Dazardz Posted February 17, 2014 Posted February 17, 2014 Need some advice on this. So I heard I should be using a lot of 5A's during blockstrings with Tsubaki, and I actually got mashed out of that quite a lot recently. Am I doing it too late or can some characters actually mash through it? Overall I need major help when it comes to blockstrings, when I watch myself play, I see that I use 5D way too much during blockstrings and people can just see it coming after a while. And using 5A all the time doesn't work forever either, and my brain doesn't decide how I should try to open up the opponent either. And if anybody has/had problems with people jumping out of your blockstrings a lot, what did you do to stop them?
Kiba Posted February 17, 2014 Author Posted February 17, 2014 (edited) So after a 3 month leave, I finally have CP again and I just ran into a serious problem. I can't seem to pull off any dash cancel 5C/2C combos. Mind you, I've been playing Extend as of late, so basically I'm learning how to walk again. Tsubaki doesn't have dash cancel stuff. You must be referring to her 623C > j.214A(w) > Dash 5C > 2C combos. Following up with 5C > 2C is quite difficult, not to mention the difficulty changes with the character you are playing against too. It is recommended you use Dash 5A because it's much easier to connect, although it does result in about 300 less damage. As I said in the combo discussion thread, there is a visual cue where following up with 5C may be easier. There's a certain height they need to be at when you input it. If you input it too fast, 2C will whiff. Too slow, and 5C will whiff. To help you with this, make sure you have that green bar set so you can see how much time you have to follow up. Also, if this helps, I'm usually looking at the opponent after 623C because I want to try and measure the angle they are at when I'm trying to get dash 5C. Need some advice on this. So I heard I should be using a lot of 5A's during blockstrings with Tsubaki, and I actually got mashed out of that quite a lot recently. Am I doing it too late or can some characters actually mash through it? Overall I need major help when it comes to blockstrings, when I watch myself play, I see that I use 5D way too much during blockstrings and people can just see it coming after a while. And using 5A all the time doesn't work forever either, and my brain doesn't decide how I should try to open up the opponent either. And if anybody has/had problems with people jumping out of your blockstrings a lot, what did you do to stop them? This is where Stage 3 blockstrings will come in. At this point if people are mashing you out of your blockstrings, you'll have to mix in frame traps (i.e 5A > 5B), and possibly use 5BB > 2BB > 5C© > 6BB to keep players honest in blocking low. Charge cancels are useful but if you become heavily reliant on it, it'll be easy to poke out. You can do something like 5B > 5C > charge cancel > kara throw, and mix it with 5B > 5CC(Delay). It may also sound like you need to be quicker with your pressure? If using too many 5As no doubt someone will get mashy. 5A(x2) > Throw, command grab, 6A is a much faster form of mixup. They can mash out of followup 5As if you delay it for a little too long. I have this problem as well and it mostly doesn't work out because I usually get thrown out, so I just use frame traps. If you're looking to use normals to stay in against an opponent's barrier, you'll probably have to mix in 6C into your arsenal, or something like 5A/5B > IAD j.CC. There's a variation of blockstrings listed in the strategy guide which will useful to you too. When it comes to people jumping out of my blockstrings, it really depends. Most of the time I'd go for an air throw (especially if they're trying to jump away from my charge cancels) or delay low attacks to stop them. Of course with those who jump away/IAD away midscreen, there's most likely nothing you can do about that. On a few occasions, I've used 6C and it's downed an opponent several times, and although it stopped them from jumping out, I just missed following up my attack lol. You'll have to tack onto the player's habits though. Look at this example: You use 5CC > 6B. Opponent manages to jump out of your 6B startup. So try 5CC > Charge cancel. If they jump you can air grab, or alternatively you could do something like 5CC > 214B/214D I suppose. Edited February 17, 2014 by Kiba
Monarch Posted February 17, 2014 Posted February 17, 2014 Tsubaki doesn't have dash cancel stuff. You must be referring to her 623C > j.214A(w) > Dash 5C > 2C combos. Following up with 5C > 2C is quite difficult, not to mention the difficulty changes with the character you are playing against too. It is recommended you use Dash 5A because it's much easier to connect, although it does result in about 300 less damage. As I said in the combo discussion thread, there is a visual cue where following up with 5C may be easier. There's a certain height they need to be at when you input it. If you input it too fast, 2C will whiff. Too slow, and 5C will whiff. To help you with this, make sure you have that green bar set so you can see how much time you have to follow up. Also, if this helps, I'm usually looking at the opponent after 623C because I want to try and measure the angle they are at when I'm trying to get dash 5C. I was actually referring to her staple air dash combo, which I forgot the inputs for right now but it relies on 2C. Which for me either whiffs, or when I dash in midair, my opponent will be too far away. Was much easier to pull of in CSE.
