have adequate time to use it, best when recoverying fro getting upif Sin doens't catch his oponent, he will be vulnerable for a short time. can be followed up wih beak driver. use this move with caution, you don't want to miss with it.

(L) 4y and 6y are big energy orbs that sin leaves in place for a bit. I think they are used to limit enemy movement, and to prevent them from getting close to you. they can also be used for mix up purposes and in combos (but I do not know any combos involving them personally) youcan direct thrm directly in front of sin by starting them up with (L) 4y, than moving the stick to the 8 position. activate these balls too close to the enemy and they will smack you as Sin takes his time creating these.

and thats it! a basic guide on how to use sin. keep away from masters and conserve you tension. with Sin, it kind of all or nothing, if the oponent can't get the drop in on you up close, you can destroy them with Sin's easy combos, but when they are in Sin's face, his options aren't too good. someone like Sol can destroy sin up close if they are familiar with everything he can do. with out tension, sin is pretty awful, so beak driver when you cna and go for big damage combos while you can, and struggle to not get overtaken in clse range combat.

End of Guide.

whoo boy, I'm tired. I'll do the required editing later to make the guide complete. one of the best ways to learn how to fight a character is to play the character, so you know what he sucks at. either that or look at someone destroy a good player of the character in question.

Panda, can you drop us some hints on fighting Sin with Sol please? I know you know how to do it, I've seen you do it before, but the replay I had has been invalidated thanks to the ver 1.46 update. I don't remember if you can punsih beak driver. I never seen someone rush down a sin like you did with sol, you where hungering to tear him to shreds.

I'll work on the basic strategy guide later in the week.

EDIT: Can't...S rank...protect the gate...using Sol on hard....why is it so difficult...damn it.

[Blackgenma]

lol a friend of mine saw that in a little Tokyo shop in SoCal or something

I've got large scans of it on my hard drive from the book.

blade, what kind of scans do you have from this book? do you have the entire book scaned? or only parts of it?

[Aedesyr]

Got this game today, and damn it's totally awesome!

I'm just angry that this EU release came so late, and the only thing that's worse is the marketing here I had to order it from the UK because i didn't find it near me.

(And no DLC in sight here at the moment, all we have is the Trailer....)

Definitely; on europe the releases usually sucks, i got my copy of gg2 before his release(don't ask me how) 'cause theorically here it's not even out in normal stores.

I hope they'll put dlc soon, i can't wait to try out the new map.

Feel free to add me if ya want to do some matches from time to time.

As for the matchups asked by the blade, here's a little guide(too lazy to do a decent one):

Tribe guide:

Sol>valentine

valentine>ky

ky>sol

izuna<everyone else

paradigm>everyone else

master guide(from the best to the worse):

sol

izuna

sin

ky

valentine

paradigm

don't really trust the masters guide, cuz every master is good if mastered.

Excpet for paradigm.

he is awsome against servants(his y can wipe out servants crowds)but on 1vs1 he sucks. Badly.

[Blackgenma]

Definitely; on europe the releases usually sucks, i got my copy of gg2 before his release(don't ask me how) 'cause theorically here it's not even out in normal stores.

I hope they'll put dlc soon, i can't wait to try out the new map.

Feel free to add me if ya want to do some matches from time to time.

As for the matchups asked by the blade, here's a little guide(too lazy to do a decent one):

Tribe guide:

Sol>valentine

valentine>ky

ky>sol

izuna<everyone else

paradigm>everyone else

master guide(from the best to the worse):

sol

izuna

sin

ky

valentine

paradigm

don't really trust the masters guide, cuz every master is good if mastered.

Excpet for paradigm.

he is awsome against servants(his y can wipe out servants crowds)but on 1vs1 he sucks. Badly.

I don't think I can trust everything on the tribe vs tribe list there. as far as Izuna's tribe getting owned by everyone else, thats not true, it too can handle valenitne's tribe pretty damn well, and it can stand up to other tribes in general, thanks to it's overall balance. the only problem with it is the units not be able to rip their oponents to bits. I mean, it's not like the tribe has drills for melee servants, and the tribe has no overwhelming weakness, like Sol's. playing with Izuna's tribe give's Izuna enough leeway to handle the match in a variety of ways, unlike Sol's who's units suck so much your very limited on your playstyle. valentine's unit cannot dominate Sol's if he has all three of his low-level servants out, which most good players don't bother doing when playing Sol. now, keep in mind, when I say dominate, I 'm talking about COMPLETELY DESTROYING the enemy army, something that Sin and paradigm can accomplish very easily against Sol. Both Izuna and valentine have better units than Sol, but not so much that Sol cannot have some leeway in his actions, letting his servants do some of the work for him.

