[Xrd] King Ky - Gameplay Discussion

[qwerty]

Well keep in mind that even if the recovery is shorter, there's way more hitstop now which makes it easier to block confirm. It's kind of like Mark of The Wolves where a lot of moves don't have much recovery, but are punishable due to hitstop.

[Hintalove]

Jp bbs players also saying they think gs is faster, so there's probably something to that. I'm a new ky player so I'm not to uses to it yet but I hit a decent amount of them as ch against enemies mashing low whe I have them blocking in the corner. It's especially good vs axl I think.

[qwerty]

I just use 5D when I want to hit overhead. As long as you're not so far away that it's obvious as to what you're doing, most people confuse it for CSE.

[Hintalove]

I still like 5d for overhead. I was trying to say I use gs more in a footsyish way if I have a strong read because it converts better than f.s in most situations.

I have a question though; how big is the window between c.s and 6k on block, and how much advantage do you get on 6k. Also, is it worth aiming to meaty the 2nd hit of 6hs, or are the gains negligible?

[Fistmaster049]

I have a question

so its very clear that at certain heights 2HS will hit twice, however it seems in some combos that its better for Ky to only have it hit once and cancel out of the second hit into the follow up

Is there any reason in particular for this? e.g. more damage scaling?, opponent goes too high for follow up?

[xlolxlolx]

guard balance and pushback mainly

[Hintalove]

Yeah I think the horizontal push back is the main reason as your ability to stay close enough to hit c.s is key to finishing combos with ciel. If you d 2 reps of c.s 2hs hsvt, you will get f.s like 90% of the time when you try to finish with ciel.

[qwerty]

I still like 5d for overhead. I was trying to say I use gs more in a footsyish way if I have a strong read because it converts better than f.s in most situations.

Ah, I see. I too think GS is best used like this.

I have a question though; how big is the window between c.s and 6k on block, and how much advantage do you get on 6k. Also, is it worth aiming to meaty the 2nd hit of 6hs, or are the gains negligible?

c.S cancels in to 6K, so if it's not airtight it's pretty close. I don't know how much of an advantage 6K puts you at, since I always cancel in to ciel.

I don't know about meatying the second hit of 6H. Most people just sit there after 6H anyways (can't tell you how many times I've done 6H xx 6H for oki).

[xlolxlolx]

if c.s is still a lvl 5 move like it was in reload and 6k is AC ver then it should be air tight even on IB and should be +4 on block

6hs is pretty retarded since its +15 so people usually dont want to risk mashing out of it unless they make a hard read on you fucking up the dash in afterward

[BladeOfJustice7]

Is Machabo playing Millia a temporary thing or he switched mains?

[Notwhoyouthink]

You know seeing that combo video seeing as how it was generally pretty clear. It deff looks like people are cutting combos pretty short. For the standard DP loop they are going for, instead of ending it with just stand s, to seal. Why not stand , to seal, the slide? It deff looks like you recover before the opponent recovers there. Also what does a sealed regular stun edge do to the opponent? Is it enough to combo after it? Also judging from the video the opponent actually recovers before ky does after air ride the lighting at least mid screen.

anyway hopefully some cool stuff soon. Everything so far has been pretty simple/obvious it seems.

[BladeOfJustice7]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t5vpoAFYLPM#t=109

Interesting combo off 5d, thoughts?

[Notwhoyouthink]

Speaking of dust combos.. i wonder if something like forward dust, and instead of doing f+hsX2 to whatever do something like, f+hs, IAD s, hs, then combo, or even f+hs, jump dustX2 land combo

[qwerty]

You know seeing that combo video seeing as how it was generally pretty clear. It deff looks like people are cutting combos pretty short.

This is symptomatic of a larger issue, that being that combos in this game basically all do good damage as long as you get enough hits in. The damage scaling doesn't seem to really kick in until the 8th hit or so, which is part of the reason I've been saying you're best off just getting an easy knockdown.

For the standard DP loop they are going for, instead of ending it with just stand s, to seal. Why not stand , to seal, the slide? It deff looks like you recover before the opponent recovers there.

When you hit the seal OTG, nothing will combo (non-black beat) unless you RC. Even then, you won't be relaunching for a VT loop or anything.

Also what does a sealed regular stun edge do to the opponent? Is it enough to combo after it?

It causes a bit more hit stun than a non sealed Stunedge. If you confirm it and RC, it leads to combos even full screen.

Also judging from the video the opponent actually recovers before ky does after air ride the lighting at least mid screen.

That would be correct. Quite honestly, unless it's going to kill, you should never do air RTL in combos. I also have some issues with people falling out after the first few hits but for now I'll attribute that to me being a scrub.

[qwerty]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t5vpoAFYLPM#t=109

Interesting combo off 5d, thoughts?

Best combo I've seen yet. I'll have to try that. It does as much damage as a VT loop more or less and you get the positioning of ending with a seal; basically, the best of both worlds.

