AC: General Discussion

[Gonzales]

well, hmm.... i may not play against the best players in the country, but i still have been thrown out of j.2S. i also own the GGXXAC Break Encyclopedia (plus the Japanese skills to read it). before i posted i read the Encyclopedia to see if it had throw invincibility. Book says no. then i poped in my copy of AC and tried to throw Dizzy's j.2S. I throw it. you have to be slightly above Dizzy to do it though.

be happy who ever you play dosn't know that though.

as far as trow invincible stuff, i've heard that there are differences in some move properties in the arcade and console version. The latest update for the arcade is AC+ wich is basically the console version pluss Kliff and Justice

[fatewalker]

I am not sure about what you trying to say..... but, i was playing the US Version of AC when throwing Dizzy's j.2S and the Encyclopedia covers the JP Arcade Version. so.... i guess that Dizzy's J.2S is NOT thrown invicable in the US Console and JP Arcade Versions of AC? i am confused.....

[Gonzales]

i guess i dint word that correctly, i was thinking that perhaps there's some confusion because some moves are different in the Arcade version. I personally have never been air-trown out of J.2S in the arcade, but i have been air-trown out of it in the home edition

[fatewalker]

oh i see what you are saying now. I've never played the Arcade Version, so i am not sure. but, the Beat Encyclopedia is the Frame Data book for the Arcade version. and it dosn't list J.2S as having throw invincability. but i havn't played the Arcade. so again i've never confirmed it. so i see what your saying now.

[woki]

No, it doesn't have anything to do with whether it's arcade version or console or whatever.

no, it is throwable. it's just harder to air throw since Dizzy's hit box moves up a bit. this puts dizzy higher then her opponent.

Just like you, I didn't believe that her j.2s had throw invincibility.... until I saw THIS VID.

If what you are saying is true, then all Yossan had to do was to just get used to it and then he should've been able to airthrow Dizzy without any problem, but as you can see in the vid, he didn't bother airthrowing her at all.

Rather than going for airthrow, Yossan was trying to beat her j.2s with j.p most of time.

Btw, Dizzy gets screwed when she's airthrown by I-no.

i read the Encyclopedia to see if it had throw invincibility. Book says no.

Although the frame data doesn't really say that, Dizzy's j.2s certainly has throw invincibility for some weird reason. I'd like to know why as well.

i poped in my copy of AC and tried to throw Dizzy's j.2S. I throw it. you have to be slightly above Dizzy to do it though.

The reason you were able to airthrow Dizzy while she was doing j.2s was probably because you threw her slightly before the startup of j.2s.

be happy who ever you play dosn't know that though.

Hopefully you won't say that to Yossan.

[4r5]

I loaded up training mode. Went in with Slayer and Dizzy as the dummy. I set Dizzy to Jump forward with j.2S, and with Slayer I backdash-cancel jump and attempt to airthrow Dizzy. I tried for like three minutes and could not airthrow Dizzy out of her j.2S. I'm going to stick to just 6P'ing or supering her j.2S. Maybe Dizzy's j.2S is throw invulnerable or maybe I suck at airthrowing; feel free to try it out yourself and come to your own conclusions.

[Hellmonkey]

It's throw invulnerable.

[Nehle]

Yea, it is. I did the same testing. I would have preferred a throw invulnerable ground move, but this is good to know nonetheless

[fatewalker]

if you say so nehle :D

[Gonzales]

so j.2S is trow invincible in the console version as well? thats awesome

[Gonzales]

okay so Nehle posted somewhere some basic bubble-loop setups that work on most characters and i wanted to practice that combo but i forgot where it was posted can somebody direct me to that post cause i cant find it anywhere

[zaeris]

What do you do if playing against friends who are able to read your tactics like an open book. the more I play dizzy the more annoyed I get, jhs that extend hit box which allows your opponent to air throw you from farer distance.............. (yes shake fist at INO) on another note does anyone have a usuage for 6hs frc?

[excelence]

@Gonzales : http://dustloop.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3175&page=4 ... on that page should be basic enough (;^_^)a

@zaeris : try to read em by leting them read you :D , and punch your face everytime u throw out that j.hs lol

and ... nah, never found a good use of it, bouncing is better than stagger on ch imo

[Stag.S]

What do you do if playing against friends who are able to read your tactics like an open book.

the more I play dizzy the more annoyed I get, jhs that extend hit box which allows your opponent to air throw you from farer distance.............. (yes shake fist at INO)

on another note does anyone have a usuage for 6hs frc?

Still not very good personally but the basic advice would go like "change tactics." If you friends can tell which fish you always summon, mix it up. If you throw out everything on oki and they know how long to block, delay some of the summons. I have a matchup against an I-No who's loads better than me and I always do better if I can keep him guessing at what I'm gonna do, teching at the earliest possible point usually ended in me being air thrown so I'd tech later and actually sometime airthrow him instead, the odd single time out of twenty airthrows he gets.

I also noticed that if you begin combos with a f.S and they're already crouching, they'd duck and it'd whiff entirely, and for the longest time I'd have that problem since the only combo I knew was K c.S F.S HS Icespike.

