[Xrd] Bedman Gameplay Discussion

[DaiAndOh]

Just a quick fyi if you haven't realized, all dusts illuminate red.

Good shit.

[Skyheartxia]

Just a quick fyi if you haven't realized, all dusts illuminate red.

Good shit.

oh wow, i hadnt realized. silly me!

[Skyheartxia]

okay so here are bedman's specials and supers.

one request for you guys, if anyone has definitive information on Bedman's black fog super, i would appreciate it.

Collapsed: Bedman's Special Moves and Supers:

 

Task A: 236P       

- Throws out the head.

-  fast recovery

- hits mid

- will not hit most characters on crouch (potemkin will still get hit)

- can shorten the orbit by moving toward them as it will come back faster after hit.

- can connect into c.S or j.S on hit.

 

Deja Vu (Task A): 214P       

- shadow version of Task A and Task A Prime

- 214P after 236K = much less recovery than Task A Prime

- projectile will come slightly higher than where the mark is

- can't do this at the same time as task a prime or task a.

 

Task A Prime: 236K       

- Another version of the head throw, identical animation

- noticably more recovery than 236P. 

- orbit is slower than 236P

- Bedman will teleport if the head hits or is blocked; teleport location will be directly where the head hits

- if it hits on return, bedman will appear behind them.

- ground ver will teleport you on  ground, air version will teleport you to the same height as the head. (you could IOH pot with a low air 236K blocked and instantly pressing H in the air)

 

Task B: 236S       

- Bedman turns into a spiky spinning top and spins at the opponent; think full body rachel 3C.

- Hits mid.

- 1-6F active frame guard point, can be YRC'd in this time too.

- often used for pressure, can be RC'd for safe pressure in recovery frames. (you could also 236S RC > throw for a cheap 10%)

- Air version has a downward diagonal path. Yellow RC point is later on air version

- can be used as a pseudo low altitude air dash in pressure/links

 

Deja Vu (Task B): 214S       

- easy to use on ground because the seal is placed at the END point of the 236S(it will be where bedman is standing at the end of the move)

- air version is trickier, doesn't seem to stick in the same place (often ends up near the start of the move, meaning it cant be used as pressure.

- float version is a little more useful, a low altitude one in the corner can be used for mixups.

 

Task C: 236H       

- bedman raises himself in an arc and slams his bed down on the opponent. Overhead.

- ground version has some degree of guard point after startup.

- air version not really  a neutral tool, as diagonal means some pressured miss and bad recovery. used as a air combo ender, granting a pressure option after oki from deja vu C.

- air version cannot be TK'd or used at a low altitude; must be input above bedman's head height when standing or it will not come out.

- not a good anti-air, due to the way the hitbox/arc is, will often be beat out by big air pokes.

 

Deja Vu: 214H       

- hits MID. this is the mixup/pressure tool we all love

- good oki and mixup tool after an air Task C as an ender.

- you can deja vu C and then ground task C as soon as it hits.

- ideal placement is at the highest point of Bedman's double jump, so it cant be easily broken and can be used as in the area surrounding it.

- will come out in the direction of the enemy, not bedman. so you could IAD over them and deja vu C for a hit behind them.

 

Helios (clock super) 632146H             

- Bedman's wake up (funnily enough. see..alarm...wake up) reversal option. 

- Strike invincible, but not throw invincible. 

- no guard point in early frames etc so can be meatied.

- + on block. 

- can be picked up by c.S or j.S depending on ground or air hit quite easily, but will not connect into 1H on close ground hit.

 

Black Fog super 632146S             

- Unblockable

- If hit while black fog is active, or thrown, it will fade away. 

(i have VERY little info on this, due to the patch changing it so heavily)

 

[KBnova]

Thanks for posting the info on Bedman, wondered about his normals and special properties. Do they even have frame data up for any of the characters? It would be very helpful if there were any.

[Skyheartxia]

Thanks for posting the info on Bedman, wondered about his normals and special properties. Do they even have frame data up for any of the characters? It would be very helpful if there were any.

at this moment, there is no frame data recorded or even suggested to be noted down. i'll keep a look out and post it here if i find some. most players dont state a real frame number or anything on BBS, usually just say "frame advantage" which is a shame. but if anything pops up i'll add it here. hoping it does soon.

[SoWL]

The only way to get proper frame data is from the mook or 60fps videos, and the latter requires a lot of effort beyond actually recording the video. Other than that, it's nigh-impossible to get the data just by playing in the arcades (even the sparring mode isn't as good as proper console training mode).

