[UNIEL] Byakuya

[drugtown]

i think that's one of the voice clips for his forward dash?

[Rhiya]

this is too weird

 

 

what does it mean when the game (byakuya?) says "chance!"

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2AbqJa9HZg

[y0shi]

Looks like the exact input is D~[b+C]~X.  Works every time provided you time the presses right.  The D doesn't have to be a charge, you can do like 5C~D or something to get an empty D press and it'll still work.

 

Wow, thanks man. Suddenly the 2C>5C blockstrings became somewhat more interesting.

[TD]

Seems cool and sort of useful to learn. I only managed to watched the video once while multitasking and can't at the moment. But if it offers a double overhead and some safety it could be legit. Doesn't look like a frame trap though.

this is too weird

 

 

what does it mean when the game (byakuya?) says "chance!"

Indeed forward dash, and switches between this and another voice clip.

He's warning is not to press the wrong button.

[Rhiya]

so, someone checked the code

it's confirmed as a feature, put in the game by fb

 

(apparently, byakuya used to have an air b+c, but that's a tangent)

[GcYoshi13]

so, someone checked the code

it's confirmed as a feature, put in the game by fb

 

(apparently, byakuya used to have an air b+c, but that's a tangent)

 

Can you provide a source? I don't think it's that easy to simply check the code.

 

It feels too inconsistent and finicky to be a feature, granted this whole canceling thing is weird as hell still. The weird GRD requirements make little sense.

[Tachyons]

It's a 'not a bug but feature' feature.

 

Basically you can do an action for a short amount of time (4 frames or so) after pressing D. Turns out his web followup moves can be performed after his FF if you input FF during the 4 frame window.

 

http://pastebin.com/uEjxZTUD

http://pastebin.com/FKHs1jdS

 

No I did not dig this up.

[Justice7541]

It's a move that was removed. The code basically blocked the game from checking for ABCD inputs during FF but it didn't block D + another button which is why the D press makes it work. There's no GRD requirement either, that was incorrect. All it takes is pressing D or Veil Off before pressing FF.

[GcYoshi13]

It's a move that was removed. The code basically blocked the game from checking for ABCD inputs during FF but it didn't block D + another button which is why the D press makes it work. There's no GRD requirement either, that was incorrect. All it takes is pressing D or Veil Off before pressing FF.

 

This makes a lot of sense now. Reading the code also helped clarify how this "bug" worked.

 

This is more of an oversight than a bug at this point.

[Shin Oni]

So is it supposed to be easier if D is pressed first? because it does come out if you're doing raw B+C then canceling but it doesn't seem consistent all the time. (there will be times i'll get about 3-4 of it in then it simply doesn't come out afterwards.)

[Zephyrion22]

This "feature" is really sick ! I really look forward to see what setup people will find with it.

 

I've found a pretty neat route for 3[C] overhead midscreen and  in the corner, again a modification of a pre-existing route but it's pretty cool

 

Midscreen close or half distance3[C]>236B>6B>4A~A~B>whiff jA/jB> 2C/dash B into known routes

 

In the corner :

3[C](>delay)>236B>6B>4B>214B~A~A into known routes (either quadruple webs, okizeme, or 236C enders)

or3[C]>delay>236B>delay>6B>4C~C~D>214A~A~A into known routes

 

This also works from A rekka at the right distance for the delayed routes. non-delayed versions of the loop don't work against Linne, so do the 214C follow-up on her instead when midscreen

you don't gain much damage from this, but you can set the D oki really easily, and it make 3[C] pressure much less risky since if it is blocked you're left at -7 from the first rekka at a reasonable distance. you can also do the second rekka and CS to extend your pressure, or go for web shenanigans. the delayed version also makes a very good frame trap, and you can easily confirm from a 236A/B counter !  It is therefore a lot more easier and versatile than the 214C follow-up, even though the latter  is still a valid and useful route, especially midscreen

[Coma]

In regards to the force function cancel:

 

I've found that you need to unlock the ability for you to do it by concentrating(neutral D) first and it doesn't matter how long you hold the button or how many GRD blocks you have.  After that, you charge his FF then right before it comes out, press any of the followups.  As long as you're doing D followups, you can do it consistently but if you do the A,B, or C followups(even as the web followups), you have to unlock your ability to do it again(D included) by concentrating.

 

Edit:  There seem to be more ways to gain the "charge" that allows you to do the force function cancels and ways to lose them.   You can lose it just by being in a crouching state for too long.  So crouching normals are fine as long as you weren't in the neutral crouching postion for a while before you pressed the button and as long as you cancel it as soon as possible.  Air assault, 214ABorC, 623ABorC, and the web>hop>ABorC also eliminate the charge.  

As for moves that store a charge:  214ABorC>ABorC; 214ABorC>ABorC>D; and concentrate.