Your master teir list is something I partailly disagree, but it is effective if your trying to account for overall master strenght. if you take in account of how the masters can take advantage of their skills and servants, Sin would be above Sol and Izuna due to being easy to use, good skills, being able to kick the enemy's ass where they can't reach him, hiding behind his servants, and having combos that are the hardest to burst out of. he also does obscene amounts of damage. no doubt he can get owned when someone gets in his face, even more so when surrounded, and this is magnified when the oponent knows how to aproach him while dodging his crap. He is garbage witout any tension, and has slightly less health than then the stonger characters in the game, but the odds are overall in his favor in most cases. let me break it down, this is by no means a formal guide though.

Sin- this guy gets too much reward for too little effort. he can be crushed, but you really need to know what you are doing to do that to him. it's not that he's the overall most dangerous master, he just is the one who is the most dangerous with the least effort.

Sol, with Izuna - they are RIGHT behind Sin. Sol has lots of reasons why he's better than Izuna slightly, not even including that he has self buffs, one of them that cannot be romoved by dispell, and when he has that particular buff on, he can own the likes of everyone in the game, even Sin. 100 dragon install + crimson jacket = run away from sol.

with 100 dragon install, Sol becomes the best zoning character in the game, which sounds absurd, and it is, because it's true. gunflame is like 100X better in this form (cost less, comes out as fast as it is inputed [you can blast someone at point blank with it, and they wont be able to counter it], goes farther, moves faster, still eats all other projectiles, and he can shoot it out more rapidly), as well as pretty much every special move he has. to top it off, volcaninc viper, and a move list that is the best at breaking guard out of the cast.

Raven and Ky, -I'll put my money on Raven being slightly better than Ky. they are a step below the two above, but not by much. even these guys, if played well, can counter the three above them no problem.

Valentine. -yeah... I don't like valentine, but her zoning game is pretty strong, and she can do some great juggles, so she totally beats out paradigm

Paradigm. -ugh.

however, your teir list is accurate in terms of how dangrous the masters are when used to their fullest potential Aedesyr, with the execption of Raven not being in there. Raven, as I stated above, is probably above Ky. keep in mind that Ky can handle himself against pretty much anyone in the game in most situations though, so don't underestimate him. Sol is pretty much the only character who can do inescapable block strings that will break your gaurd and you can't do anything about it. I have not seen this often, but it he can do it, he's insanly good at keeping the preasure on, and he isn't as vulnerable on the offensive like Raven is, and he's got VV to boot.

I'll try to get more indepth about this subject later though. if anyone has anyting to say about what I stated above, feel free to call me out on it.

EDIT: just in case you didin't see my request above within the wall of text I will say it again.

Panda, can you drop us some hints on fighting Sin with Sol please? I know you know how to do it, I've seen you do it before, but the replay I had has been invalidated thanks to the ver 1.46 update. I don't remember if you can punsih beak driver. I never seen someone rush down a sin like you did with sol, you where hungering to tear him to shreds.

I need to get better at getting in against sin. I can handle him partially, it's just I want to know all the tricks there are to moving in on him.

[Aedesyr]

i am aware my "guides" sucks, and that's cause i'm too lazy to write more than that. The masters guide was referring only to brute strenght; valentine's the master i love more and i put her almost at the bottom. As for the tribes, that's referring only about my experiences. With izuna, my troops never did anything good. They have a decent mana cost, but surely that's not making them better. They really flaw on defence, his armors get destroyed a little too fast. I guess they are better than sol's anyway. I can't really say anything 'bout sol cause i never use him. Sin...is awfully strong. he deals too much damage with a minimum effort. But he can be punished easily due to an overall lack of speed.

[PandaKingEX]

Sol actually doesn't have any in-escapable block strings. In fact, you can sidestep out of any of his strings at pretty much any point. The biggest problem here, though, is online latency. Even with the best connections, you're probably still getting a tiny bit of delay, that is pretty much unnoticeable to a human, but it's enough to go from sidestepping and punishing Sol consistantly, to eating guard break nonstop. Your best bet against Sol online is to try and jump out of his strings, since even if you do get hit, you will be able to recover quicker.

[Fenrir Werwolf]

Okay, maybe next month I'll get a copy. And my social life will over.

[Blackgenma]

Nifty, I should test that out sometime. I could have sworn kou2007 did an inescapable combo string on me, I will jump out of them strings than. but screw sol, what about sin? how do you get in his face while dodging his garbage? I have a rough Idea, but me need some pointers.