[Xrd] Slayer Gameplay Discussion

[Snatcher]

I had success by doing a slight delay between the initial jH->jD.

[Loli-Zero]

So there are lots of ways to convert into crosswise loops.

- 2HS RC 214K-K works

- K Mappa RC 214K-K works if it hits them airborne (after 6P CH or when calling out a backdash for example)

- CH 5P-6H-214K-K works if they are not to low.

- CH 2S-214K-K also works if they are not too low.

- J.214K RC 214K-K should work in certain situations. (The JP wiki linked above lists j.D-j.214K RC into CW loop as an air to air combo for example).

- and of course AA 214K-K will often set it up. In this case you can do 214K-K, 6HS-214P-K, 6HS-214P-P for over 200 damage meterless.

In all other cases you can only loop once. You can do 6HS-214P/K-P or 6HS-214P/K-K into a short air ender for more damage and KD (this is tricky sometimes though). You can also sometimes do 6HS-214P/K-S, 5S into an air combo. I haven't tested that ender too much so I don't know how damage compares.

In conclusion, CWH loops seem really strong and very practical. They are also swag as hell.

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[.ShotS]

Some combos translated off of Hase's twitter. They're from October but i don't think they were posted here yet.

 

Midscreen
Throw RC 6H Crosswise j.S j.H j.D [JC] j.K j.S j.H j.D j.2K j.P j.D - Faust, Sol. Use j.P after jump cancel on Sol.
2K Mappa RC Crosswise 5H j.S j.H j.D [JC] j.K j.S j.H j.D - Faust
2K c.S f.S Mappa RC Crosswise 5H j.K j.S j.H j.D [JC] j.S j.H j.D - Axl, Pot. Use c.S instead of 5H on Pot.
Throw RC 5H j.K j.S j.H j.D [JC] j.K j.S j.H j.D j.2K j.P j.D - May, Chipp, Pot, Bedman, Axl, Ky


Corner
2K Mappa RC step 5H 2H c.S j.S j.H j.D [JC] j.K j.S j.H j.D j.2K j.P j.D - Chipp, Ky, Pot, Bedman
2K Mappa RC step 5H 2H c.S j.K j.D [JC] j.K j.S j.H j.D j.2K j.P j.D - Faust

[Loli-Zero]

I think anytime it says j.D [JC] j.K it's supposed to be j.D j.2K j.K [JC]

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[.ShotS]

I think anytime it says j.D [JC] j.K it's supposed to be j.D j.2K j.K [JC]

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No. It's actually a jump cancel.

[Loli-Zero]

My bad, I'll have to check those out in that case. Sounds cooool

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[fogelstrom]

I had success by doing a slight delay between the initial jH->jD.

Helps but for some reason Slayer is to low after the j.P, j.K so I get forced landing and can't jump cancel sometimes. Too inconsistent. Maybe I'm not cut out to play Slayer as I get weird issues with all my combo attempts

[Loli-Zero]

The combo Mac listed doesn't have a j.P? Maybe the extra hit is letting you drop too low

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[fogelstrom]

Oh.
Well it was a modified version when you do 5K, 236K, RC, 214K~K as started instead of just CWH.
It's just weird that I get so low that I get forced landing. I haven't seen it happen to anyone else.
But on the other hand I learnt you can do
CWH, 5H, j.S(1), j.H, j.D (delay), j.2K, j.K, c.S, sj.S(1), j.H, j.D
The timing is strict so it's in no way worth it but always fun with re-loops

[dreamyrobot]

So that last throw combo works on potemkin without a question but on may and KY (I haven't attempted it on anyone else) they float too high to land that first jump d before the jump cancel. Anyone figure out how to fix this?

[bluzenblazen]

Does anyone have advice on the zato match up? I feel lost. I don't think I can bdc jump and faultless to get away midscreen after I am knocked down. I am for sure losing this match in neutral though.

