Leo7

Rachel vs Tager is 5-5.

Actually, if your 720 flashes before his super flash, you still win. Hotenjin has 6 frames of invincibility up till the super flash, and after the super flash it has 1 frame where it's not active and has no invincibility (this is why you see it trade with moves sometimes). If he does a Hotenjin in response to your 720 and you hold down your C button, he'll just get caught in the 720 due to that 1 non-invincible start-up frame. Example from an old vid of me: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZKh3JWRC7Y#t=2m28s

Don't worry I was being a smartass myself. Personally, I just try to get Kune magnetixed once. Either via spark, 5D, 2D, etc. (preferrably not Spark). Once he's magnetized he should be less willing to jump and less willing to press buttons on the ground. If you do 5D at good distances, you can sometimes CH him out of certain D moves (works especially well against random low to the ground j.D's, it'll trade in your favor). That said, don't spam 5D too much cause you'll get Fatal'd by the shark into 100% curse combo, or get hit by 3C. People also already mentioned the fact that Ara's anti-air has start up so if you mix-up your jump in timings you can sometimes beat the 5C (j.B and j.2C) though I personally just opt never to jump in on Arakune. Another unreliable method is super jump in, barrier block the eventual 5C, let him jump cancel it. At this point, if he's magnetized or if he jumps toward you unmagnetized, anti-air him (Collider or 2A). If he sees you empty jumping a lot, the Kune player will probably try to air grab you, so just make sure to react and tech the throw so you don't get cursed.

well, if you get in and keep the pressure on him from the beginning of the round, you'll never get cursed.

Goes by the name Jakuniku.

If you have magnetism, here are your go to combos after command grabs: 360A > 2B > Collider > Collider whiff > 6B > Collider > 5D 360B > 2B > 2C > Collider > 5D Also, in footsies, since 5C is going to be your best poke, there is actually a magic range where if the other Tager whiffs his 5C, you can counterpoke his 5C with your 5C and get a counterhit. Learn that range, cause you'll be spending a lot of time in that range.

Use Tager's 5B in footsies when fighting Ragna. If the Ragna does run in pressure, Tager's 5B can actually stuff Ragna's normals. If you see Ragna run in, throw out a 5B just before he reaches you, and if your 5B is active before Ragna's moves start up, it'll stuff their attack and you'll get a CH (and you can then combo into A-Sledge/5C/3C/etc.). I've used it to stuff dash in 5B/5C/2C/2B not sure about anything else. Edit: Another match-up tidbit. If you instant block Ragna's 2B, there's a 6+ frame gap in between 2B and any of his possible gatlings (2C/5C/3C = 6 frame gap and overhead 6b = 18 frame gap). This is a free 360B or a free Normal grab (has to be forward grab, not back grab). Normal grab has more range and is easier to input so I would say rely on that. Only thing you need to worry about is if he cancels the 2B into Inferno Divider (which would require massive yomi honestly).

You need to walk forward for the j.C whiff > j.B or the j.B will completely whiff even if you get it out on time. But yea, you need to advance input the j.B as well as the 5C to get them down consistently IMO. Once you learn to hold the buttons down, the combo becomes pretty easy to do, and the only thing you have to worry about is not getting out your j.C early enough. Adding in the extra 6A for some characters in the combo is really tight though, so I don't bother trying. BTW, speaking of fatal counter combos: 2C FC > 5C > 6B > 2C > 623C > JD (whiff) > lowest J2C > 2B > 236A > 5C > 6A > 2C > 623C > JC (whiff) > lowest J2C > 22D [4479] <-- with magnetism The above combo is kind of a bitch for me to do because of the j.D whiff timing, so I've been doing a little variation for similar damage. 2C FC > 5C > 6B > 2C > 623C > 623C (whiff) > 6C > J2C > 2B > 236A > 5C > 6A > 2C > 623C > 5D [4472] <-- with magnetism You can't end with Gadget since they'll tech before you can hit them with a sledge or lowest j.2C, so you lose gadget oki (not a big loss IMO),

I do j.C whiff > j.B combos consistently . I have more trouble doing the j.D whiff > lowest j.2C combos. Key to doing those combos consistently is advanced input again. Are you sure about this? How far do you have to walk for it to connect on Bang, cause I remember trying this combo before on Bang and consistently missing the 2B (keep in mind, you actually have to walk forward a bit on almost all the characters to get the 2B to connect). For what it's worth, that combo is taken from the Japanese wiki, which may not be entirely accurate.

As far as I know, he just goes by "SUB", doesn't really write his name in kana. Also, I think those SBO qualifier vids are the only videos available for him.

Hit kousaka up if you're going to Season's Beatings Henaki. Arakune/Tager match-up on the cab here is 8-2 for a reason :/

村松 is Muramatsu. 小路 is Kouji if you want to know that as well. Also, ouch Henaki :/

pretty sure every other character escapes 5a with a good reversal backdash.