[Justice7541]

Yeah I need to correct what I said before a bit.  It looks like just pressing D isn't good enough, you have to get an actual D action out of it.  Anyway, complete version of how to kara FF:

 

You will need a D "charge" (see below) to do this.  The kara itself isn't super complicated, the input is just [b+C] > A/B/C/D right as the flash happens.  The cancel window itself appears to be 19-23.  If done right you should see the flash and then Byakuya should immediately go straight into a web pull followup depending on which button you pressed for the kara (if you want B or C followups you will need to release B+C and press B/C again right away, otherwise you can keep holding B+C and press A/D and it'll still work).  Easiest way to practice is to just do 5D charge (only needs to be for a split second) > [b+C] > A or D.  In terms of when the D charge will give you a kara FF in practice:

 

You will get a "charge" enabling you to perform kara FF with:

- Web pull D followup (regular and from FF kara)

- Pressing D during a web pull EVEN IF it doesn't come out (i.e. if you do it too early or after you land)

- Neutral charge

- Veil Off

 

Moves that will NOT give a charge:

- CS (unless done at neutral since that will give you a charge for a couple of frames)

- Shielding (ground or air)

- Any other D press that does not give an actual D action (i.e. D durng other moves, 2D, air D)

- IW and IWEXS

 

Moves that will cause you to lose a charge (i.e. you will need to "charge" again if you want to kara FF):

- Any move that puts you into an actual crouching state

- Air assault (no matter how you input it, i.e. j.66, j.6A+B, j.6D)

- Any successful FF kara (other than D web set because that gives you another charge)

- 214 web set by itself

- 214 web set > pull > followup (note: pull alone doesn't cause you lose charge, see below)

- 623X

- IWEXS

- Being knocked down (being launched and air teching is okay)

- Round/match end (duh)

 

Moves that DO NOT cause you to lose your charge (i.e. you can still do kara FF without charging again):

- Waiting indefinitely (I tapped D then wrote this post and the kara FF still worked after)

- Messing up the FF kara itself (i.e. B+C actually comes out)

- Standing block (as long as you don't crouch, see above)

- Pressing down without going into crouch (i.e. while doing a special input, or doing it when you can't actually crouch, i.e. in the air)

- Doing a web pull WITHOUT a followup (i.e. 214X~X)

- 236X

- Being hit WITHOUT being knocked down (being launched is okay so long as you don't touch the ground)

- Ground assault (6D)

- Any movement that isn't listed above (i.e. attacking, regular jump, regular dash, etc.)

 

You do NOT need any special vorpal, GRD, etc. state.  In fact it still works while GRD broken if you still have a charge or you do the D web followup to get one.

[-Kef-]

Yo, this reminds me of thinking of having "unfly" activated in Marvel 2. This is sick, not broken, not amazing, not unfly, but it is pretty good.

[TD]

These requirements though......

[drugtown]

yo this FFC shit is strict

[Rhiya]

you have a fake frc, basically

who cares about the requirements lol

[TD]

l care. some of these restrictions can screw a player over just for having fundamentals. charging isn't exactly the safest thing in the world, and the special perk gained seems almost too easy to lose in a heated match. it's already not easy, last thing any player wants is to execute it perfectly but still lose because they had to crouch earlier. it's so subtle.

 

it's whatever right now, but good tactic or not l can see this being a problem in the future, or just situation specific, which would be ok l guess.

[Justice7541]

You only need to tap 5D for one frame to make it work.  It's not really unsafe in the slightest.  Worst case scenario is you don't realize you lost the charge and try to do it and get blown up since FF is like -27 on block.  Which is why I went through and tested all the things you could do to lose charge but really the gist of it is "if you didn't air assault, crouch, or do a special after you pressed D, you're probably fine".

[Shin Oni]

considering Byakuya's neutral is pretty good, there's plenty of ways for this to stay charged and keep the offensive going.

 

and i'm sure you can get knockdown setups with charge>B+C~whatever followup.

[-Kef-]

With enough practice, you can definitively get consistent with it. No problem there.

 

Just from early testing:

- normals after FFC followup can be canceled into a web, which allows for a second web followup.

- FFC~B is better for mixups, but has less range than FFC~A. FFC-B seems a bit hard to setup, you have to be pretty close to the opponent.

- It can still get mashed out like other strings, but tighter than most.

[Justice7541]

Since it's 19-23f cancel window and the followups themselves are around 8f startup, it's definitely super mashable.  That said it's still way harder to properly shield/punish on reaction than regular web set.

 

Also FFC~A whiff 2C low can be spaced so [b+C] will hit overhead if you don't FFC.  It's not an unreactable setup by any means but I'm willing to wager it'll work at least some of the time.

[y0shi]

About the D charge, most of your 623C setups gives you enough time to set up a web okizeme and tap D to enable the FFC, so it's not that hard to set it up imho.

 

EDIT: Oh yes, given that you're in the corner, of course.

Edited August 23, 2014 by y0shi

[GcYoshi13]

I know I'm late but I finished the video explaining this (even though we know mostly everything about it thanks to Justice)

 

Elaborated on what it is, how to do it, and why and how you should use it.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sM0LdAI6F1M&feature=youtu.be

[Justice7541]

You could do:

Whatever > 623C > 5C (need dash 5C against Merk, Gord, Wald, Vat, maybe a couple others) 214A~D, FFC~X.

I've been meaning to test to see if it's possible to do meaty D web > FFC~D > mixup. It's not DP-safe but it should be possible to get the first D web to hit (and drain GRD) while you set a second one and drain more GRD, then go into a mixup since FFC~D is something like +20 on block.