[Wirya]

So I've heard that his Undertow has armor now. But apparently it doesn't?? (I've tested it myself.) Still, YRC-ed undertow might be useful, like for baiting a reversal backdash on the opponent's wakeup. 
 

 

So there are lots of ways to convert into crosswise loops.

- 2HS RC 214K-K works
- K Mappa RC 214K-K works if it hits them airborne (after 6P CH or when calling out a backdash for example)
- CH 5P-6H-214K-K works if they are not to low.
- CH 2S-214K-K also works if they are not too low.
- J.214K RC 214K-K should work in certain situations. (The JP wiki linked above lists j.D-j.214K RC into CW loop as an air to air combo for example).
- and of course AA 214K-K will often set it up. In this case you can do 214K-K, 6HS-214P-K, 6HS-214P-P for over 200 damage meterless.

In all other cases you can only loop once. You can do 6HS-214P/K-P or 6HS-214P/K-K into a short air ender for more damage and KD (this is tricky sometimes though). You can also sometimes do 6HS-214P/K-S, 5S into an air combo. I haven't tested that ender too much so I don't know how damage compares.

In conclusion, CWH loops seem really strong and very practical. They are also swag as hell.



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Are you sure it's practical now? (Since like Maho said, it was extremely situational in #R, and AFAIK it doesn't get any easier in Xrd.) But if that's true, then yeah, swag! :D 

[Loli-Zero]

I did it multiple times off different starters in a set with my buddy Saturday night. So yeah. It got a lot easier because most of starters I posted involve RC and RC adds time slow and untech time. But even the non RC seem easy so I dunno. Something else might of changed. Once you've got the combo down, you can basically notice anytime you hit an enemy with CWH in a combo at the right height. I actually found a few of the routes I posted while playing.

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[Wirya]

Wow I forgot about RC's time slow. Yeah, I think aiming for a CWH loop is a good thing to do, since you can confirm visually if it's possible to go for it or not (the 2nd hit of CWH looks delayed). And if it isn't, you can just follow the CWH with a standard air combo. 

[Loli-Zero]

Exactly. If they look low or you're nervous about the situation you can just do a normal CWH combo. If you get into the second dandy step, and your nervous about executing CWH-5S-j.k-j.D you can just pilebunker. But overall the damage is so good I really think it should be a BNB in any situation it works

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[testament101]

Geez....It's been so long since I've actually posted on this site...Just played Xrd for the first time...Does this character have a high-low game anymore? I've seen J.2k as maybe an IOH but other than that, is his mixup just going to be dash mixups primarily?

[Loli-Zero]

Hit throw and left right is probably all your getting meterless. Off of whiffed 214P-S setplay you can go for hi lows by mixing up its late and 2K or 2HS. Otherwise you can spend meter on a roman cancel for 6K. 6K is more of a throw bait now

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[.ShotS]

Geez....It's been so long since I've actually posted on this site...Just played Xrd for the first time...Does this character have a high-low game anymore? I've seen J.2k as maybe an IOH but other than that, is his mixup just going to be dash mixups primarily?

Off j.D or 2D ender you can setup P Dandy-> Under Pressure whiff ->

-> Meaty It's Late link into 2K -> combo

-> 2K -> combo or 2H -> combo in the corner.

-> Throw/Bite

-> Dash c.S -> combo

 

Off of throw you're only really getting meaty/throw. The whiff Under Pressure stuff seems decent though.

[Wirya]

Don't forget Undertow. I haven't tested it yet, but it might be strong when YRC-ed.

[Loli-Zero]

It's late won't hit meaty off 2D if you combo into it. So you can't link 2K. You do get meaty its late if you hit someone with sweep in neutral though.

But even when you combo into 2D, you still have a strong hit, throw, dash through mixup off that setup. And you can still use its late as a throw bait and combo if it counter hits.