Zouf Posted February 17, 2014 Posted February 17, 2014 Need some advice on this. So I heard I should be using a lot of 5A's during blockstrings with Tsubaki, and I actually got mashed out of that quite a lot recently. Am I doing it too late or can some characters actually mash through it? Overall I need major help when it comes to blockstrings, when I watch myself play, I see that I use 5D way too much during blockstrings and people can just see it coming after a while. And using 5A all the time doesn't work forever either, and my brain doesn't decide how I should try to open up the opponent either. And if anybody has/had problems with people jumping out of your blockstrings a lot, what did you do to stop them? All charge cancels are negatives on block (varying from +0 (after 5CC) to -5 (5B/2B)) and -8 (5A/2A). So don't use it too much against mashing opponent.
Monarch Posted February 18, 2014 Posted February 18, 2014 Have a few examples: 1. 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214B > 5C > 2CC > air dash> j.5CC > 5C > 2C > 236B > 214B > 22B 2. 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214D > 2CC > air dash> 5C > 2CC > j.5C > jump cancel > j.5CC > 214A Basically, I get caught on the air dash every time. Not as easy as it was on CSE. Question is what am I doing wrong that makes it whiff?
zaeris Posted February 18, 2014 Posted February 18, 2014 snip....... As kiba says use frame trap against masher Her Gatling option provide a few simple one My route while it is usually on the fly it something like. 5a x2 5b basic frame trap and reset for people who just mash, plus on hit it can reset into a 5 b starter 5c > 6c catches 4 frame start up and jumps or so.. Can't remember the exact frames it catches 5b> 3c for true masher you can score a fatal counter this way lol, start with 5b 6a if it's mashed on frame one change to 5b 3c. You can also jump cancel off 5b and go into a simple fall jc I guess in generally if you know what your opponent is thinking apply different strategys
Daedron Posted February 18, 2014 Posted February 18, 2014 Have a few examples: 1. 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214B > 5C > 2CC > air dash> j.5CC > 5C > 2C > 236B > 214B > 22B 2. 6A > 5CC > 6BB > 214D > 2CC > air dash> 5C > 2CC > j.5C > jump cancel > j.5CC > 214A Basically, I get caught on the air dash every time. Not as easy as it was on CSE. Question is what am I doing wrong that makes it whiff? You can do two things wrong in the first combo: 1. Hitting 5C too high. 2. not delaying 2CC enough. There's only one thing you can do wrong in the second combo: 1. Not delaying 2CC enough. Turn on hitstun bar in training mode and try hitting every single move at the last possible moment.
Kiba Posted February 18, 2014 Author Posted February 18, 2014 Even if you got the IAD j.CC down, the first combo will drop at the 2nd 214B.
Airk Posted February 18, 2014 Posted February 18, 2014 5c > 6c catches 4 frame start up and jumps or so.. Can't remember the exact frames it catches This one is actually terrible - it's a 7 frame gap. People can jump out easily enough and if they're actually just mashing 5a they'll hit you. The only thing this beats is people who are -reacting- to a 'gap' in your blockstring by trying to mash. In general it is better to used a delayed 5C to frame trap, or do 5B > 6B which actually will beat most mashes (may lose to characters with 5 frame 5As)
zaeris Posted February 18, 2014 Posted February 18, 2014 (edited) This one is actually terrible - it's a 7 frame gap. People can jump out easily enough and if they're actually just mashing 5a they'll hit you. The only thing this beats is people who are -reacting- to a 'gap' in your blockstring by trying to mash. In general it is better to used a delayed 5C to frame trap, or do 5B > 6B which actually will beat most mashes (may lose to characters with 5 frame 5As) You are correct although I feel jump out won't be easy probably will test and see if it's character specific Edited February 18, 2014 by zaeris
Monarch Posted February 18, 2014 Posted February 18, 2014 You can do two things wrong in the first combo: 1. Hitting 5C too high. 2. not delaying 2CC enough. There's only one thing you can do wrong in the second combo: 1. Not delaying 2CC enough. Turn on hitstun bar in training mode and try hitting every single move at the last possible moment. Does delaying 2CC and 5C apply to most combos that involve it? I've been practicing for a bit, and the timing necessary seems ridiculous to me. I drop it 50% of the time.
