Hellmonkey

Of course they exist, but there is no good way to define them, and at the top level of play they are so close it doesn't matter.

I glanced over your post earlier today and felt I had to say something, lol. There were 43.5% A and S tier out of all of the quals, and 44% A and S tier in the finals. (Testament, Eddie, Slayer, Potemkin, Jam, Baiken) vs the rest of the cast, I got the numbers from the SBO thread's lists. NO THAT IS NOT WHAT I AM SAYING. How can your reading comprehension be this poor. My point is that they aren't fundamentally better. Tiers don't matter at top level play in this game. I'm not dodging anything, is it really that hard to understand. I've given the reasons of why I think this way. The examples of top players of "low-tier" characters being on the same level as top players of "high-tier" characters is to show that neither character is stronger than the other. It has nothing to do with the "lower-tier" raising themselves up to the "higher-tier's" level. Their potentials (which the tier list should reflect) are the same, it's in the hands of the player. .................................................. You're defining average level of play by people knowing "practical techniques and combos"? That's a bit vague, don't you think? From the person who completely missed the entire point I was arguing.

It's absolutely pointless arguing with you but why do you go so far as to make things up? What? Like I said... ~56% of the players is "a lot more"? You could have fooled me. Why mention statistics if you haven't looked at the numbers? Would you please try to have a slight bit of consistency in your argument? First you mention #R Ogawa and Koichi, who showed that top characters in Reload truly did rape even the top players of other characters. I point out that we don't see that at all anymore in AC, and you say OH BUT THAT'S EXPECTED! ??????? He's losing tons because even as one of the "S-tier" characters he hasn't got far in ANYTHING since last SBO, a player of his caliber in a game where those tiers really played a role at top level play would win much more, like we saw in #R. You're right, the tiers or matchup lists don't apply to top level play in AC, which is the level of play tier lists are generally created to describe, at the realistic but ideal level of play to show the potential of the characters themselves. (Except for your supposed "Average level" tier list? Still waiting on how we are supposed to define that.) I see you don't follow Japanese GG very much.

I guess the entire point went over your head. "High tier" in AC is not dominating the top players of lower tiers like they did in Reload, which had shown that they truly are stronger characters. Ruu and other "low tier" character players showing their characters can defeat even the best players higher tiers shows balance in AC. There is no "high tier" dominance like there used to be because the the game is balanced at top level play. These SBO results show that quite blatantly. Losing in the 23v23, G3 5v5, a-cho 3v3, SBO prelim that almost caused him not to qualifiy and then not making top 4 after he managed to.. how is he not losing tons? Except that all "high tier" characters don't win a great deal more often than they 'should' against good players of "low tier" characters...... How many tournaments with low tier characters doing extremely well is it going to take? edit: spelling

Average? How are you supposed to define that? So you're saying it doesn't matter who good players use because they could dominate with any character in the game? Meaning that every character is as good as any other character at top level play, because it doesn't matter who the character is with the top Japanese players? Your examples of #R Koichi or Ogawa (and especially AC Ogawa, who has been losing tons since last SBO) only help re-enforce this, don't they? Surely #R Ogawa was a great example of why Eddie really was S tier in the game, he would win most of his games even against the strongest players of other characters. Same with #R Koichi. However, we don't see that at all in AC. Hell, the only "S-tier" in the top 4 teams of SBO this year, En, who is easily one of the best players in Japan, was brought there by Anji... Instead of making already high-tier characters appear better than their tier reflects, aren't we just seeing "low tier" and "mid tier" looking as strong as "high tier"? edit:spelling!

Optimistic? Realistic? How much so? Get as optimistic as possible and you have people playing "bottom tier" (re: ruu, raimuki, koichi) who show that the characters definitely have the potential to dominate as hard as any "top tier" at a realistic level.

You are airborne but can't cancel to anything but jump or FD (slashback too?), so yes you would need to input 9 to TK.

http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showpost.php?p=225229&postcount=715

fixed.

Haha even TGS playing this game.

Characters you cannot ground gatling to j.D: Zappa, Jam, Millia, Bridget, Baiken only c.5s: ABA only f.5s: Robo-Ky, Chipp, Ky Easier to f.5s than c.5s: Anji, Sol, I-no 2D->j.D: May, Faust Everyone else use either c.5s or f.5s

f.5s actually makes ky, robo-ky, and chipp's hitboxes bigger than c.5s, allowing j.D to combo. Against ABA it's the opposite, you can only combo from c.5s and not f.5s. Just double-checked because I thought something was funny.

I covered that in what I quoted. I don't think you can actually be too close to land 5s->j.D anyways, you will just need to use c.5s f.5s for them and ABA. (less of a distance issue than what move you're comboing from) In general, you always want to be closer.

It is practical, and is often times her best option against a standing tall character. To do it is simply timing, using a joystick and double tapping can make it much easier, but there is nothing you can do to make your jump faster to allow j.D to come out sooner/lower. The only other thing you might be missing than timing is being too far away. As for exactly how many frames you have to do it, I would guess a window of 1-3 frames depending on who you're against/spacing. One thing to keep in mind is the timing on when you actually jump cancel from your 5s. It might be easier timing-wise if you do the jump cancel right before you actually do your j.D (without buffering your jump early, during the hitstop of your 5s), to make sure that the timing between your jump motion and j.D button press stays constant.

Oh, duh. Johnny is airborne during his dash. Jump cancelling out of it leaves him in airborne state which cannot be cancelled into ground anything. (the only way to cancel to ground moves from the air is when your character is considered on the ground- by hitting them immediately before landing or during jumping startup) So jump cancelling, even out of Johnny's dash, does not get rid of jump startup. You can tell because you can still cancel directly out of the startup frames to get superjumps without the super-jump animation. You just can't cancel into ground moves because he's considered off the ground to begin with. This is what allows Slayer's dash to cancel to ground specials and Johnny's not to- (and for proof) you can airthrow Johnny's dash, you can ground throw Slayer's.

Yet another example, 6462147S would give transport if you could cancel the startup of dash-jump to ground specials, but gives air killer joker instead

I don't think it's possible to cancel johnny's dash-jump to ground specials. Obvious example of this is do 412369H. It should cancel to coin, but obviously while dashing cancels to instant ensenga. (41236569 for ease)

guide: normals combos

Using low moves as an antiair is nothing new, if you think about it they arent much different than a typical high invuln anti-air

wtf tell me when you go

You are 90000x better off playing in training mode to perfect execution than playing against the cpu.

best* anji in the US *only

yeah this is in the guide, it's needed for dizzy may and bridget.

I have class until 10pm and picking up Spirit Juice from the airport around 11pm, maybe we'll stop by after I pick him up. Check the Evo thread for tourney info, most of us are driving up thursday mid-day.

Yeah, post it up before you go anywhere for sure. Most of us play at each other's houses rather than the arcade usually.