[Skyheartxia]

some random tidbits of information:

without a any sort of RC, Task C is punishable by potemkin buster if Pot IBs the hits. this is not the case with FD, due to pushback.

j.K airdash down forward j.H is a tight way to continue a blockstring on an opponent who is FDing. if they arent, you can j.S instead of j.H whilst falling to accomplish the same blockstring reset. 

Deja Vu C YRC in the corner seems to be the best oki with tension, due to the options it gives off it, allowing you to get mixup off. 

236K (teleporting task A) 's air version seems best used close to the ground(possibly TKable? it looks like it), as it allows instant overheads if it connects. (teleport in j.S airdash down forward j.H seems to be the best option off this)

Task C's guard point runs out soon after he takes off the ground, not enough to be anti-aired immidiately, but a late AA could catch you (faust 6P is ridiculous against it). so its a risky move in neutral. Air task C still a combo ender, no real uses found.

 

 

thats all the information i have today! the more i find out, the more i'll tell you guys.

[Appledash-]

Does anyone have any footage of Bedman's fog super thing actually connecting? The few times I've seen him use it the opponent pokes him and it goes away.

[Jocelot]

Jeah, his boogieman super (Hemi Jack?) looks so meh right now. The monster stalks the player very slowly and it dissapears on hit so unless Bedman turtles a lot I don't see him pulling it off. I saw a few players attempt to use Hemi Jack>YRC, but even then that's 75 percent of your tension for something you're not guaranteed. Then again it's still early, I'm sure maybe Bedman can use Hemi Jack and keep the opponent out long enough with his projectile+1/2/3 HS normals long enough to score a hit.

 

I do remember seeing it happen once, however... when the creature touches the opponent, clouds swirl around them and they fall to the ground (I think from the Xrd Overdrive/IK compilation video). Very different from the one at the loketest which instantly caused dizzy, lol. 

[Skyheartxia]

Does anyone have any footage of Bedman's fog super thing actually connecting? The few times I've seen him use it the opponent pokes him and it goes away.

worst part is...the fog has a hurtbox too, lol. so it gets blown up pretty quick. i havent seen any reliable setups, other than relying on 236K to teleport you in, and thats a HUGE risk for 50 meter. better to keep it for our reversal which doesnt work well in the matchups its needed in.

[Skyheartxia]

i guess double posting isn't as bad after twelve days...

 

HOW TO FLY: A GUIDE NEEDED BY R-KELLY PROVIDED BY BEDMAN PLAYERS. 

when you jump, press 8 again and bedman should do a little stop in the air and then hold 1-9 (the direction you want to go to glide in that direction.) you can do this after certain air moves too without needing a normal jump input. so JS > float 9 direction would be JS > [9] like a jump cancel from whats been explained to me. this part of bedman's movement is pretty vital in neutral and combos. so practice it when the game drops!!!

 

**MONTH 1-2 BEDMAN COMBO LIST**

 

Collapsed: Combo List:

Meterless

2K > f.s > 5H (1) > Task B (236S) (replace 2K with 5K or c.S and it still works)

2K > 2S > 5H (1) > Task B (236S) (replace 2K with 5K or c.S and it still works)

2K > f.S > 5H (1) > 2D > Task A (236P)

2K > c.S > 2S > HS > 2HS > Task A (236P)

2K  >  5H (2) > 1H > Task C (236H) (replace 2K with 5K or c.S and it still works)

5P/6P> 5S> Task C (236H) (from 6P, this works, just you get an aerial Task C) 

5D~8 > JD>JD>JS > float 9 direction > JP > JS> Task B aerial (236S) (it's technically possible to 9JPJD, but they tech before Task B????[will find out more at some point])

Throw > 3H > Task A or A Prime (236P or 236K) 

Throw > f.S > JP or JK > JS > land > c.S > Task C (236H) (Corner only, doesnt work on light characters. especially Millia)

Throw > 2P > f.S > JP > JS > float 9 direction > JPJS > Task B Aerial (236S) (the hitconfirm for this combo is f.S, just saying. Doesnt work on Venom or Zato) 

Throw > 5K > (JS > float 3 direction > JS)x2 > Task C(236H)  

Throw> 5K> (JK) > JS > float 3 direction > JS> land > 5H > Task C(236H)  (omit the JK for lightweight charas)

 

Meter Required

[RC/YRC combos]

 

2K > f.S > 5H (1) > Task B (236S) > RC > 6H > Task C (236H)

2K > 2S > 5H (1) > Task B (236S) > RC > 6H > Task C (236H) (replace 2K with 5K or c.S and it still works)

2K > 5H (2) > 1H > delay Task C (236H) > RC > 6H > Task C (236H) (replace 2K with 5K or c.S and it still works)

2K > 5H (2) > RC > 5D~8 > JD>JD>JS > 9> JP > JS> Task B aerial (236S) (replace 2K with 5K or c.S and it still works)

Throw > RC > delay JS > land > immediately JP > JS > float > J6S > c.S > Task C (236H)

Throw > RC > 5K >  (JS > float 3 direction > JS)x2 > Task C

Throw>  RC > 5K> (JK) > JS > float 3 direction > JS> land > 5H > Task C(236H) 

Throw > RC > 5K > (JS > float 3 direction > JS)x2 > JS > float 6 direction > JP > JS > land > c.S > Task C (236H) (gives 35% tension!!!)