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[bluzenblazen]

I know it's early, and I am usually not a pessimist, but does Slayer feel lacking in this game to anyone else?

[RoBoBOBR]

No way =) He's just different from AC and +R days. He was mixup character, now he's more of a footsie character IMO. He has tremendous normals (2K, K, cS, 6H to name a few), quite a few ways to deal damage (throw RC inflicts almost as much pain as SSSS mappa RC stuff), and long/short dashes and YRC hold quite a bit of depth IMO.

[Villainous]

I know it's early, and I am usually not a pessimist, but does Slayer feel lacking in this game to anyone else?

Coming from Accent Core Slayer and not playing +R, he feels incredibly neutered. 

Lets look at the changes: 

- Can't combo off overhead without 50% meter now. 

- 2K doesn't link into 2S 2D or really anything. No more chain into 2H. Have to chain to 2D for a knockdown. Much harder to hit confirm because of that. 

- 2S lost upperbody invincibility. Went from having amazing anti air to somewhat lacking in anti air. 

- Only CH pile bunker from K dandy gives a combo now

- 2H range reduced. Can't really combo off of it mid screen without meter. Shorter or no lower body invincibility. 

- Lost big bang upper so no confirms into damage easily anymore. 

- Easier to mash out of bite and less stun time, can't really get damage off of it anymore. 

- Dead on time distance reduced

+ BUT HEY HE GOT HELTER SKELTER GIMMICKS

+ The long dash is pretty good I guess. 

Basically, his core gameplan changed. He's a poke character now in a game full of people with better pokes and shit they can put on the screen. Definitely a weak character just from my initial analysis. 

[fogelstrom]

- Can't combo off overhead without 50% meter now. 

Dust. But I know that you refer to 6K. Also you can combo from meaty It's Late.

 

- 2K doesn't link into 2S 2D or really anything. No more chain into 2H. Have to chain to 2D for a knockdown. Much harder to hit confirm because of that. 

2K, c.S, f.S links if you are in range of c.S.

 

- 2S lost upperbody invincibility. Went from having amazing anti air to somewhat lacking in anti air. 

Can't argue here. 2S ftl now. But you got 6P CH, Mappa, RC that gives nice combo. 182dmg if you only go for PB or 19X with air combo after CWH.

Also 5P CH, 6HS is nice.

 

- Only CH pile bunker from K dandy gives a combo now

CH P Dandy PB gives combo as well. It's wall stick so you can do same stuff as 5D6 but without the initial hitstun scaling

 

- 2H range reduced. Can't really combo off of it mid screen without meter. Shorter or no lower body invincibility.

All true. But it's good initial prorate and on CH you can combo into 6HS atleast.

 

- Lost big bang upper so no confirms into damage easily anymore.

Meh. BBU was so scrubby that I don't really care that it's lost. Feel more genuine now. Like you deserve it.

 

- Easier to mash out of bite and less stun time, can't really get damage off of it anymore.

You can still RC for some dmg in the corner. 214P-K works on slip recovery 2 if I'm not mistaken so if you're fast enough you should always hit it for an air combo.

Not meant to call you out or rain on your parade. Indeed Slayer is nerfed and no one can argue that he isn't. But he's far from neutered anyway. I'm certain he will get better over time when people find something interesting. Hopefully some good j.214214S tail setups :D

 

Also for some swag combo you can do c.s, f.S, j.D (IOH), j.214214S, c.S, f.S, DOT. Looks hella nice haha.

[RoBoBOBR]

1. You can combo off 6K meterless, on CH (crouching may be required).

2. 2K cancels into specials, links into cS, combos into 2D. Also +4 on block.

3. but now his 6P has above knees invul from the get go. (used to be waist up for first 6F)

4. 214PP gets you wall splat on CH. It's easily followed if you're close enough.

5. 2H invuls are exactly the same 5-14F

6. everyone lost their FB, duh

7. bite's good on RC

8. yeah, DoT's sad