[CPEX] Relius Clover Gameplay Discussion

[NecroTheReaper]

Can you also help me with my question from earlier about if falling j.C>microdash>rising j.C is an actual fuzzy IOH or if the ai is just stupid?

[Myoro]

I could answer this myself when I get home, but I'm not completely sure what you're asking us to test. But I have to ask; why not just get the computer to attempt this fuzzy using the playback function while you try block accordingly? If it works on you then it's prolly a legit fuzzy.

[NecroTheReaper]

Good point. I just hate having to rely on playback functions to test stuff xD. I was tryin to find a more versatile fuzzy since j.B>dj.C>j.2D>j.B wiffs on a lot of the cast if not done perfectly. Falling j.C>rising j.C has some strict timing (you really have to delay as much as possible) but it worked more frequently.

[Myoro]

Does it actually work? Is it corner only? is it punishable? does it combo into anything good? This could be big. I love microdash shenanigans.

[NecroTheReaper]

Well either the ai is just stupid or I cant get it to work on myself ._. I can block low and make the second j.C wiff fairly easily.

[Myoro]

Hmm... bizarre.

[NecroTheReaper]

Anyway, away with failure, one success Ive had is 22B+2D oki after a midscreen j.214B ender. Seems to cover all bases except -maybe- no tech. Mostly used it yesterday with a few matches against Errol's Rachel

[Myoro]

I've had marginal success too! close 5B->3C->superjump+6D->falling j.B->j.8D->2C->6C->41236B->5B->5C->superjump->j.B->j.C->j.236C->j.214B looks as if it'll work as a cross-up combo (I've gotten close to getting it to work

 

I think a lot of other stuff could come from this I think you can use j.C after superjump+6D to raise the height of things a little.

 

I think you can use airdash->j.B->j.236C->4D after j.8D to get a quicker followup in the corner.

 

but I know you can do microdash 5B after j.8D which could lead to 236C to get a better corner followup.

 

Tragic thing is if you mis-space it and don't cross up with j.B you won't be able to continue into 2C (to my knowledge)

[NecroTheReaper]

Speaking of crossups, since our AA isn't any sort of reliable of the opponent is flat on our face, how do you deal with those slow, should be punishable crossups? Drives me insane when I can see them slowly jumping over my head but don't know what I can do about it since switching sides takes a while but don't know how to punish.

Edit: you can also crossup with the regular midscreen combo by doing j.B>662C>6C>41236B>66B

[Myoro]

Jump and grab? they never seem to see that coming.

 

Idk, I've been experimenting with summoning Ignis during the opponent's blockstrings and if you use 4D you can catch it pretty easy. (I think Ignis should get head invulnerability during 4D honestly)

 

Question for you Necro, that OD combo you mentioned for 6900ish damage that starts with 5B->236C->214A->665A+B->etc

 

Can you add in a 3C after the 5B and still have it work? (I haven't been able to pull it off for the life of me)

[NecroTheReaper]

You can only have 1 move before the 236C sadly. Its a tough confirm, but worth it. Yes, if you feel more comfortable with 3C starters, its still possible for like 200 less damage. If you have more than 1 move, 2C>6C>214A has always seemed to drop.

And yes, Ignis needs to protect that sexy face of hers, so why 4D doesnt have head autoguard like her daughter, idk.

[NecroTheReaper]

After watching the recent RYO footage on Jourdal's channel, while the pros outweigh the cons for gad leis change (if this is even a real concern), since gad leis now floor bounces, wouldnt this mean crossunder combos for corner positioning are gone? Lately I've been doing j.B>662C>6C>41236B>66B a lot, and I just wanted to hear if you guys think this wouldn't work anymore. I kmow you could still do 214C and just jump over, but the ignis meter man.

[WakeUpDP]

The 6B relaunch into corner switch will probably still work off gad leis, so in your situation you should be able to do 5B>3C>41236B>6D>66B>j.B>j.C>etc, and if you can't relaunch by doing your j.B>662C>6C>41236B>66B replacing  41236B by CT will work in that situation for damage/corner switch for a little heat cost.

[Myoro]

So I've been seeing 1.1 Gad leis getting both hits in scenarios where 1.0 usually drops the second.  Can anyone confirm if the move always links to the second hit now?