[Helios Related] (thats the clock super)

 

6H > Helios > air combo (it's craft your own here, pretty much anything works off it aerial....)

2K > 5H (2) > Helios > air combo (replace 2K with 5K or c.S and it still works)

c.S > Helios > air combo (only works when c.S hits an aerial opponent)

 

Counter Hit Combos

 

5D > c.S > walk under > 5S > 5H (2) > Task C (236H)

5D > 5H > Task A Prime (236K) > c.S > 5H (2) > 1H > Task C (236H)

 

​Air CH Combos (Midscreen)

 

JS > float 6JS > Task B Aerial (236S) (basic air-to-air JS CH combo. its perfectly possible to just JS CH > 236S if float isnt desireable)

JP > JS > float 9JP >JH > Task B Aerial (236S) (if the opponent is close to the ground Task A Aerial (236P) works better for neutral after combo)

JP > JS > float 9JP > JD (you can apparently Aerial Task C after JD to catch air tech????)

JP > JS > float 9JP > Task C Aerial (236H) (does not work on venom or lightweights.)
c.S air hit > 5H (2) > sjc > JP > JK > JS > 9JP > JD

c.S air hit > 5H (2) > sjc > JP > JK > JS > 9JP > JH > Task B Aerial (236S)

 

​Air CH Combos (Corner)

 

~JP > JS > float 6JS > land > c.S > Task C (236H) (whilst not specified, this comes off any thing that starts with a CH and launches and requires a super jump cancel to land the JP. example c.S air hit counter in corner. used to punish jump out button pressers apparently works on baited reversals. also possible from a close range 6P air hit CH > 5H (2) > sjc) 

 

[Skyheartxia]

next time on Bed Bits.... i will try and go into as much detail as i know of how to play ground and air neutral and blockstrings. sorry for the delays i work a lot and JBBS is kinda useless so i have to re-watch as much as possible between the two.

[Sanity]

Thanks for your work.

[Skyheartxia]

This has been warranted for about 3+ months so i guess ill get down to it. (note: i will add shadows for reference once i find a good quality video where the bedman isnt OBSCURING IT LIKE HECK. its hard.)

 

Seals and You: Bed Bits

 

Bedman's seals are an integral part of his character and gameplan. These seals, which are created from using a special move (236X) can be used to replicate that move as a mid hitting projectile which will come from the seal as a shadow. These shadows benefit bedman's pressure, oki, neutral and combos somewhat. Here's what the seals look like/where they come from.

 

Task A seal:

Your most common seal you'll be throwing out, which comes from Task A (236P). The deja vu version which comes from the seal (214P) is used in neutral heavily as it's a fast, quick extra projectile on the screen. Not really useful as a starter because low hitstun/heavy proration, but if it does hit, it gives you the chance to get in. Placement of these is paramount; they dont really cover too much of the screen so using them effectively to control space is needed. 

(Note: if Task A [236P] clashes with a projectile or is hit by your opponent; YOU WILL STILL GET THE SEAL.)

 

 

 

Task A prime seal:

This seal comes from Task A Prime (236K), the teleport head throw. One of your most valuable tools for getting in because of the hit/guarrd teleport... the seal isnt anywhere as good. Do note that this seal looks exactly like task A's seal except with half the face obscured by a dash-esque animation, and as both can be on screen, you need to remember how to differentiate. The deja vu shadow (214K) isn't as good as its Task A counterpart, as it has the same startup/animation as 236K, which is longer than 236P. However, you can use this to catch opponents off guard in neutral and bait them.

 

 

 

 

 

Task B seal:

This seal comes from the spinning top special, Task B (236S). As 236S is more of a move used in combos rather than neutral (being unsafe on whiff might be the reason, also having better options too), this seal's use is pretty simple. If you use 236S in a ground combo, use deja vu (214S) as oki to begin your pressure. Its a fast, multi hitting projectile, so...just do it. It doesn't really give you the time to get fancy with airdashes and mixup, so go for standard mixup > Task C. With the air version, if its low enough to hit a standing opponent, it makes mixup just that little more confusing. If it's not, it's best left up there as an anti-air/air neutral deterrent until you need to use Task B in a combo again/ or have to commit to a bait.