And it's nice to throw out that frc to show that it is there and make them wonder if you can follow it up. But can't you special cancel after the second hit of 6HS anyways?

[Double]

i think that frc is primarily to make whiffing a bit safer when a rushdown character iad's you.

[Gonzales]

thanks for the link excelence:kitty: @zaeris as for I- no air-trowing your j.hs you can always use yous j.2S since its trow invincible

[excelence]

@Double: isn't that just the same rules like 2hs? =|

[excelence]

got frustrated with gameplay level 1 question, what's you guys mind set when playing Dizzy? .... i'm so fucked up with my option and feels like playing as a scrubs, back when on Reload when i don't realy play her, i can usually do 2s(ch),air pike combos and now what i do is 2s, small combos, air throw tech trap/fish, and back then i do Frc ice spike combos, but now i'm only frc on block string to keeping up on pressure or to bait stuff, thought if the combo might actually kill i still auto gear up with the fish setup and i think i'm throwing to much Imperial Ray on my games ... it's like "go down and stay down when i'm throwing zoo at your face" for me ... the heck i want to do flashy combo thoo . any advice or should i punch my face everytime i do 2s(ch)->small combos

[Nehle]

Eh, most players do small combos, you see some players trying for air spike but that's risky, seeing as you need to confirm both the counter and that the player is positioned right, which is almost impossible, so you have to guess whether the air spike will connect or not. I think 2s > air combo is the best option, simply because it will always work, and it will get them off you. If you end with j.D you'll knock them away far enough to have good time to set shit up while you're still off screen on the ground. Flashy combo = corner rape to bubble loop As for Imperial Ray, eh, I feel the same way, if the opponent has the potential to gain momentum it's just bullshit unblockable and they're back on square one

[Cloud_1one]

the best combo isn't one that can do more damage, is one that is easier for you to do.

[Gonzales]

not to be offensive but when you get to top level play you need the best comboes. Anybody that wants to be the est has to invest time learning the best comboes,setups,oki ect. Its just the nature of the game i learned that the hard way in ST, GG is the same way.

[Kurokun]

For me when I play as Dizzy, my main objectives are to get a knockdown then mixup back to knockdown and repeat as well as play the match-up in Dizzy's favor, even though most of the time is running away and playing defensively until you get the opportunity to attack. I find myself usually thinking about making sure I can land a combo given the opportunity of hit confirmation and choosing the best possible option at the time. More or less its either getting that knockdown off of a combo to set up oki or getting some room to get summons out to do something and acting based on that. If I get the hit confirmation I combo, if not I -try- to throw as part of the mixup. I find myself using IceSpike FRC a lot and when it hits I followup with an appropriate combo or if blocked I either continue pressure or back off and regroup. I'm using bubbles to create a illusion of space against my opponents cause if they get hit and launched, I get a combo off of it. For some reason I use Scythe with or w/o FRC and sometimes get tick throws off of them or pressure coverage. And now I'm trying to utilize 2D special cancel more often to throw IceSpikes, Scythes, summon Fish, etc. and integrate that more into my playstyle. I pretty much use ODs for unblockable setups every once in a while but rarely, I should use it more though if given the chance. But when it comes down to it, once I can get some summons/projectiles going, I go on the offensive and play a bit more aggressively. Do what you can do given the situation right? Its funny though cause there happens to be another Dizzy player here in the 808 and our gameplay styles differ somewhat. He doesn't use tension for FRC/RC much if ever but for ODs instead and while his mixups are solid they are standard fare and not really varied much. I think sometimes that he could do so much more but in the end its like "if it ain't broke, it doesn't need fixin". As far as flashy combos go, I gotta agree with Nehle saying: -Flashy combo = corner rape to bubble loop- Me, I like doing IceSpike FRC loops across the screen if given the chance, lol. I think that if you can land a bubble loop that kills off your opponent, that has to be the most flashy/hype combo you can do with Dizzy.

[Gonzales]

yeah defenatly bubble loops are awesome, Dizzy overall is a cool character and she isn't bad. I really think that if Dizzy had better defence she would be high tier, unfortunatly in AC your opponent catches you once you lose like 3/4 life:(

[Cloud_1one]

not to be offensive but when you get to top level play you need the best comboes. Anybody that wants to be the est has to invest time learning the best comboes,setups,oki ect. Its just the nature of the game i learned that the hard way in ST, GG is the same way.

i wasn't talking of use or not damaging combos or the best combos , what i said is that you have to do the combos that are easier for you, for example i use bubbleloop,or icespike/frc combos (doing 200/230 dmg aprox )but beacause i can do them easier (specially icespike frc combos, that combo is less situational), but if anyone can't do them then is better to try a combo that he is sure about when and how do it.

[excelence]

yeah the most flashy combo i can pull is that corner rape bubble loop(easy to do it with only a knock down requirement ) but because of the proration of 2k, it ain't do much damage , and heck. baiting ch is feel hard like hell when i intend to do it.