Zouf Posted February 18, 2014 Posted February 18, 2014 Yes you have to delay 2CC in every combo, except in the character specific one 6BB > 214D > 2CC
Monarch Posted March 10, 2014 Posted March 10, 2014 So what's the secret to using j.5D in the middle of an air combo, and then picking the combo back up with j.5B? I still have yet to figure this out.
Daedron Posted March 10, 2014 Posted March 10, 2014 You pick it up with j.C, not j.B. You can always do it early in the combo after a full charge 22D or hitting an opponent that's high in the air with 236D when you're midscreen, or just 22D in the corner using 6C > jc > j.D > j.C > 5C > 2C > etc. Just don't bother doing it on Amane since it doesn't work on him at all. Doing it on Tsubaki, Jin, Tager, Rachel, Arakune and Bang is also not really worth the trouble as the timing is harder.
abadlime Posted March 10, 2014 Posted March 10, 2014 So what's the secret to using j.5D in the middle of an air combo, and then picking the combo back up with j.5B? I still have yet to figure this out. You pick it up with j.C, not j.B. You can always do it early in the combo after a full charge 22D or hitting an opponent that's high in the air with 236D when you're midscreen, or just 22D in the corner using 6C > jc > j.D > j.C > 5C > 2C > etc. Just don't bother doing it on Amane since it doesn't work on him at all. Doing it on Tsubaki, Jin, Tager, Rachel, Arakune and Bang is also not really worth the trouble as the timing is harder. Isn't he talking about air combos? Pretty sure he's referring to stuff > j.CC > j.D > j.B > stuff. As long as you super jumped and proration won't kill it, there's really no secret to it in timing as far as i saw.
Daedron Posted March 10, 2014 Posted March 10, 2014 Ooooohhhhh, right. Yeah, there's no timing involved outside of hitting j.B as fast as possible after j.D, it takes a while to get used to but you shouldn't be dropping it once you "get" it.
Monarch Posted March 10, 2014 Posted March 10, 2014 Ahh, so a sumper jump is necessary in order to get j.5B to connect? Or does my height above the opponent count as a whole?
abadlime Posted March 10, 2014 Posted March 10, 2014 Ahh, so a sumper jump is necessary in order to get j.5B to connect? Or does my height above the opponent count as a whole? Height probably. Though, i'm not sure where a super jump isn't necessary leads to a more optimal combo with j.B stuff.
chzchan Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 Is there a trade secret to getting microdashing down consistently without fumbling into 6A, 6B, or 6C while applying pressure? This has always been a problem for me.
Errol Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 dash 6a always works there is no trick, you need to get the timing down. Can't press the button before the direction is released. As simple as that, though it's not that simple if done after another move it's simpler because you the dash can be buffered during the recovery of whatever, effectively reducing how quickly you need to be between releasing the direction and pressing a button in order to get a frame perfect dash 5X
Zouf Posted March 29, 2014 Posted March 29, 2014 6C > very short delay > B : 6C~B No need to plink anything, just press B just after you pressed 6C and it will work fine
TheGreatReptar Posted March 29, 2014 Posted March 29, 2014 There's a pretty big window for 6C kara grabbing. You basically input the 6C, then B immediately afterwards while still holding C down. Try it like you're plinking in SF4 first, where you want to hit B the frame after you input C. Once you get comfortable with that, you can start trying to delay the B input slightly. The longer you end up delaying the B input, the farther the kara-grab actually goes. Just can't overshoot it or the throw won't come out at all.
mikeatsgarbage Posted March 31, 2014 Posted March 31, 2014 hey fellas, apologies if this is already been discussed or common knowledge by now...but im trying to work on my air pressure but I cant seem to get this to work out. im trying to air dash in, j.CC cancel with a D charge for bait and then go into another j.CC I knoq the second j.CC will not combo with her first j.CC...that's not what im trying to do...just trying to create more pressure in hopes that the second j.CC will hit but it will never combo into her ground normals for the life of me. is it strict timing or does this not work out? keep in mind im in training room with ragna...so is character specific hitbox something to factor in...?
TheGreatReptar Posted March 31, 2014 Posted March 31, 2014 j.D has really bad landing recovery. If you hit a croucher low enough, I believe you can connect 5A after. You have to be really close though. If you're in the corner and can confirm the second j.CC, you can do j.CC>j.214C>623C>delayed j.214A>5A/5C>2C>ground ender. Doing j.214C ends up negating j.D's landing recovery, but the only thing you can do afterwards in 623C which forces you to do a pretty tricky combo.
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