Doesn't this mean Arakune is fucked once he's Gadget Finger'd? Since a non-held Gadget Finger seems to punish all his escape options aside from edit: just attacking (wth was I thinking earlier). Edit: Didn't read the second post. K you can only do it twice. Still good for mindgames I guess. Regardless, this is awesome. No more tk.Hotaru makes me really happy. Also, I'm not sure if people know this but a held 360B done immediately after Gadget will just straight up catch Bang out of his backdash.

4D and 5A hit him out of shark as well (but I find these to be unreliable). If you're getting hit by Fatal Counter shark a lot, I'd say don't press buttons too much, and just try to bait it like Isoroppia said.

Vids of the C-4 Block Final for SBO (the one that SUB's Tager won): http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11602039 http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm11602168 Also contains vids of Akira's Tager (who's also very good). There's also a bunch of vids of the preliminary qualifier (needed to enter the Block Final), which Akira's team won: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrhXOGiFnhA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2Z8eGxSUU4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zn0Xr30HfuQ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rIzsRYY4lM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mN8ErGSU08U Akira uses a black color. SUB uses a red color.

Not saying 4C isn't a good tool against Tager, but I'm just saying you can't be too predictable with it. All the things that I mentioned to beat 4C basically require you to be psychic, so yes, there's definitely a risk. I'm just saying in comparison to j.C, I can't really stuff j.C if I know it's coming (unless the Haku-Men player really fucks up the spacing). Edit: Though I guess the "predictable" thing tends to indicate a bad player.

For what it's worth, from experience, it's harder to do cross-up j.C set-ups on Tager since his hitbox is so wide (you need to jump farther to get the cross-up).

4D, 360A (at a distance), and a well spaced pre-emptive j.D or 5C all beat Haku's 4C. Haku's 4C is overrated, it's getting past j.C that's the problem. Edit: Also IMO, the IADs that Haku did seemed to be spaced in a manner where anti-air 2C might not have worked (but Collider probably would have worked). Also, when Haku has the stars, they'll almost always go for j.2C > Tsubaki to try to catch you blocking low. I saw you IB'd the j.2C and did a 360A, which whiffed through the animation of Tsubaki lol, but you can stuff the Tsubaki on start-up with Tager's 5A actually, and proceed to do CH 5A > 5C > Collider.

Update on this. I tested the combo: 2B / 6A > 2C > 623C > JC (whiff) > JB > 5C > 623C > JC (whiff) > lowest J2C > 22D [3417 / 3617] You can add a 6A after the 5C to increase the damage. If you start with 6A, it does 3730. Just a few notes - You have to walk forward a bit after the first collider for the following characters, otherwise 6A will whiff: Bang, Arakune, Jin, Ragna, Taokaka, Tager - You don't have to walk forward for Rachel - On Haku-men I cannot get the 6A to connect at all, so don't even try. On Lambda, Tager and Arakune you can do the following magnetismless combo for similar damage: 6A > 2C > 623C > JC (whiff) > lowest J2C > 2B > 623C > JC (whiff) > lowest J2C > 22D [3638] You need to walk forward a pixel when performing this on Lambda, otherwise the second collider will whiff. If you're having trouble with the j.B combos, the key to performing these consistently is to get the j.C out as soon as you jump and take advantage of BBCS's advanced input feature (i.e. 5 frame turbo). Hold B to get the j.B out and hold C a bit after your j.B comes out to make sure the 5C links properly.

Doesn't help that jumping is so strong in BB. A combination of: - air barrier being free - only select ground normals are air unblockable in BB - jump start-up being throw invincible (not to mention Tager's grabs are slower than the opponent's jump start-up frames, unless he's fighting another Tager) Means that Tager is SOL. Collider helps, but it can't really solve everything. As 4r5 pointed out, with the way they designed Tager, you might as well ask "why is BB fair?".

Hahaha, how do you punish up+back with Tager in BB? You either need to have them in the corner or magnetized (and you're not always guaranteed to punish it if they're magnetized either). There were many moments where I wish I had Guilty Gear air throws while playing BB.

Tager's normals are fine. They really buffed the block/hitstun and hitbox on a lot of his normals, and they all have a lot of priority. He can actually play a decent ground footsies game against most characters. IMO he just needs a slightly better anti-air. Tager's 2C is like Potemkin's 2HS, but what Tager really needs is Potemkin's 6P. 2A comes close, but still too situational.

Another Haku 4C counter that isn't mentioned in this thread (for those who are having trouble with 4C happy haku-mens): Psychic 5C can stuff Haku's 4C at a certain distance. Try to get within max 5C range, and hit the C button when you think the Haku player is going to throw out a 4C (basically you both have to do your attacks at nearly the same time or a bit earlier if you can). You'll score a CH and you can confirm into Spark/2D which gets you in your preferred range. If it isn't obvious by now, this match-up really tests your footsies/spacing.

Wow ... really? Another Tager player? No offense or anything. It's just getting kind of ridiculous how many Tagers there are in Toronto.