 

Also I've seen it link into 3C off of high prorated combos if that was ever a concern for anyone. (which also means distortion opportunities for pretty much any combo you can dream up, because 2C->6C->41236B is in everything.)

 

So How does a Relius accurately bait DPs? Can it only be done by observing another's patterns or is there some other method or formula for doing so? I really don't like my frame traps and gimmicks being blown up at the most random times. It's easy enough to bait on wake-up, but is there anything I can be doing while pressuring to get better results?

[NecroTheReaper]

First thing about baiting dps and bursts is knowing your opponents ttendencies, so it might be difficult the first round unless they're using a character that breaks under pressure. If they know how to IB, do something that would normally be safe and pretend to continue pressure by doin an empty dash/jump. Wake up dp's (not our man xD) are fairly easy to anticipate, and most of our oki keeps us safe anyway. If you do 214C oki, this is where everyone tries to burst/counter assault/dp since if tney IB the 2nd hit there's a 1f gap. You can screw this up by thtowin out a 2b very quickly after and possibly getting a free combo without having to worry. One thing that I find funny is how mamy people burst this vinum setup: vinum>6C>236A.

[WakeUpDP]

So I've been seeing 1.1 Gad leis getting both hits in scenarios where 1.0 usually drops the second.  Can anyone confirm if the move always links to the second hit now?

 

So How does a Relius accurately bait DPs? Can it only be done by observing another's patterns or is there some other method or formula for doing so? I really don't like my frame traps and gimmicks being blown up at the most random times. It's easy enough to bait on wake-up, but is there anything I can be doing while pressuring to get better results?

It can still whiff if done too early, and to add on NecroTheReaper's post 3C>2D>jump/barrier>stuff is pretty good too and other things similar to it where you let Ignis commit and take the hit for the team.

[NecroTheReaper]

I just noticed the atrocious grammar in my post... enough to make a grammar teacher cry. Other setups I use that are dp safe is the 22B+2D oki after a midscreen j.214B ender. It will punish dp's, beat rolls (combos on back roll) and meaty neutral, but loses to no and delay tech. Still, with j.214B oki being kinda bad as it is, beating these options aren't bad. Just note: this does NOT work on Izayoi's frikkin justice phorizer, and probably loses to a -few- other options like sledge and growler.

So, who's excited for getting damage AND oki anywhere on the screen in 1.1? I feel like for 2600 ignis meter we could get ~2.8-3k into 3C oki with leis changes.

[Myoro]

This guy is. Tbh j.214B oki isn't so bad if you airdash in. sure it plays out like a guessing game but 5B/3C/6D will catch most attempts to escape and at least keep them blocking, Problem is DPs.

 

So, I've been experimenting with various uses of 236D. It can be used in neutral along side a backdash to catch jummp/dash ins, and it can be used after j.xD in zoning to keep ignis safe from foes expecting 214C or j.6D or j.2D while also locking the opponent down.

 

I swear this move's become a million times better since CSE

[NecroTheReaper]

Because its the most rediculous looking low hitting move, since it can smack them in the face but still claim to hit low. What is this, guilty gear dust moves? Its really funny how many people stand block 236D when she's in the air.

[Poultrygeist]

This is probably a retarded ass question, but what the hell is the use for 214D anyway.  Thing is slow as dirt now and I can't help but think there's way better oki options especially given that we have a much faster non Ignis overhead that cancels.  I rarely see Relius players actually using it.

[Elochai]

gimmicky unblockable setups.

[Myoro]

The only potential use I can see for it is in this vid: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXoLWTDp-d4

 

As for how that glitch is done I have no clue...

[WakeUpDP]

Only saw it used in matchups vs hakumen, the idea they probably had is that the move would start slowly on the opponents tech and you would meaty with 5B and gatling with 2B for the "unblockable" continue with 2C etc.

[NecroTheReaper]

Also take into consideration that I think all characters were unlimited in that video. 214D is a gimmicky tool, but if you're playin a bit defensively, setting it up full screen can catch people who dash into low block. Still not very useful sady

[Myoro]

Is there any difference between Unlimited and Normal versions??