[Notwhoyouthink]

I didnt say anything about hitting seal OTG im confused.

[qwerty]

I was referring to the effect on hit. Against standing or crouching opponents, it staggers. Against airborne, OTG or re-stand, it forces an OTG slide effect.

Ending a VT loop with a seal will always cause the slide effect because your opponent will be airborne when it connects.

[Notwhoyouthink]

Right but you can hit a seal in the air and then link an attack before the guy hits the ground. Watching the videos with the DP loop, where they end with a stand s, into the air, then seal, ky still looks like he is recovering before the opponent hits the ground. So intead of just doing seal to big fireball, you should be able to link a say slide then big fireball to tack on some extra damage.

[BladeOfJustice7]

Best combo I've seen yet. I'll have to try that. It does as much damage as a VT loop more or less and you get the positioning of ending with a seal; basically, the best of both worlds.

I was thinking the same thing, I was hoping you'd see it. It looks slightly intricate to pull off, I see 5d combos evolving into something else entirely. I saw HEVEN place a ball right before a 5d, he dropped the combo but ti seems to make his 5d safe® if blocked and if it hits he can do a midscreen impossible dust combo that *might* have full screen corner carry.

Btw who was that Ky player, he even beat eki-chan in the same tournament.

[Dandy J]

even if you could get a slide after seal and still make ultra lightning sword meaty, i think id just omit it to make sure theres enough time to jump and do a non-disrespectiable late airdash mixup. actually i wonder instead of slide if you could do a raw vt again

[Goldenrody]

I was thinking the same thing, I was hoping you'd see it. It looks slightly intricate to pull off, I see 5d combos evolving into something else entirely. I saw HEVEN place a ball right before a 5d, he dropped the combo but ti seems to make his 5d safe® if blocked and if it hits he can do a midscreen impossible dust combo that *might* have full screen corner carry.

Btw who was that Ky player, he even beat eki-chan in the same tournament.

It's Oppia aka Kuni, who played baiken in previous games

[Hintalove]

I'd just like to point out that dipper into cse results in a non meaty cse(or dc cse) unless you burn meter to slow down time. If you choose to end the combo with ciel, you can get the proper meaty to go for more complex jumping mixups.

I'll just post a couple things I've found over the week. You can get probably a rep of vt loop + a c.s ciel finisher off of air throw into the corner and rcing it into falling j.s. Combo is throw rc>falling j.s c.s 2hs vt > ender.

You can also yrc dc air stun edges and get combos off them with proper spacing.

The Jps are also experimenting with mid screen throw combos using gs> 3hs > gs > vt looking for a way to make it worthwhile to rc mid screen. Also rcing j.hs off if anti air combs to land and get a kd. You can also rc air vt and air dash j. D land vt into 2h vt off of air combos. Prob doesn't kd light chars though.

I have another question though. Does using a super halt meter gain like rcing? If not wouldn't it be safe to assume that converting combos via sacred edge is superior to rcing in lost normal situations?

[BladeOfJustice7]

It's Oppia aka Kuni, who played baiken in previous games

Oh ok thanks, I didn't recognize that Ky. I'm guessing he must've been a beast with Baiken in AC/ACR.

[Killey]

I'd just like to point out that dipper into cse results in a non meaty cse(or dc cse) unless you burn meter to slow down time. If you choose to end the combo with ciel, you can get the proper meaty to go for more complex jumping mixups.

I'll just post a couple things I've found over the week. You can get probably a rep of vt loop + a c.s ciel finisher off of air throw into the corner and rcing it into falling j.s. Combo is throw rc>falling j.s c.s 2hs vt > ender.

You can also yrc dc air stun edges and get combos off them with proper spacing.

The Jps are also experimenting with mid screen throw combos using gs> 3hs > gs > vt looking for a way to make it worthwhile to rc mid screen. Also rcing j.hs off if anti air combs to land and get a kd. You can also rc air vt and air dash j. D land vt into 2h vt off of air combos. Prob doesn't kd light chars though.

I have another question though. Does using a super halt meter gain like rcing? If not wouldn't it be safe to assume that converting combos via sacred edge is superior to rcing in lost normal situations?

So does RCing VT or air VT restore air options? The air VT RC air dash j.D combo was an old #R combo and required a jump install. I'm just wondering if jump installs are still in the game and/or RCing VT and air VT restores air options to bypass the need for jump installs.

[BladeOfJustice7]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t5vpoAFYLPM#t=109

Interesting combo off 5d, thoughts?

Best combo I've seen yet. I'll have to try that. It does as much damage as a VT loop more or less and you get the positioning of ending with a seal; basically, the best of both worlds.

Another variant:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y22au5szg3g#t=151

EDIT:

How's the recovery on jd? Is it as good as ACR or more like AC? What happens to a grounded character eating a jd CH? Does it cause a floating effect?

Edited March 16, 2014 by BladeOfJustice7