 

 

 

Task C seal:

Arguably one of the most important seals. Can be used as an anti-air rarely too. This seal is a pretty simple one to explain; when you hit with Task C and get a knockdown either from a random Task C (236H) in neutral, deja vu this (214H) and get free oki and mixup. Devastating to the opponent in the corner, this is where you want your air combos to take you and end with Task C and get this. Not only does the shadow version from the seal look alarmingly like an overhead but hits mid (cause projectiles), it also can be YRC'd for even more disgusting mixup. This is your game plan optimized; Combo > corner carry > Task C ender > hope you have meter to YRC deja vu the seal > get the best mixup into a combo ending with Task C and repeat. because the shadow from this seal takes the same arc as Task C, knowing the distance/hitboxes of Task C and Deja Vu are essential points to Bedman's game.

[Jocelot]

Is it just me or does it seem like Bedman has a hard time fighting Ramlethal? For two kinda neutral heavy monsters, it seems like Bedman can't really get his gameplan going once Ram gets hers. Like, it seems like in order for Bedman to make some momentum, he at least has to set a seal up off Task A bedball or something but Ram can instantly nullify it with her own projectile. And it seems once she has a sword set it instantly cuts off Bedman's means of approach, the sword angles seem to cover all of Bedman's best ways in lol.

I dunno how right I am, just kind of a one-off observation. 

 

As for good matchups, I heard somebody saying once that they think Bedman might have an edge over May, maybe.

[Appledash-]

I suppose he needs to get his strong pressure game rolling quickly, since Ramlethal has no defense, and he should be fine. He's not fast enough to outmaneuver swords and if he plays from far away Ram can just set up.

Sent from my RM-917_nam_usa_100 using Tapatalk

[Skyheartxia]

I suppose he needs to get his strong pressure game rolling quickly, since Ramlethal has no defense, and he should be fine. He's not fast enough to outmaneuver swords and if he plays from far away Ram can just set up.

Sent from my RM-917_nam_usa_100 using Tapatalk

he has some pretty hilarious ways to get in on her. getting in fast is good but forcing her to use swords midscreen to kill teleport ball is also a great option

[Jocelot]

Gotta say, watching LOX's Bedman go to town on Roi's Sol put a smile on my face. He had the dude completely contained!

[Blade]

Got some questions about Bedman's Seals:

 

---How does dispelling the seals work?  Are they like Testament's where you can just poke them to dispel them? Or do you just use a projectile-type attack?

 

---Related to the above question, are the Seals anything that "absorbs hits" (like Dizzy's fish projectiles?) or does Bedman take the hit anyway?

[D.R.F.]

Got some questions about Bedman's Seals:

---How does dispelling the seals work? Are they like Testament's where you can just poke them to dispel them? Or do you just use a projectile-type attack?

---Related to the above question, are the Seals anything that "absorbs hits" (like Dizzy's fish projectiles?) or does Bedman take the hit anyway?

I have seen them removed like naotos traps

[Clousephinat]

Bedman seals are like Ky and Ramlethal seals, as well as Bridget yo-yo, but Bedman can use a seal more than just one time, unlike Ky's seals. Although from what I've seen I think it depends on the seal, boomerang seal lasts less than the rest of the seals, it seems.

[Jocelot]

Yeah I've seen Spinny Seal last long enough to be used twice in the same pressure string which is nice.

[KBnova]

Thats really good to know! I was wondering since I was watching some recent set matches with Roi sol vs Lox Bedman. and Lox was able to do double Task B/C used more than once in their matches. Thanks for info.

[Clousephinat]

I didn't know Mitsuru until now and I must say, he's REALLY good with Bedman, he doesn't even need the support of the seals at all to make good punishments.

 

Sigh... Almost no one takes Bedman seriously, I'm the only person who really sees great potential with this character?

[Jocelot]

I'm offended, sir. I've been backing the Bed since the beginning. I really just wish he got as much love as Ramlethal. You'd think with them both being new characters you'd see an equal amount of players exploring both. I mean seriously, what has Ramlethal got that Bedman don't got?! (don't answer that)

 

Mitsuru is a great player, though. From the small amount of footage I've seen. Now with him, LOX and Tsubu that makes 3 notable Bed fellows. There was also one that qualified for Arc Revo named Nakasu. I really want to see his Bedman in action and see what kinda tactics he's using.